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Diamond Appearance In Sunlight & Over Time

alpackie

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 25, 2014
Messages
146
I decided to make a new thread since you lovely scopers settled the initial questions! Here's the old thread.

So the BF and I just got back from looking at sparkly things!! This is going to be a really long post so please bear with me!

My overall impression of the experience was fabulous. We spoke with Leslie from this Seattle-area B&M store. She's been around the industry for 30+ years and is blunt and honest (just my style)! I didn't get any sort of snobby uptight vibe from her at all--especially since my BF and I are more of the nerdy outdoorsy type rather than the luxury jewelry type. The store itself is a fortress; it felt super secure being inside and knowing that if you leave your stuff there for cleaning that it's safe.

Simplest things first: the setting! They didn't have a sample of the specific Danhov setting (CL140) that I was looking for, but they had the 4-prong version of it. I tried it on and apparently I'm a ring size 6.5. Regarding the setting:
-the width of the setting was perfect
-petal prongs looked delicate but substantial
-cathedral shanks were connected to the actual prongs for added security of the diamond
-Leslie mentioned that someone with a similar setting brought in their ring to be cleaned recently and they were not able to get all the way around the diamond. The diamond was set too low and too close to the metal, so the brush couldn't get in. (What's the point of buying a diamond if it can't be cleaned properly right?) Aesthetically, Leslie said that the setting was squashed and should set the diamond higher up on the finger (BF agreed wholeheartedly :lol: ). Also reassured me the minute difference she's suggesting wouldn't make the diamond any more prone to me banging it around :rodent: She also said 8 prongs would be overkill (6 prongs would be plenty) and suggested that she contact Danhov to make the necessary adjustments. I expressed some concern about getting a "custom" setting that would not be covered under an warranty, but she said not to worry about it and that she'd take care of it.
-They quoted a price similar to the online price, but seemed like there was wiggle room, AND seemed interested in what JA will quote me for.

As for the diamond! I already knew my eyesight was bad, but not THAT bad. Keeping in mind we were in an indoor jewelry store setting, I seriously could not spot any major differences in either color or clarity. Things that have been decided on:
Cut: H&A. (she hasn't heard of HCA)
Carat: 1.23 (+/- .2)
Fluor: faint/none (Leslie doesn't even accept any med/strongs from her suppliers. Apparently she's really against fluor!)
Things in question!
Color: G/H/I??? She showed me a couple of H's and I couldn't even tell the difference between G and H! They quoted me a $700/c difference between G/H.
*****Question 1: Would I be able to tell the difference between a G/H/I in sunlight?
Clarity: VS1-2/SI1-2??? (whichever clarity, must be eye-clean) I was staring at some SI2s with various inclusions and I could see them under the i-scope but to the naked eye I couldn't see anything beyond the sparkle! (Although the BF's eyesight is way better and he said he could tell). And in what situation is anyone (even me) going to have the diamond half an inch from their eye tilting it back and forth (ON A HAND) trying to look for inclusions? :lol:
*****Question 2: How does the appearance of a diamond change as it is worn for longer and accumulates more oils/grime? (I.E. Does an "H" diamond look more yellow? Are previously unseen inclusions more prominent?)

One of the rocks she showed me:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B0cE_e-CRLmDUW9ybnhoZGFXNlE/edit?usp=sharing
Lazare Kaplan (I guess that's a really big deal, and the price reflects that)
1.22c
H
SI2
GIA Excellent
HCA: 1.6
$8341

Feeling a bit overwhelmed with the whole situation (in a good way), and feeling REALLY nice that my eyesight isn't super sharp :naughty: Will add more to the thread as it comes to me!

ETA: Leslie didn't want any deposit from us for her to go out and get some stones with the specs we were looking for. So we aren't "locked-in" with buying from this specific vendor.
 

Dancing Fire

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 3, 2004
Messages
33,852
The price sounds fair for a LK.
 

alpackie

Shiny_Rock
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Aug 25, 2014
Messages
146
Dancing Fire|1409443795|3742155 said:
The price sounds fair for a LK.
Is it just in the name? Or is there something about it that makes it better than other H&A Ideal cuts?
 

Dancing Fire

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Messages
33,852
alpackie|1409444261|3742160 said:
Dancing Fire|1409443795|3742155 said:
The price sounds fair for a LK.
Is it just in the name? Or is there something about it that makes it better than other H&A Ideal cuts?
Did you view the stone under a H&A scope?
 

alpackie

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 25, 2014
Messages
146
Dancing Fire|1409444575|3742166 said:
Did you view the stone under a H&A scope?
Yea, checked out for me. Looked completely symmetrical.
 

alpackie

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 25, 2014
Messages
146
Also Leslie was pushing hard for a Forevermark diamond, mainly for the "clean conscious" that they offer. She said there was a price premium on some, starting from 1-3%.

Apparently they don't all come with GIA cert either, they come with "Forevermark" cert. Not really sure on that but I'd have to read up some more...
 

alpackie

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 25, 2014
Messages
146
I've been researching policies of various online vendors and JA seems to be the most generous. All other sites have a limited "no questions asked" return policy, but charge shipping.

So looking at 1.2-1.25c G-H VS1-2/SI1 stones, I came across this one: http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.22-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-73772

Everything seems to check out except for the inclusion right in the center. I'm guessing the feathers/needles at the edges would not pose a durability risk as they are not clustered all together. I put in a request for a JA gemologist to check out the inclusion in the table, and they preferred I give them a different stone to compare it to (so I picked this random comparable one: http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.22-carat-h-color-si1-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-73678).

Should I wait for JA to get more stones with comparable specs in stock before placing a hold on the original one? If that one doesn't pan out I have no more options to switch to.
 

OoohShiny

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 25, 2014
Messages
8,228
New stones come onto the market all the time so you shouldn't necessarily feel 'pushed' into a decision if you have time to spare. You can use the extra time to save some additional money and reading the forum to learn as much as you can :)


alpackie|1409445956|3742177 said:
Also Leslie was pushing hard for a Forevermark diamond, mainly for the "clean conscious" that they offer. She said there was a price premium on some, starting from 1-3%.

Apparently they don't all come with GIA cert either, they come with "Forevermark" cert. Not really sure on that but I'd have to read up some more...
I would stay away from any grading that is not AGS or GIA - they are the two market giants (well, GIA is the giant, AGS is the perfectionist upstart minnow :tongue: :D ) and are a better guarantee of cut and colour (and future value) than any other 'certificate'.
 

Texas Leaguer

Ideal_Rock
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Messages
3,615
Alpackie,
In answer to one of your original questions, yes - buildup of oils and dirt will change the appearance of a diamond over time. It is therefore important to practice good habits with regard to keeping them clean. The usual trouble spot for home cleaning is the pavilion that can be hard to reach. Ultrasonic and steam is the surefire way to get them squeaky clean. You can get this service from any good jeweler - many will do it for free. You can also buy high quality home cleaning products that will do a great job.

Choosing a precision cut diamond will greatly help the diamond to continue perform under duress, but they too will suffer. Dirt and film will also conspire with inclusions to reduce light performance. Make sure the diamond you buy is crisp and bright to begin with. This is particularly important when shopping for lower clarity grades.
 

alpackie

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 25, 2014
Messages
146
OoohShiny said:
New stones come onto the market all the time so you shouldn't necessarily feel 'pushed' into a decision if you have time to spare. You can use the extra time to save some additional money and reading the forum to learn as much as you can :)

I would stay away from any grading that is not AGS or GIA - they are the two market giants (well, GIA is the giant, AGS is the perfectionist upstart minnow :tongue: :D ) and are a better guarantee of cut and colour (and future value) than any other 'certificate'.
Thank you for your advice! I am definitely going to pump the brakes a bit and take my time to make a decision (it's a big one, don't wanna regret it later)! :naughty:

Texas Leaguer said:
Alpackie,
In answer to one of your original questions, yes - buildup of oils and dirt will change the appearance of a diamond over time. It is therefore important to practice good habits with regard to keeping them clean. The usual trouble spot for home cleaning is the pavilion that can be hard to reach. Ultrasonic and steam is the surefire way to get them squeaky clean. You can get this service from any good jeweler - many will do it for free. You can also buy high quality home cleaning products that will do a great job.

Choosing a precision cut diamond will greatly help the diamond to continue perform under duress, but they too will suffer. Dirt and film will also conspire with inclusions to reduce light performance. Make sure the diamond you buy is crisp and bright to begin with. This is particularly important when shopping for lower clarity grades.
The B&M jeweler is afraid the setting I'm interested in is too squashed--making the diamond difficult to clean. Thanks for answering my original question!
 

Texas Leaguer

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 27, 2009
Messages
3,615
alpackie|1409784669|3744330 said:
Texas Leaguer said:
Alpackie,
In answer to one of your original questions, yes - buildup of oils and dirt will change the appearance of a diamond over time. It is therefore important to practice good habits with regard to keeping them clean. The usual trouble spot for home cleaning is the pavilion that can be hard to reach. Ultrasonic and steam is the surefire way to get them squeaky clean. You can get this service from any good jeweler - many will do it for free. You can also buy high quality home cleaning products that will do a great job.

Choosing a precision cut diamond will greatly help the diamond to continue perform under duress, but they too will suffer. Dirt and film will also conspire with inclusions to reduce light performance. Make sure the diamond you buy is crisp and bright to begin with. This is particularly important when shopping for lower clarity grades.
The B&M jeweler is afraid the setting I'm interested in is too squashed--making the diamond difficult to clean. Thanks for answering my original question!
Things such as lifestyle and ease of cleaning are important considerations when choosing a design. Looks like your jeweler is thinking ahead and has your best interest at heart.
 
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