Are these inclusions normal for an SI2?

[morganlover]

I just purchased a pre-loved AVC. Overall I'm very happy with it, but I'm curious why it's relatively easy for me to spot the inclusions. It was sold to me as being eye-clean, and also I thought SI2's were supposed to require magnification to see inclusions? Since it's an AVC it's graded by AGS, and it's my understanding they're pretty strict. I can see the inclusions from about 10 inches away in the right light - they're tiny but I can spot them. Pictures (I added circles around the inclusions):

The main/easiest one to see - a black speck right on top.


Sometimes I can also see a lighter cloud.


I guess my question is whether this is normal/expected for an SI2 grading? This is my first diamond purchase so I'm going off reading and research rather than experience. I know I won't be able to see them while I'm wearing it on my hand, so I'm fine with their existence as long as this is normal/acceptable for an SI2.

Thanks for the help!

 

[Diamondbug]

Some SI1 and SI2 are eye clean and some not. I had an I1 with a fairly sized white feather that was closer to the edge that was 100% eye clean. Recently on my hunt for a MRB, I inquired about a VS2 that came back as not eye clean. It had a couple dark/black crystal that you can clearly see. I guess it all depends on the kind of inclusion. I ended with an SI2 that has tiny white crystals that is 100% eye clean from all angles.I think the GIA gemologist that graded it was having a bad day so graded it harshly It was a good thing for me coz it brought the $$ down.

 

[Niel]

It is pretty common for an si2 to have visible inclusions


Are you asking because you think, in your opinion, it would have been graded an I?

 

[luvsdmb]

If it was sold to you as "eye-clean" I would seriously have a problem with this.

 

[ecf8503]

From the AGS website: "Slightly Included diamonds with a clarity grade of 5 or 6 (SI1 or SI2) have noticeable inclusions that are fairly easy to see under 10x magnification. Sometimes, these inclusions can be visible to the unaided eye."

I'm not surprised you can see the inclusions; and SI2 isn't guaranteed to be eye clean, and what is easily visible to you may not be to others (perhaps you have more keen eyesight?).

 

[marymm]

It also depends on your definition of eye-clean - my personal definition of eyeclean is nothing visible from 6 inches top and sides - but most vendors define eyeclean from the top position only. I could not find GOG's eyeclean definition on their website, but here are some from other vendors:

WF definition: "No inclusions visible to the naked eye of a person with 20/20 vision when viewing the diamond in the face-up position at a distance of approximately 10 inches under normal overhead lighting." http://www.whiteflash.com/about-diamonds/faq/

JA definition: " 'Eye-Clean' is a term used to describe a diamond that is clean to an unaided eye in a face-up position from a distance of 8 to 10 inches. Diamonds of VS2 or higher in quality will usually be eye-clean. Diamonds of Si1, Si2 and I1 need to be visually inspected to determine whether any inclusions are visible from the top." http://www.jamesallen.com/faq/

BGD definition: " 'Eye-Clean' is a term used to describe a diamond which has no visible inclusions to the unaided eye of a person with 20/20 vision at a distance of 8 to 10 inches in the face-up position in natural daylight. Diamonds that are clarity graded either SI1 or SI2 need to be visually inspected to determine whether any inclusions are visible from the top." http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/home/need-help-faq/


eta: personally, I tend to regard SI2 stones are having visible flaws due to my personal definition of eyeclean (6" away top+sides). If I were buying an SI2 stone, I'd specifically ask if it meets my eyeclean definition and (sorry, too late for you I know) I would not buy an SI2 stone without a return policy.

 

[luvsdmb]

It also depends on your definition of eye-clean - my personal definition of eyeclean is nothing visible from 6 inches top and sides - but most vendors define eyeclean from the top position only. I could not find GOG's eyeclean definition on their website, but here are some from other vendors:

WF definition: "No inclusions visible to the naked eye of a person with 20/20 vision when viewing the diamond in the face-up position at a distance of approximately 10 inches under normal overhead lighting." http://www.whiteflash.com/about-diamonds/faq/

JA definition: " 'Eye-Clean' is a term used to describe a diamond that is clean to an unaided eye in a face-up position from a distance of 8 to 10 inches. Diamonds of VS2 or higher in quality will usually be eye-clean. Diamonds of Si1, Si2 and I1 need to be visually inspected to determine whether any inclusions are visible from the top."

BGD definition: " 'Eye-Clean' is a term used to describe a diamond which has no visible inclusions to the unaided eye of a person with 20/20 vision at a distance of 8 to 10 inches in the face-up position in natural daylight. Diamonds that are clarity graded either SI1 or SI2 need to be visually inspected to determine whether any inclusions are visible from the top."


eta: personally, I tend to regard SI2 stones are having visible flaws due to my personal definition of eyeclean (6" away top+sides). If I were buying an SI2 stone, I'd specifically ask if it meets my eyeclean definition and (too late for you I know) I would not buy an SI2 stone without a return policy.

This is an excellent point. To me "eye clean" is no visible flaw seen with my eyes from any distance. I once asked a vendor and she did inform me of the 10 inch rule, which I was thankful for. This should have been told to you before you bought it so you didn't have any surprises that the diamond really isn't eye clean. Are you able to return it?

 

[morganlover]

Thank you everyone this has been very helpful! I am able to return the stone (minus fees and shipping) but I'm not sure if I want to go that route. I paid 3900 for the stone (which is a 1.16 K) and I haven't seen anything I think I would like more in my price range of 4k. If I went with a higher clarity stone I'm sure I would have to compromise on size. I feel like that would affect my enjoyment of the stone more than these inclusions. And I doubt I could find a comparable AVC in this price range, and AVCs have been my dream stone for a long time. But I would love y'alls opinions on that.

It does sound like it fits the definition of SI2 while it may or may not be eye clean according to different definitions.

 

[luvsdmb]

Is it possible when you have the setting made that the prong will cover the inclusion?

 

[morganlover]

I think the one in the bottom right will be covered, but not the one in the center. I did notice that if that inclusion is at the bottom of the stone (so closer to my palm) it's harder to see because of the way the light hits it when I hold it in front of my face. So I will probably ask them to set it that way.

I feel silly worrying about this because the specks are seriously so tiny .. like a pinprick or even smaller. Just want to make sure it's a good choice.

 

[Niel]

I think the one in the bottom right will be covered, but not the one in the center. I did notice that if that inclusion is at the bottom of the stone (so closer to my palm) it's harder to see because of the way the light hits it when I hold it in front of my face. So I will probably ask them to set it that way.

I feel silly worrying about this because the specks are seriously so tiny .. like a pinprick or even smaller. Just want to make sure it's a good choice.

let me ask you, over time, will you get more used to it or more annoyed by it?

 

[Tekate]

Hello - I bought a 1.33 K VS2 AVC from GOG at more than double what you paid for your stone... my first choice was a G S1 stone I think that was 1.45 .. but blown up as our pictures are I I could see a black spot under the top table.. so I asked David if it was eye clean and he said he thought it was but MY viewing of the occlusion may be different, it was a cheaper stone than the one I bought but I noticed that GOG certifies their stone GOG EYECLEAN when they are eye clean to the company/store.. since I lived in Texas and they are out on the Island I decided to go with the VS2 eyeclean stone. First stone may have been fine for me.. but I didn't feel like sending back and forth etc... so I bought my stone in my avatar.. I love my stone, I love my pendant and I would recommend GOG anytime, the price you are receiving for your stone seems very good given my history.. but as others have said and I think right, will it bother you more as time goes on? to me they look very small... if you keep it how do you plan on setting it? you have gorgeous stones btw.

regards,

I think the one in the bottom right will be covered, but not the one in the center. I did notice that if that inclusion is at the bottom of the stone (so closer to my palm) it's harder to see because of the way the light hits it when I hold it in front of my face. So I will probably ask them to set it that way.

I feel silly worrying about this because the specks are seriously so tiny .. like a pinprick or even smaller. Just want to make sure it's a good choice.

 

[morganlover]

let me ask you, over time, will you get more used to it or more annoyed by it?

My instinct is that I won't think about it anymore. I feel a bit worried when looking at blown up pics or just thinking about it in general but then when I get it back out and actually look at it on my hand, I'm like "Oh yeah you're beautiful!" Hopefully I can grow to think of the inclusions as little bits of personality and a remembrance that my stone came from the earth.

 

[WinkHPD]

If it was sold to you as "eye-clean" I would seriously have a problem with this.

Not every one's eyes are the same. What may have been completely eye clean to the sales rep that our OP talked to is obviously not eye clean to him. I once had a client who could see, from across the desk, VS2 inclusions that neither his fiance' or I could see, even with close examination.

Many of us learned at GIA back in the 70's that eye visible was I1 or worse. We had to relearn that when GIA itself told us that this was not, and never had been, true. Of course, telling GIA that this is what they taught us in my 1975 class was met with a firm, "No, it is not." They did not actually say, neener neener neener, but I heard it loud and clear...

Wink

 

[Niel]

let me ask you, over time, will you get more used to it or more annoyed by it?

My instinct is that I won't think about it anymore. I feel a bit worried when looking at blown up pics or just thinking about it in general but then when I get it back out and actually look at it on my hand, I'm like "Oh yeah you're beautiful!" Hopefully I can grow to think of the inclusions as little bits of personality and a remembrance that my stone came from the earth.

I had said this in another thread of yours, but - I had an eye visible inclusion in a mq ring I had purchased. I could see it when I looked. But on the hand it is not noticeable. I know this as I gifted it to my mother for her birthday last year. Anytime I look at it on her hand all I see is sparkle. And she is in her mid 50s with 50 year old eyes, and it doesn't bother her.

I made the determination that the price size and sparkle more than made up for its beauty mark.

But that's something you'll want to decide before your return period is up.

 

[pyramid]

SI1 and SI2 stones can by eye visible. When I first started reading the web back in the 90s, everything said if it was visible it was an I1, I believed that until it became more common place that this was not true and that even an SI1 could be visible to some folk. Some say the grading has relaxed but as Wink says, GIA are not saying this.

Sometimes it is good to go for middle ground, get SI1 instead or VS2 if you want to be totally sure. I think though an SI2 will not be noticed by you once the newness wears off.

 

[Gypsy]

Inclusions are harder to spot with faceting that results in small fast moving facets, like a princess. They are easier to spot in larger slower facets like those of an EC or an Asscher (which is why we recommend VS2 and above for these diamonds as SI stones are very rarely eyeclean). The AVC is not as 'bad' as a step cut for showing inclusions but it is considerably worse than a round brilliant. So you really have to be careful when looking at stones with larger slower facets to check with a gemologist to see how eyeclean each individual stone is.