Is Donald Trump Actually Ill?

[ame]

His behavior/speech seems perfectly in line with my experience with narcissists. The very fragile self esteem thing makes a lot of sense to me. He may not have the personality disorder, but my husband likes to say that nobody truly sane runs for president.

More about narcissistic personality disorder: http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/narcissistic-personality-disorder/basics/definition/con-20025568

This is obvious, but I have told my husband several times that I would not be the least bit shocked if he has early onset Alzheimers. Many of his behaviors and many of the things he says are consistent with how many of my family members with the same condition have behaved and spoken.

 

[ruby59]

This thread is about Trump and how absolutely wild his speech is. No one else in public life speaks the way he does.
____________________________________________________

Trump is not a politician. He speaks off the cuff. He says the first thing that comes to mind. He has no filter or off switch.

Have you ever heard a politician who thinks his microphone is off and says something controversial? Well Trump does it with the mike on.

That has always been his style, so I do not see anything different here.

And that is what endears him to a lot of people out there.

 

[AnnaH]

This thread is about Trump and how absolutely wild his speech is. No one else in public life speaks the way he does.
____________________________________________________

Trump is not a politician. He speaks off the cuff. He says the first thing that comes to mind. He has no filter or off switch.

Have you ever heard a politician who thinks his microphone is off and says something controversial? Well Trump does it with the mike on.

That has always been his style, so I do not see anything different here.

And that is what endears him to a lot of people out there.

Makes sense, Ruby, and didn't require any armchair psychiatry.

 

[redwood66]

This thread is about Trump and how absolutely wild his speech is. No one else in public life speaks the way he does.
____________________________________________________



Have you ever heard a politician who thinks his microphone is off and says something controversial?

I would rather know up front than this:

President Obama: This is my last election. After my election I have more flexibility.

President Medvedev: I understand. I will transmit this information to Vladimir.

 

[Tekate]

This thread is about Trump and how absolutely wild his speech is. No one else in public life speaks the way he does.
____________________________________________________



Have you ever heard a politician who thinks his microphone is off and says something controversial?

I would rather know up front than this:

[i]President Obama: This is my last election. After my election I have more flexibility.

President Medvedev: I understand. I will transmit this information to Vladimir.
[/i]

That is not what he said:

http://www.politico.com/blogs/politico44/2012/03/obama-explains-medvedev-open-mic-incident-118750

He was speaking in an election year and that he would have more time and space to get something done without pushing through something.

Something that bothers me a LOT more was going into Iraq and finding no WMDs..but we all have our biases.

 

[AnnaH]

This thread is about Trump and how absolutely wild his speech is. No one else in public life speaks the way he does.
____________________________________________________



Have you ever heard a politician who thinks his microphone is off and says something controversial?

I would rather know up front than this:

President Obama: This is my last election. After my election I have more flexibility.

President Medvedev: I understand. I will transmit this information to Vladimir.

Red, can you imagine the outrage if a conservative did that?
Remember the Biden hot mic comment about then Senator Obama? Something about being a "clean" black man. Some such ridiculous statement. Now I don't think Biden is racist, but no conservative would get a pass.

 

[AGBF]

This thread is about Trump and how absolutely wild his speech is. No one else in public life speaks the way he does.
____________________________________________________



Have you ever heard a politician who thinks his microphone is off and says something controversial?

I do not know if you are being deliberately disingenuous. I am not referring to a politician making remarks that he would not want overheard because he has the good sense not to want them overheard (not knowing a microphone is on). I am referring to someone who is lacking the good sense to know when a remark is inappropriate and that he should not want to have it overheard. The first one is sane. The second one's sanity is up for discussion.

 

[redwood66]

Deb his whole premise is being against political correctness. Does he say stupid stuff? Sure. Do I like it? Not particularly. But those are the facts. And as ruby said, he is not a polished politician. But a polished politician like Hillary or Barack Obama is not what many want at this point in time.

 

[House Cat]

Well AGBF,

You know bits of my past...

I just wouldn't insult the mentally ill by truly classifying Donald Trump in that way. I've made very good friends with people who were in the throes of psychosis and their souls were still gentle as can be. I've met a woman who was completely convinced that she murdered more than 80 people. She kept trying to escape the hospital. She told me that the police were going to burst into the doors at any moment. She was so afraid. Her soul, still precious.

I knew a man who was coming out of psychosis... His eyes were wild, he was LOUD and paranoid, but he had been medicated for a couple of days by the time I had met him... I would sit next to him and talk to him and care about him. He would tell me he liked me. His humanity showed even when he was out of touch with reality.

There was a woman who came in, so out of touch that she thought that Michael Jackson was stealing her music. Everyone around her recoiled because they were afraid of the fact that she was sick. Meh, I wasn't. After time she would opt to sit next to me all of the time. She would share things with me about her life... once again, her humanity, her heart showing through psychosis.

I love those people. I wonder about them. I carry them with me. I hope to God they are ok. They were sweet souls who were suffering so much that their minds needed to take a break from this world, but the love inside of them stayed behind.


I don't see love in Donald Trump. I see him as an empty vessel or something filled with a darkness that will do us all harm.

Now, I grew up with a woman who really does have Narcissistic Personality Disorder. Donald KIND OF looks like her, but if I really had to say...

Donald Trump seems more like a sociopath to me. I've had a couple of those in my life too.

But then again, I'm not a clinician. I'm not qualified to diagnose anyone. I just know the familiar energy that I feel from someone when I am around them. I haven't been in his presence but his complete lack of regard for an entire nation and his plotting and manipulating for this presidency without any qualifications to pull it off reeks of sociopath or psychopath to me.

 

[AGBF]

I so love you, House Cat! What a doll you are. I hope you know that I meant no insult to mentally ill people by raising the issue, which had been raised by others, of whether Donald Trump was ill!

I actually used the term "ill" because in their responses to David Brooks' original column many of the illnesses were not psychiatric disorders. (ksinger referred to the DSM V, I believe, because she, also, thought all the illnesses discussed were psychiatric). But people responding to his column suggested Alzheimer's and Organic Brain Syndrome and ADHD as possible problems that might be afflicting Mr. Trump. For all I know ,since I never bought a DSM V, these might now be categorized as psychiatric illnesses (or they might now be named other things). I haven't opened a DSM since the DSM III-R!

My point, and that of David Brooks, is that something appears to be seriously wrong with Mr.Trump apart from his narcissism. We do not have to malign the mentally ill by calling him that, though!

Big hugs,
Deb

 

[ruby59]

I do not know if you are being deliberately disingenuous. I am not referring to a politician making remarks that he would not want overheard because he has the good sense not to want them overheard (not knowing a microphone is on). I am referring to someone who is lacking the good sense to know when a remark is inappropriate and that he should not want to have it overheard. The first one is sane. The second one's sanity is up for discussion.
________________________________________________________

Actually I have more respect for the second.

Like I said before I rather know what a person says to my face rather than behind my back.

Love him or hate him, Trump is who he is and does not pretend to be anything that he is not.

 

[smitcompton]

Hi,

The ghost writer for Trumps book,"The Art of the Deal", just wrote an article about Trump for the New Yorker. He says that Trump is unable to concentrate on any one thing for very long. You have to keep bringing his attention back to the topic you wish to discuss with him. He quit halfway thru the book until they made another arrangement for the completion.

This man came forward because he say Donald Trump doesn't have the attention span to handle important issues. He would be lost. Maybe the ADHD fits.

The book was written 20yrs +ago, and now Trump wants all his money back, including all royalties. He received a Cease and Desist Order from Trumps Lawyers. The writer gave an interview on MSNBC.

John Kasich did receive a call from Donald Jr, to ask him if he wanted to be the most powerful VP. Asked what his duties would be, JR said that he would be responsible for domestic and foreign policy. He said he wasn't interested.

Housecat, lately your posts have been so together. Are you the person who was having a bad yr. Please, you are so insightful
I want the bad to go away for you. I shall think of you the way you have thought of others. Be well. You do have heart--the genuine thing.

Annette

 

[AGBF]

Actually I have more respect for the second.

I am not quoting the entire exchange we had above because anyone who wants can go back up and read it. The reason I have no respect for Donald Trump's "frankness" is that he incites violence. More and more I see his rabble rousing as neo-fascist and neo-Nazi. (I do not respect Hitler's or Mussolini's frankness, either. I don't care if they are open about their intentions. Their intentions spell disaster; that is what matters to me.)

Read what has been going on at The Republican Party Convention. I told my daughter last night that I thought Ben Carson's discussion of Hillary Clinton and Lucifer was bizarre, especially since he is supposedly a neuro-surgeon and, thus, a scientist. But death threats that have to be investigated by The Secret Service made from the Convention floor are even more over the top. As The Times said, it's sinister.

Never Mind Locking Her Up, Let’s Just Shoot Her
By Nicholas Kristof

(excerpts)


"There has been lots of venom here at the Republican National Convention, and today it came down to this: A Trump delegate and adviser publicly urged that Hillary Clinton should be put in front of a firing squad and executed for treason.

Al Baldasaro, a Republican state representative from New Hampshire who spoke up as a veteran for Trump earlier in the campaign, suggested that Clinton should be shot for telling lies about Benghazi and mishandling emails.

Look, people always engage in hyperbole about people they disagree with, but this Republican convention has taken it further than I’ve ever seen. It opened with a prayer that denounced Democrats and Clinton as 'the enemy.' Then last night, Ben Carson tried to link Clinton to Satan. And the convention delegates have periodically chanted 'lock her up.'

In democracies, it’s natural to denounce opponents. But it’s in tin-pot dictatorships that opponents are locked up. When you’ve covered autocracies in countries where politicians are actually locked up after losing power struggles, you really don’t aspire for that in your own country.

This trend toward demonizing the opposition reached its apotheosis with Carson tying Clinton to the devil and Baldasaro saying that she should be executed.

(snip)​

'This whole thing disgusts me,' he said. 'Hillary Clinton should be put in the firing line and shot for treason.'

Baldasaro later stood by his remarks when journalists reached out to him. On Twitter, he wrote, 'As an American, I believe in the Constitution, freedom of speech and the rule of law: No one is above the law, not even Clinton.'

The Secret Service said it was investigating the comments, and the Trump campaign disavowed them, if not the man who made them. Hope Hicks, the Trump campaign’s spokeswoman, told NH1 News in New Hampshire that Baldaraso 'doesn’t speak for the campaign,' and then added, 'We’re incredibly grateful for his support, but we don’t agree with his comments.'

When a presidential campaign has to clarify that it does not favor executing its opponent, maybe that reflects a larger problem."

AGBF

 

[MollyMalone]

* * * Love him or hate him, Trump is who he is and does not pretend to be anything that he is not.

Well, no. E.g.,
2009 Wall Street Journal article highlighting aspects of the deposition of Trump taken in connection with the (ultimately unsuccessful) defamation lawsuit he'd brought against Timothy O'Brien, author of TrumpNation: The Art of Being the Donald
http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB124261067783429043
and the National Review's 2016 summary
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/431575/donald-trump-tim-obrien-courtroom-story

If you want to read the deposition transcript for yourself:
https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/2430267/trumps-lawsuit-on-net-worth.pdf

 

[AGBF]

* * * Love him or hate him, Trump is who he is and does not pretend to be anything that he is not.

Well, no. E.g.,
2009 Wall Street Journal article highlighting aspects of the deposition of Trump taken in connection with the (ultimately unsuccessful) defamation lawsuit he'd brought against Timothy O'Brien, author of TrumpNation: The Art of Being the Donald
http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB124261067783429043
and the National Review's 2016 summary
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/431575/donald-trump-tim-obrien-courtroom-story

If you want to read the deposition transcript for yourself:
https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/2430267/trumps-lawsuit-on-net-worth.pdf

Great material, MollyM. Thank you.

Deb

 

[ksinger]

Well AGBF,

You know bits of my past...

I just wouldn't insult the mentally ill by truly classifying Donald Trump in that way. I've made very good friends with people who were in the throes of psychosis and their souls were still gentle as can be. I've met a woman who was completely convinced that she murdered more than 80 people. She kept trying to escape the hospital. She told me that the police were going to burst into the doors at any moment. She was so afraid. Her soul, still precious.

I knew a man who was coming out of psychosis... His eyes were wild, he was LOUD and paranoid, but he had been medicated for a couple of days by the time I had met him... I would sit next to him and talk to him and care about him. He would tell me he liked me. His humanity showed even when he was out of touch with reality.

There was a woman who came in, so out of touch that she thought that Michael Jackson was stealing her music. Everyone around her recoiled because they were afraid of the fact that she was sick. Meh, I wasn't. After time she would opt to sit next to me all of the time. She would share things with me about her life... once again, her humanity, her heart showing through psychosis.

I love those people. I wonder about them. I carry them with me. I hope to God they are ok. They were sweet souls who were suffering so much that their minds needed to take a break from this world, but the love inside of them stayed behind.


I don't see love in Donald Trump. I see him as an empty vessel or something filled with a darkness that will do us all harm.

Now, I grew up with a woman who really does have Narcissistic Personality Disorder. Donald KIND OF looks like her, but if I really had to say...

Donald Trump seems more like a sociopath to me. I've had a couple of those in my life too.

But then again, I'm not a clinician. I'm not qualified to diagnose anyone. I just know the familiar energy that I feel from someone when I am around them. I haven't been in his presence but his complete lack of regard for an entire nation and his plotting and manipulating for this presidency without any qualifications to pull it off reeks of sociopath or psychopath to me.

Since psychiatric "diagnoses" are not based in anything evidence-based, but rather on groupings of behaviors that are agreed upon in committee, and written down so that anyone with a modicum of observational and people skills, can apply them, I suspect that you are as qualified as most clinicians to call a personality type. Trump is not exactly veiled or complex after all.

 

[House Cat]

Oh Deb,

I'm sorry. I didn't mean for you to have to explain your use of the word ill. I knew what you meant by it. When I said I didn't want to insult the mentally ill by classifying Donald Trump as such, I was just saying that they are too good for him. And thank you. You are always so kind to me.

Annette, Yes, I am the one who is having a tough year! Thank you for your kind words. They went straight to my heart!

 

[House Cat]

Pretty easy reading on the sociopath/antisocial personality disorder:
http://www.mcafee.cc/Bin/sb.html

When you consider the women who have accused him of sexual assault. When you look at all of his behavior.....