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First time engagement ring shopper: H&A 1.3ct diamond

DBOi

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 26, 2015
Messages
5
Hello All,

I am shopping for my first engagement ring and hopefully last :) , but I am a bit overwhelmed with the number of selections available. I have read all about the 4 C's but am now confused regarding reputable dealers and price ranges.

A couple of questions for the experts on this forum:
The following questions are based on a 1.3 ct diamond on a platinum setting

1) What is the lowest color grade I can purchase; I noticed an abundance of H & J colors for the hearts and arrows collections

2) Comparing a couple of sites, James Allen and Brian Gavin, I noticed a large price difference and wanted to know if it was warranted.

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.36-carat-j-color-vs2-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-584241
Holloway Cut Adviser - 0.5

http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/1.343-j-si1-round-diamond-ags-104081043025
Holloway Cut Adviser - 1.8

3) Between these two James Allen H&A diamonds which is a better bang for my buck?
The James Allen diamond SKU 584241 and SKU 559060

SKU 584241 Round 1.36 CARAT J-VS2 DIAMOND AGS

SKU 559060 Round 1.31 carat H color SI1 clarity diamond AGS - Holloway Cut Adviser - 0.4 All excellent ratings
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.31-carat-h-color-si1-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-559060
The AGS report shows a number of clarity issues thought

I appreciate your feedback in advance
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
58,547
Welcome! We'll be glad to help you!

The main difference in vendors is that some are jewelers specializing in top cut quality diamonds in-house such as BG, Whiteflash, Good Old Gold, High Performance Diamonds, and Victor Canera. Others carry virtual listings from diamond suppliers and do not necessarily primarily sell in-house diamonds such as James Allen, Blue Nile, etc. You may save more from the latter as they have lower costs as they aren't buying most of the diamonds until you order one. The others can do that, but they mainly sell the diamonds they have cut and buy for their stores and can offer more services such as light return images, larger variety of settings or higher end or designer settings, buy back policies, trade-in policies, etc. You pay more, but you also get added benefits. I have high regard for the vendors who specialize in top quality diamonds and recommend them.

1) I would stick with H color or maybe I color. You can see the tint more in a J. You can see this easily if you look at the videos on James Allen.

2) Just to be sure you know....A lower HCA score is not better as long as the score is under 2.0. The HCA is a screener to help you narrow down stones with the most potential and from there you get idealscope or ASET images that will show if the stone has good light return or leakage.

Pricing has to do with superideal cuts costing more, and the JA True Hearts may or may not be up to the superideal cuts from the other vendors I mentioned. The other cost differential is that the others have better trade-up policies, etc., as I described in the first paragraph. The JA stone looks nice. I just personally don't like AGS J color as they can be a little lenient in color grading when colors are borderline.

3) I need you to post the links of the stones you want us to comment on, please. The 1.31 H SI1 looks pretty good. I personally prefer VS clarity, though.

I would suggest looking at H and I color.
 

16ocean

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
May 3, 2009
Messages
702
Hi DBOi-
I totally know abt feeling overwhelmed with the multitude of options and really wanting to find the “best” stone with the budget you have.

As I was typing this diamondseeker2006 posted and she is an awesome "prosumer" totally let her guide you to a better choice of stone

Reputable dealers and price ranges-
So, first of all I personally have not purchased a stone from either James Allen(JA) or Brian Gavin(BG) but MANY people who are on pricescope regularly or post abt purchases have so in my -non expert-opinion both are reputable, seem to have good customer service and if I found a stone I liked would buy from either site.

1) “What is the lowest color grade I can purchase”- that is up to you.
What color or how white a diamond is varies from person to person. So often it is recommended you see a well cut (and graded by GIA or AGS) “H” colored diamond and “J” colored diamond and see the color of white you like.
“Regarding color:
Ever gotten one of those HUGE paint fan decks? Where there are literally 100s of colors of whites? And when they are RIGHT next to each other you can TOTALLY tell that one is bluer/colder and one is a bit warmer and which one is one is TOTALLY warmer. One there's one that's slightly greener. One that's slightly pinker? But really. They are all white?

Then you pick one after agonizing over this white or that white and when it's on the walls and people are like: Oh. You painted again. And it's STILL white. Great.

And you're all... BUT it's BLUE white. Or it's a WARM white now. It used to be ____ white. It's TOTALLY different.

It's like that. You are talking about shades of white. D is colder... J is warmer. But it's all white.

YES. If you have an accurately graded F and an H THAT HAVE THE SAME PERFORMANCE you are going to be able to tell them apart when you compare them. Just like you would be able to tell if you painted your walls a warm white, but painted the crown molding a cold/straight white. But both are STILL white.” This quote is from Gypsy who knows a lot abt picking a well performing diamond

My preference IRL for a round brilliant like DS stick is H's over J's but again it is what your eyes pick up
I like a well cut H.

2) “Comparing a couple of sites, James Allen and Brian Gavin, I noticed a large price difference and wanted to know if it was warranted.”
Is it warranted I don’t know. . .I think so.
For me it seems easier to find a well cut stone w/ BG but JA also sells some well cut stones you just have to look a little harder for them.
Both have pictures, which for me -IS VERY IMPORTANT- I think BG does more images and will have ASETs and idealscope for ALL their stones while JA has ASETs for some.
“What you REALLY need though is to work with a vendor that offers you idealscope images. Cause that's what you really need. https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/firescope-idealscope Many of the PS vendors do. It measures light return. And light return is what makes a diamond white bright and shiny.” from Gypsy
ALSO
JA and BG have different upgrade/ return policies and that can be a very important factor in choosing a vendor.

3) if you post the links to the diamonds you are looking at again I will comment there are too many for me to look at the SKU #s

Best of luck in your search!
 

craiguk

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 29, 2015
Messages
73
I'd definitely add Whiteflash, Enchanted Diamonds, High Performance Diamonds and Good old Gold to the list. There will be others too but I found that along with JA and BG those were the sites I frequented most in my search before settling on Whiteflash because they had the setting I wanted.
 

DBOi

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 26, 2015
Messages
5
I did not know there were so many other reputable dealers. I've decided to take a step back and review and study these new vendors and look at my diamond options. It does seem that the H&A or premium diamonds at BG/WF/HPD/GOG are much more expensive than the JA variety; I've read about the justification including better buy back policies and such so I'll go in weighing all those options as well.

For a diamond at the 1.2-1.3 ct size, is there any benefit of shooting for the ideal/H&A/premium cuts vs. a regular excellent cut? Will that small size show the extra fire and brilliance to spend the extra $$$? I am asking from a practical point of view. Please excuse my ignorance; I am a comic collector and sometimes that high appraisal grade doesn't make the eye appeal any better.


This might also be useful: My budget is between $8,000 - $9,000 USD. I am a Canadian shopper so the 1.37 exchange rate is currently not working in my favour. In that price range, what are the typical status I could hold to afford in the best available cut?

Thanks again and I appreciate all the detailed and thorough replies.
 

DBOi

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 26, 2015
Messages
5
Can someone provide some insight on the below diamond?

I am wondering if the impurities are significant in this case; feather/crystal/knot/cloud/natural
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-dia...arat-h-color-si1-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-559060


SHAPE: Round
CARAT WEIGHT: 1.31
COLOR: H
CLARITY: SI1
CUT: True HeartsTM Ideal
POLISH: Ideal
SYMMETRY: Ideal
FLUORESCENCE: None
L/W/D (MM): 7.07*7.12*4.28

L/W RATIO: 1.01
DEPTH %: 60.30
GIRDLE: Medium
TABLE %: 57.00
CERTIFICATE: AGS
CROWN ∠: 34.30

cert_21.jpg
hearts_7.png
arrows_6.png
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
58,547
It's a gorgeous stone as far as cut goes, but I see a rather large feather (crack) in the magnified image and that would bother me a lot.

But to answer your question, a GIA XXX stone that has been screened to have ideal cut measurements and an excellent idealscope image is absolutely fine for most people. Many of the regulars here, including myself, are cut nuts and appreciate the fine craftsmanship of the top cut diamonds, but it that is not your desire, there is nothing at all wrong with finding a great GIA ex cut stone.
 

D_

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Apr 14, 2015
Messages
245
diamondseeker2006|1440783631|3920402 said:
It's a gorgeous stone as far as cut goes, but I see a rather large feather (crack) in the magnified image and that would bother me a lot.

But to answer your question, a GIA XXX stone that has been screened to have ideal cut measurements and an excellent idealscope image is absolutely fine for most people. Many of the regulars here, including myself, are cut nuts and appreciate the fine craftsmanship of the top cut diamonds, but it that is not your desire, there is nothing at all wrong with finding a great GIA ex cut stone.

+1

To elaborate:
Think of GIA Ex as a circle.
Within GIA Ex circle, you can narrow down diamonds which have (or at least close to) the following parameters (exp. in the absence of Ideal Scope & ASET images):
Cut/Specs
Depth: 60 – 62%
Table: 53 – 58%
Crown: 34.0 – 35.0 degrees
Pavilion: 40.6 – 41.0 degrees
(Complementary crown and pavilion angles if possible)
Lower Girdle: 75 – 80%
Girdle: Thin to Slightly Thick
Culet: None or Pointed

That will help ensure optimum light performance.
The crisp H&A etc. is a nice addition to have, but may not be really necessary (it's difficult to see irl anyway), though cut nuts will be able to appreciate the difference.
And you may be able to look for "non-branded" H&A to save $$ (e.g. True Hearts is the H&A brand from JA).
When it's branded, you usually pay a bit (or a lot, like HoF) extra for the brand.
 

DBOi

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 26, 2015
Messages
5
I've gone through and did more research and got a better idea of what my girlfriend prefers vs. tech specs.

Please let me know what your honest opinions on the follow two diamonds

1.322 ct H SI1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond $9,995
DIAMOND PERFORMANCE
Eye Clean Yes
Light Performance Ideal
Polish Ideal
Symmetry Ideal
DIAMOND SPECIFICATIONS
Depth % 61.8
Table % 56.4
Crown Angle 34.9
Star 52.0
Pavilion Angle 40.9
Crown % 15.3
Lower Girdle % 77.0
Measurements 7.05x7.07x4.37
Culet Pointed
Fluorescence Negligible
Girdle Thin to Medium Faceted

Photos
1_415.jpg
ideal_scope_3.jpg
hearts_12.jpg
front_3.jpg
aset_70.jpg
 

DBOi

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 26, 2015
Messages
5
1.282 ct G SI1 A CUT ABOVE® Hearts and Arrows Super Ideal Round Cut Loose Diamond $10,346

DIAMOND PERFORMANCE
Eye Clean Yes
Light Performance Ideal
Polish Ideal
Symmetry Ideal

DIAMOND SPECIFICATIONS
Depth % 61.8
Table % 56.3
Crown Angle 34.8
Star 50.0
Pavilion Angle 40.8
Crown % 15.2
Lower Girdle % 78.0
Measurements 6.95x6.97x4.30
Culet Pointed
Fluorescence Negligible
Girdle Thin to Medium Faceted

Photo

ags_18.jpg
front_4.jpg
aset_71.jpg
hearts_13.jpg
ideal_scope_4.jpg
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
58,547
My diamond earrings are Whiteflash ACA's in H color, and I can definitely tell you they are gorgeous diamonds! Of those two, I like the H because it appears to be cleaner in terms of clarity, it is very slightly larger, and just a little less expensive. If you think she might be color sensitive, then the G color might be more appealing. But if you do consider it, I would have someone at WF look at both stones and tell you if there is a discernible difference in color and if they are equally eyeclean. They have definitely been honest and helpful to me when I was choosing between pairs of diamonds (more than once since I have upgraded!).

(I am sure the G is eyeclean. It is more of a mental thing for me to see inclusions even in the magnified images!)
 

AprilBaby

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jul 17, 2008
Messages
13,234
Take the H
 

telephone89

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 29, 2014
Messages
4,223
Another vote for the H!
 
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