Help with a FY cushion choice (pics)

[mountainlion]

Hi all, I been lurking for a while and using what I've learned to come down to a couple fancy yellow cushion cut diamonds from different local vendors in my area. One vendor does only loose diamond sourcing (no inventory); the other is a retail jeweler in the area that has given me good pricing (I think) on a loose stone. This diamond will be for an e-ring. I was wondering if anyone could offer their opinions.

2.75ct FY Cushion, VVS2, 68% table, 67.9% depth, VG polish, Good Symmetry. Faint Fl. 7.71 x 7.66 x 5.20, GIA. Price: $19k.

This one I'm on my own for analyzing in person, it’s from the retail jeweler so of course they want to sell it. It certainly shows big! Color from the directly over the top down is good. The table on it is BIG compared to other cushions I’ve seen.

The main issue I have seen with this stone is when viewing it slight angles. It really seems to lose its color and sparkle and you can see through it. From my reading, judging windowing effect should be considered only when looking from the top down view as angles tend to show windows more, but the reality is, on a finger the diamond is going to be seen at various angles and the windowing seems bad to me, even at slight angles. The band we have picked out for either stone has an open head/prongs so, the effect will likely be more noticeable than a more closed basket type setting.

Below are some pictures of this stone and what I'm seeing. I realize pictures can be taken to make a diamond look amazing or completely awful. I think these did an ok job of actually representing some of what I’m seeing.









The poor sparkle and windowing views:





The price seemed very good. If you think this stone looks like it’s performing poorly then that’s all I need to hear…if I’m judging the windowing and light performance incorrectly and the diamond is great, that’s great too. I know pics only go so far, but I don’t know if I’m being overly critical. Thoughts and guidance on this stone are much appreciated. I can show my other top choice from the sourcing vendor as well. This one was 2.3 ct and has more of a crushed ice look with amazing sparkle. Much less windowing and it was analyzed and grading verified by the gemologist at the sourcing vendor. Thanks!

 

[Sunstorm]

Well, it is so hard to judge fancies by photos. That said in general while there is some color leakage the stone looks good from face up which is how you should evaluate fancy colors. The windowing you are seeing shows from the side, most fancy colors in this grade will show some from the back and/or sides, the color here is always graded face up. I honestly do not think this diamond looks so bad but I am also taking into account that the photos are not so great. Some photos actually show nice even color and a decent cut. I am generally very critical about fancy yellows as they are my specialty. What you do want for sure is a GIA report and preferably a laser inscription on the stone, in case of fancy colors this is very important. If the stone does not come with a GIA color origin report at the least, do not take it. It is of utmost importance to make sure the color is natural, though I do have to say that this is generally not the color that is a result of treatment. Yes definitely post pix of the other stone to compare. As I said do not consider any without a GIA report.

 

[sturgeon123456]

Well, it is so hard to judge fancies by photos. That said in general while there is some color leakage the stone looks good from face up which is how you should evaluate fancy colors. The windowing you are seeing shows from the side, most fancy colors in this grade will show some from the back and/or sides, the color here is always graded face up. I honestly do not think this diamond looks so bad but I am also taking into account that the photos are not so great. Some photos actually show nice even color and a decent cut. I am generally very critical about fancy yellows as they are my specialty. What you do want for sure is a GIA report and preferably a laser inscription on the stone, in case of fancy colors this is very important. If the stone does not come with a GIA color origin report at the least, do not take it. It is of utmost importance to make sure the color is natural, though I do have to say that this is generally not the color that is a result of treatment. Yes definitely post pix of the other stone to compare. As I said do not consider any without a GIA report.

It is GIA certified....The OP mentioned this.

Is the colour distribution even on the cert?

I collect fancy colored diamonds... I have many fancy yellows, intense yellows but mostly vivids. I have never seen this much windowing on a stone, as well as such a lack of color intensity in the affected areas, have you compared this next to another GIA fancy yellow to ensure that this isn't a borderline stone?

 

[mountainlion]

Thank you all for your replies!

The diamond above is GIA graded, but not lasered. All natural, even color and FY color. The report is a few years old and I asked the jeweler about this and they offered to have it expedite re-graded by GIA within a week (they have connections apparently to make this happen). I have no concerns about the specs other than verifying the clarity grading still meets VVS2 and no other major surface issues. I viewed this diamond under a microscope and while I'm a novice, it did look clean. There were some naturals and extra facet noted on the report, I assume to keep the 2.75 weight up.

I would say it is on the lower end of the FY range based on the others FY diamonds have looked at.


Here is diamond #2 which I was planning on going with last week until they brought in the big guy:

2.28 ct Fancy yellow even, VS2, 56% table, 69.3% depth, Ex Polish, VG Symmetry. Faint Fl. 7.57 x 7.00 x 4.84, GIA & inscribed, graded April 2014. Price: $17.5k

The vendor did a personal analysis to verify grading report and noted the following: Bright facet pattern and exceptional sparkle. No dark bowtie or facet areas, minimal window effect. Overall very clean diamond with nice even yellow.

It certainly has more of a crushed ice look. Vendor does not own the diamond, so I think they gave an honest report and approval of the stone. Dimensionally, it is more rectangular which I do like. Between the two I am absolutely going for quality/performance over the size. I can't say the big size of the first diamond is not a factor though

The vendor took these pictures, I think the blue background brings out the yellow a bit more than in a setting.





I took these, not great pics by any means. I have the larger versions and can host else where if it helps.








I have seen approximately 15 yellow diamonds between the two vendors and it more or less has come down to these two. Unfortunately I'm a little bit under a time crunch to get the band made for the stone I pick, otherwise I'd keep viewing options and would have like to look at more intense yellows. I have seen 5 intense yellows and loved the color, but this diamond above won out price wise and performance.

I am leaning towards this smaller stone due to the great performance. I don't mind the crushed ice, and again the sparkle is awesome. I just want to make sure I'm not being overly critical of the first stone. I think I will go see these stones again back to back tomorrow, I saw them 3 days apart and unfortunately I probably won't be able to see them together at the same time.

Happy to provide larger pictures if the smaller ones are not helping (PS is downsizing them).
Thanks again!

 

[sturgeon123456]

Thank you all for your replies!

The diamond above is GIA graded, but not lasered. All natural, even color and FY color. The report is a few years old and I asked the jeweler about this and they offered to have it expedite re-graded by GIA within a week (they have connections apparently to make this happen). I have no concerns about the specs other than verifying the clarity grading still meets VVS2 and no other major surface issues. I viewed this diamond under a microscope and while I'm a novice, it did look clean. There were some naturals and extra facet noted on the report, I assume to keep the 2.75 weight up.

I would say it is on the lower end of the FY range based on the others FY diamonds have looked at.


Here is diamond #2 which I was planning on going with last week until they brought in the big guy:

2.28 ct Fancy yellow even, VS2, 56% table, 69.3% depth, Ex Polish, VG Symmetry. Faint Fl. 7.57 x 7.00 x 4.84, GIA & inscribed, graded April 2014. Price: $17.5k

The vendor did a personal analysis to verify grading report and noted the following: Bright facet pattern and exceptional sparkle. No dark bowtie or facet areas, minimal window effect. Overall very clean diamond with nice even yellow.

It certainly has more of a crushed ice look. Vendor does not own the diamond, so I think they gave an honest report and approval of the stone. Dimensionally, it is more rectangular which I do like. Between the two I am absolutely going for quality/performance over the size. I can't say the big size of the first diamond is not a factor though

The vendor took these pictures, I think the blue background brings out the yellow a bit more than in a setting.





I took these, not great pics by any means. I have the larger versions and can host else where if it helps.








I have seen approximately 15 yellow diamonds between the two vendors and it more or less has come down to these two. Unfortunately I'm a little bit under a time crunch to get the band made for the stone I pick, otherwise I'd keep viewing options and would have like to look at more intense yellows. I have seen 5 intense yellows and loved the color, but this diamond above won out price wise and performance.

I am leaning towards this smaller stone due to the great performance. I don't mind the crushed ice, and again the sparkle is awesome. I just want to make sure I'm not being overly critical of the first stone. I think I will go see these stones again back to back tomorrow, I saw them 3 days apart and unfortunately I probably won't be able to see them together at the same time.

Happy to provide larger pictures if the smaller ones are not helping (PS is downsizing them).
Thanks again!

Once again with fancies It is so hard to tell from pictures but I would say the smaller one looks very nice and based on the pictures more is more appealing. Small table looks nice on that stone as well....I often don't see such small tables on the fancy coloured diamonds.

Also most fancy cushions that I have seen are cushion modified brilliant (not cushion brilliant) and they all have the crushed ice look. It seems to be a cut that retains/brings out colour so most of the fancies are some sort of square or cushion modified brilliant. If you find other shapes i.e. asscher, round or even princess, they command more money for same size and quality. I have an oval fancy coloured diamond and it is faceted with the crushed ice appearance lol

Anyway I would always sacrifice size for a better colour and more appealing stone plus the difference in dimensions are so small I bet once set you could barely notice a difference.

 

[mountainlion]

Thank you Sturgeon!

Yes, they are both modified brilliant (second one with more sharp edges). The cushion was a requirement, so that made shape choice easy. You are very right in the similar sizing as well: the 2.28 ct@ 7.57x7.00x4.85 and the 2.75 @ 7.71x7.66x5.20. We're just getting a wider and deeper diamond with the heavier stone.

I have had a couple female friends look at the pictures and they all seem to gravitate towards the smaller stone even before they know the weights. Mostly due to the color. This was my gut choice too, but since I'm not buying an inexpensive diamond, I wanted to get some knowledgeable and unbiased opinions.

I wish I could do more for the pictures, but at the end of the day I realize the fancy colored stones just need to be seen in person. Even though the bigger diamond was very nice from the top down, the windowing on it bothered me in the store. The size/price kind of put the judgement blinders on me hoping it would perform better. Maybe this stone would look best in a full 18k yellow basket with halo around it. I don't think it's going to work well in a solitaire type setting.

I will try to look at both one after the other tomorrow and go from there. Appreciate your thoughts and welcome more!

 

[Sunstorm]

Dear OP, I think your second choice has a very appealing shape and pretty even color especially on the photo without flash where it shows the pattern and table area off well. On the other photos I see color leakage in other areas than in the other stone as well as near the edges where it is present in both. It is very hard to find such even color in a lighter fancy yellow like them where there will be almost no color leakage, although it can be possible. Again it could be only the photos or the photos emphasizing something you barely see IRL. What I like to see in fancies and recommend to most people is the most even color and also a nice cut.

Yes, many can be crushed ice but there are vendors recommended here that have fancy yellows cut with chunkier facets as well. You may want to check out those options if this is what you like or may prefer, many do. I am not sure what area you live in but as a trade member I cannot personally recommend you other vendors but some of the nice people here may.

The reason I recommended lasering is because then you can positively identify that the stone you are considering is indeed the one the certificate is for especially if you are concerned about the color not being as saturated as it should be in your opinion, of course even within the fancy grade there is quite a wide range too with some bordering on intense and some on FLY. You can also identify stones based on their inclusions but that can be next to impossible for you in a stone with very high clarity. Another option would be to check the dimensions of the stone in question against the dimensions on the certificate.

An older certificate may or may not mean anything. We have seen that GIA has been grading color in fancies more strictly recently, which means that some of the FY graded in the recent years could have been graded intense in previous years which can also mean that with an older certificate the stone may be graded FLY today. I see a lot of discrepancies in fancy certificates and often considered regrading when in doubt. You are right that if you are seeing windowing and would like an open setting it may not be the best option. For my personal wear I tend to gravitate towards the lighter lemony yellows but I still like even color. Many on this forum own gorgeous FLY and even the low letter grades and vendors recommended here carry some stunning examples, there you may see more uneven color and still get a beautiful stone but the price should reflect that. Keep us posted!

 

[sturgeon123456]

Thank you Sturgeon!

Yes, they are both modified brilliant (second one with more sharp edges). The cushion was a requirement, so that made shape choice easy. You are very right in the similar sizing as well: the 2.28 ct@ 7.57x7.00x4.85 and the 2.75 @ 7.71x7.66x5.20. We're just getting a wider and deeper diamond with the heavier stone.



I have had a couple female friends look at the pictures and they all seem to gravitate towards the smaller stone even before they know the weights. Mostly due to the color. This was my gut choice too, but since I'm not buying an inexpensive diamond, I wanted to get some knowledgeable and unbiased opinions.

I wish I could do more for the pictures, but at the end of the day I realize the fancy colored stones just need to be seen in person. Even though the bigger diamond was very nice from the top down, the windowing on it bothered me in the store. The size/price kind of put the judgement blinders on me hoping it would perform better. Maybe this stone would look best in a full 18k yellow basket with halo around it. I don't think it's going to work well in a solitaire type setting.

I will try to look at both one after the other tomorrow and go from there. Appreciate your thoughts and welcome more!

To be 100% honest after looking again the smaller one (although still a big rock) looks beautiful and that small table is just gorgeous, I would go for that one if it looks nice in person for sure, the first one looks lifeless in the photos and the windowing is pretty drastic. Totally keep us posted with which way you go and it's so nice to see more fancy yellows my personal favourite!

 

[mountainlion]

Thanks again to both you for your advice and assistance! My gut told me the 2nd diamond was the right one all along, but I'm glad I was able to see a lot of options. I think my pictures exaggerated some of the windowing in the 2nd stone, but I trust the vendors analysis and seeing it in person it looked even better. The vendor took some nice pictures and even sent me a pic of the GIA laser inscription which I also saw under the microscope. Most of all, I simply have a lot of confidence in this diamond and the vendor. I don't think they are on PS, but several folks have used them here and reported great experiences.

Here is a larger picture of the table shot they took as well as the setting we'll be using. Everyone I have worked with has highly recommended going with 18k yellow for the head. I initially was concerned about contrast with the white gold, but after looking at some of the work on DBL's website, I have no worries that it will look great. The yellow gold holder I had in some of those shots really made the diamond pop. The vendor told me that if my SO did not like the look we could always get the prongs rhodium coated to match the white.







I will keep everyone posted and have some pics of the final product once it's set.

Best Regards!

 

[Sunstorm]

OP, I also always use yellow gold for the setting of fancy yellows and white for the rest of the design; the yellow gold emphasizes the color of the stone and matches better than white gold or plat in my opinion. It is not really necessary with more saturated yellows but I still thinks then the prongs look more flush with the stone. I also normally have a crown/basket holding the stone. I think your significant other should like it but as you said if not by any chance then you can still have it plated.It is pretty common practice to do two colors of metals for fancies; for pinks the setting is often rose gold to bring out the pink tone and then the rest of the design is either white gold or plat. It should come out beautiful to do two tone this way.

 

[mountainlion]

That makes sense. I looked at several intense yellows in the setting and noticed they really didn't "need" the yellow gold to bring out more color, but the white prong tips definitely contrasted with stone. This was the only detail that my SO didn't pick out in the ring, but it's minor and if it's a problem, it can be fixed.

 

[chrono]

Congrats on your choice; I would go with the smaller one as well. If possible, I would go with yellow gold prongs but white metal ring. The yellow gold prongs help amp up the colouration and the white metal shank gives it that contrast pop.

 

[mountainlion]

Just giving an update - I purchased the 2.3 ct stone last week and am waiting on the ring to be completed! Here are a couple more new pictures of the diamond and a video of it in action, I'm confident I made the right choice and can't stop looking at it. The scintillation in it is great!

Video

Pics:

 

[Travelgal]

Love the shape and color of your stone. Can't wait for you to post the final product!

 

[Sunstorm]

Lovely, great decision! Absolutely nice color and shape. Cannot wait to see what the finished ring looks like, keep us posted please.

 

[mountainlion]

Thanks for the warm comments all! I will keep everyone posted when the ring is completed (couple weeks)!

A little late to the thread, but here is an ASET as well :

 

[Gypsy]

ASET is underwhelming, but these stones aren't cut for that. They are cut for color. It's a beautiful stone.

 

[chrono]

Very few FCDs are cut for ideal light return so I wouldn't sweat over the ASET. If the colour is great (FCDs are cut to concentrate as much colour as possible) and it sparkles well to you, that's what matters.

 

[mountainlion]

Ring has finally arrived..turned out even better than I imagined. The yellow gold prongs helped bring out even more color and look very nice, couldn't be happier!

 

[telephone89]

Beautiful! Cant wait for handshots!

 

[mountainlion]

a few more...

Thanks again for everyone's help!

 

[Rockdiamond]

Congrats Mountainlion- looks really nice!
The ASET looks excellent to me. Well cut FCD's are cut for sparkle, and color as you can see

 

[noscrusir]

It looks beautiful Congrats!

 

[Gypsy]

Oh my. Now that is a gorgeous ring. WOW.

Anyone would be thrilled with how beautiful that turned out. I absolutely love the color of the yellow diamond. And the split shank setting is quite lovely.

May I ask the vendor? Just curious if you don't mind.

 

[tyty333]

Realllly beautiful!

 

[mountainlion]

Oh my. Now that is a gorgeous ring. WOW.

Anyone would be thrilled with how beautiful that turned out. I absolutely love the color of the yellow diamond. And the split shank setting is quite lovely.

May I ask the vendor? Just curious if you don't mind.

Hi Gypsy, not at all... and thanks for the compliments!

The diamond was purchased through Diamond Source of Virginia. I'll plug them here a bit if that's ok - it's a smaller husband and wife run business and I couldn't have been happier with their service, expertise and guidance through the purchasing process. They've been in my area for a good number of years and the husband is a GIA graduated gemologist. They had an ASET, ideal scope, and a few other gadgets on their microscope/inspection desk, so this was a good sign when I first went to their offices. They don't own any inventory - I thought their prices were very competitive and opinions neutral in terms of selling. I had several stones shipped in to see in person out of about 15 that we narrowed down from numbers/owner description that they originally sourced. From those, this one was best overall.

The band was custom made by Natalie K which I purchased separately through an authorized dealer who then set the stone. My FTB and I saw it almost a year ago and she picked it out and really liked it, so I kept note and here we are today.

I have a few pics of the ring on my hand, but it won't be presented for another week or so.

 

[Sunstorm]

Stunning! I love both the color and cut of the yellow, some of your photos show the stone off really well, I bet it is even nicer IRL. I agree that a good FCD can have great color and cut too. The setting came out very nice as well. Congratulations, yes please when you can, do post hand shots.

 

[MelisendeDiamonds]

ASET is underwhelming

I'd say the exact opposite. For colored diamonds one is looking for a different ASET appearance. Instead of edge to edge red which is sought for colorless diamonds in Fancy colors(like yellow) one is looking for a uniform mix of Green/White and an absence of large patches of Red, Blue, or White.

There is some lack of resolution under the table which makes it difficult to interpret in that region but otherwise I'd say this was a very good ASET for a colored diamond.

The common goal for Fancy colored diamonds, is uniform color, even sparkles from edge to edge and the absence of harsh contrast. I would say this diamond is cut very well for achieving those goals and the ASET confirms this.

 

[chrono]

A stunning ring! Congratulations on a ring well done.

 

[canuk-gal]

HI:

HOLY. MOLY. It is yellow, but I am green.

Please provide hand pictures of that stunner.

cheers--Sharon