Confrontation

[packrat]

How do you guys deal w/confrontation? Not the internet forum disagreement type. Real life in your face confrontation.

It makes me sick to my stomach. I shake, my hands get sweaty, my voice quivers b/c I get *so* mad. My heart races. If I can get out of it w/out the angry-crying, I'm doing good.

I ask b/c we've been having issues at work, and today someone confronted me, three times, in front of the kids during school. I repeatedly said this was not the time, not in front of the kids, it was neither appropriate nor professional and it kept on and kept on. And then she brought MY kids into it. MINE.

The principal happened to come down to our building so I asked to speak w/her. I explained part of what is going on but didn't go into vast detail--you know you can never remember half of what needs to be talked about when you're in the moment. However--we do have a glad handler principal that when it comes down to the brass tacks administrating part of administration duties, tells you what you want to hear and tells the next person something else. She agreed w/me, said it was unprofessional and completely inappropriate, and that she would find out what is going on.

And it's STUPID stuff related to work. Like the most inconsequential ridiculous things to raise a fuss about-but there I stood (or sat rather, b/c I was trying to do my snack table w/6 preschoolers) having to deal w/it and find a way to nicely explain that there was no point to the argument. In fact, I told the principal when I was talking to her that I felt ridiculous even having to have a conversation w/her about it *because* it is so trivial, but I felt like I was being attacked and I refuse to accept that. And when she brought my kids up, nope, absolutely NOT.

So. Aside from the fact that I need to get back into doing yoga desperately and I *really* want a moo latte swimming in cappuccino...

How do you deal w/it? Once it's been brought to someone else's attention, do you just let it go and if there's no follow up, accept it? I have a hard time not getting along w/someone and then ohhh hiiii yeahhhh how was your weekend? I feel two faced and I don't like to do it. So I ignored her at lunch-we're busy w/the kids anyway but instead of joking between the adults like we usually do, it was quiet on that front. It's been since she was hired right before Christmas that we've been dealing w/this. And some things are skinny rabbits, you don't worry about them..but some things after a while...it's just enough.

JD worries nobody is going to stick up for me and I'm going to just be allowed to take the fall b/c everyone wants to keep their jobs.

I feel there has been so much conflict between last year and this year that we NEED to have a meeting between staff and administration to get thru things rather than let them fester.

 

[azstonie]

Packrat, I taught for 12 years and when I left I had a Master Teacher national certification. I supervised student teachers, I taught several grade levels and subjects. I had no ambitions to be an administrator although I served in a temporary capacity when needed for short periods of time.

Do I understand correctly that a teacher admonished you? And this was in the presence of students?

I can tell you that unless there is blood everywhere, there is no emergency. And if there is no emergency, there is no reason to take up adult communications in the presence of students.

I'm sorry this happened to you. Working preschoolers is stressful as they require every ounce of your attention and also your SPIDEY senses, LOL.

 

[packrat]

It actually was the part time person who does our snacks and sets out our lunch. So you can about imagine what the confrontation was about. Partially about MILK. And yes, in front of the students. One of my coworkers later came and gave me a hug and said she thought I handled it very well and very professionally so that made me feel better. But still. I have to work here, and deal w/the other person daily. And when she first started it was ME who showed her the ropes and how to do things according to our program...and two coworkers warned her about another group that has daggers, so not to fall under their "spell" so to speak...and what did she do? Yep. pretty purposefully too.

 

[amc80]

I am the same way with confrontation. I try to avoid it whenever possible. It's hard for me to get anything said without crying, which is annoying and embarrassing.

 

[luv2sparkle]

Confrontation is much harder when it is with someone you work with or see every day. It sounds like you handled it very well, especially since she made comments about your kids. Seriously, that is throwing down the gauntlet. Do what you think it right and what you can live with. That is the best advice. At the end of the day, if you feel like you did the right thing, then the chips can fall where they may, so to speak. I would rather say less, and have less to apologize for. That has worked for me after learning that lesson the hard way. It is quite possible that people may not stand up for you or may not do the right thing. That happens a lot in this world. If you can look at the situation and feel ok about what you said and did, you are doing great, imho.

 

[partgypsy]

I had a really toxic work environment (10 years ago) where my supervisor after a number of productive years together, became verbally abusive and harrassing (she had episodically did so, but after I got pregnant she basically turned on me). And many many times like a deer caught in the headlights of, being called away from actively testing a research participant, to be shown a fax sheet and reprimanded for how I addressed it, or right after a participant leaves to call me out how unprofessional I was (the long term research participant wanted to see a photo of my newborn and I got one out of my wallet to show her). (I didn't have any pictures of my child at work because that would incite an attack). I never knew when the volcano was going to blow, but afterwards I would be shaking. Except for the day I left at least I never cried at work, didn't want to give her the satisfaction.
Most of the time I just said nothing, but towards the end she called me into her office, her office door open, and she started ranting and yelling at me. It was so over the top I simply said "I am not going to talk to you under these conditions. I will talk with you after you have calmed down, or we can meet at Human Resources." While the whole thing was horrible, at the very least I learned to stick up for myself in these kind of situations.

If this person is a helper, someone equal or below to you, what I would do is pull her aside and tell her that it is not professional or standard procedure to bring up these issues in front of the children, and that she shouldn't do it again. If there are things that need to be discussed, to schedule a meeting, or have a regular time to talk about them.

 

[azstonie]

Packrat, I saw this a lot when I was teaching: The worst behavior for the smallest stakes.

She was wrong. She knows it, you know it, the principal knows it and even the preschoolers know it.

If this is the only fly in the ointment of your job, I would not give her the power or the satisfaction of knowing how much this stuck in your craw. When you see her, look at a space just above her head.

She won't last long there, she has bad judgement and worse impluse control, a deadly combo.

She's probably jealous of your gorgeous yards!!!!

 

[missy]

Packrat, I am so sorry you had such an unpleasant encounter today and I want to say it sounds like you handled it very well and I know how stressful it all was and probably still is as it is unresolved. Work stress is no fun at best and well horribly stressful in many cases.

While I don't like confrontation I will stand up for myself when necessary but I always try (sometimes I do not succeed) to keep my cool and remain calm. And as Kristie wrote I would choose a place away from the rest of the children and other coworkers and calmly discuss it.

(((Hugs))) to you and I hope you can put it out of your mind for now and enjoy the evening with your family.

 

[packrat]

Thanks guys. I got my cappuccino moolatte to drown my sorrows. Hugs from my husband. It's funny, the whole time in the back of my mind, I was thinking, you do know my husbands a cop right? He won't stand for bullying and he's not afraid of the administration, so he is perfectly fine taking things to the Superintendent if it doesn't end.

We sat outside Dairy Queen while I told him what happened, and his concern made me want to cry. He's not an awww are you ok type of concern show-er. He's very take charge of it and take care of it, and that's what I needed to have. He was upset that four other para's were there and nobody said anything...which yeah I can understand but at the same time, we've got the kids to think about. We can't all be yelling across the room from our snack tables, and we can't all be in a group pointing fingers and "loudly discussing". I got riled up when I was recounting the story so my voice was loud and I was waving my arms around. In the moment, I spoke very calmly so the kids didn't sense anything by tone of voice. I even spent a lot of time smiling at her-which the kids don't understand that my smile was not a "real" smile, it was a smile of you cannot possibly be this stupid..

There have been SO many problems down there it's insane. It's a preschool for crying out loud-how hard are our jobs, really???? Why does there need to be such DRAMA? I can't *not* stand up for someone being bullied. And I certainly am not going to allow myself to be bullied-I spent my entire life being bullied to the point of near suicide and I am done with it. I spent my junior and senior years of high school being the go-to when others were being bullied. My brother and JD have all kinds of stories they like to retell from back in the day. But-it's easier when it's not you and you can give someone the what for-or when it's not having to do directly with your job.

I don't like things to go unresolved either. There needs to be communication between the staff and not the principal going person to person to get 11 different stories and then telling us "work on this". All of us need to be together w/the principal and get it out. If no one else is going to stand up for me in that meeting I will take the rest of the day as a personal day so I'm not actually quitting, and then JD and I will decide what to do from there.

I would *assume* that the fact the district has put a couple thousand dollars into my Child Development Associates and the umpteen dozen classes they've sent me to over the last 2.5 years, they're not going to throw that away over this.

So frustrating, the drama over the stupidest little stuff. I don't feel quite as heavy chested now..you know that horrid feeling? I still feel like I have emotions that need to come out, like I need to cry. It's hard to remain calm in front of little kids when you want to revert to arm waving and sailor mouth words.

 

[azstonie]

I'm glad your DH is your soft place to fall. That is a lot in life.

 

[packrat]

She's probably jealous of your gorgeous yards!!!!

hahahahaha thanks! She TOTALLY is not getting any landscaping advice. Nor will she be coming to partake in the serenity. (speaking of which OMGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG I need spring to come so I can get outside in the dirt and be with my plants.)

 

[packrat]

I'm glad your DH is your soft place to fall. That is a lot in life.

Boy that's the truth. We've been sitting out in the shop and I'm playing on the internet and he's making snares. Just chilling.

 

[Tacori E-ring]

I got yelled out by a co-worker once and here is what I learned. Most people will NOT intervene. Maybe it is shock. Maybe it is survival but I can't blame them or expect other people to come to my aid. The offender does not always think they are at fault. In my case she was to blame and to this day she will swear she never raised her voice despite the fact a manager heard her down the hall. Denial. Ignorance. Zero insight. You decide. After my incident I asked my manager for a sit down with her. My co-worker was NOT happy and tried to force me to be okay with what happened. I learned the importance of standing my ground. It wasn't about being a martyr. It wasn't about reliving the situation. It wasn't even about proving I was right. She got excited during the meeting and proved my point. Our manager saw it. Quickly it turned into a counseling session and it was obvious she was never going to change or truly see how inappropriate she was. At least I got to express how I felt. Now I keep my distance. She is a very unstable, sick woman so I try to have as little contact as possible. That's how I deal with conflict.

 

[Calliecake]

Hi Packrat,

I'm so sorry you had a bad day at work today but it sounds like you handled it well. I feel exactly the same way about confrontation. I'm glad JD helped and you are beginning to feel better. If it was warm out I would tell you to go out and play in the dirt. Working in the garden helps put me in a happy place. Judging by your beautiful yard, I think it has the same effect on you.

Callie

 

[SparklySoprano]

Confrontation is much harder when it is with someone you work with or see every day. It sounds like you handled it very well, especially since she made comments about your kids. Seriously, that is throwing down the gauntlet. Do what you think it right and what you can live with. That is the best advice. At the end of the day, if you feel like you did the right thing, then the chips can fall where they may, so to speak. I would rather say less, and have less to apologize for. That has worked for me after learning that lesson the hard way. It is quite possible that people may not stand up for you or may not do the right thing. That happens a lot in this world. If you can look at the situation and feel ok about what you said and did, you are doing great, imho.

Some great advice here. And for voice control in confrontational situations, breathe releasing your abs and your throat, then use your lower abs (feel the abs contract as if saying/holding "zzzzzz" - you can practice this sensation) while you speak. It should help control the quaver.

 

[packrat]

Jeez it's nice to be able to read about others experiences. Not that it's nice you guys have had to deal w/them obviously, but you know what I mean. I'll practice that breathing thing, SparklySoprano, thanks for the tip! I had to really work to keep my voice somewhat even..I get shrill, like my dad does, when I get angry.

I'm kind of hoping that during a meeting with everyone present there would be something along the lines of what happened w/Tacori-having my point proven. The ones who are stirring the pot are...I don't even know what to call them. The kind that will pick pick pick whisper point fingers and stir shit..but they do it quietly behind the scenes and then act like "What? Who, ME?" when things explode. If we're all sitting there, there's no where for them to hide, and I know full well they'll throw each other under the bus.

While I wait to see how this is going to be resolved, I will do as Tacori does, keep my distance. I'm not going to jump up to rush and help her as I've been doing. I can be civil, I can be professional in that regard. From now on, I will calmly state I'm not going to talk with her about this and if I can walk away after speaking, I will, otherwise if it happens again when I am unable to leave I will continue to repeat myself that I am not going to talk to her about it.

 

[monarch64]

Ugh, I really hate confrontation/conflict, and I can soooo empathize! Packie, you handled the situation as best you could, and well. I tend to get very red in the face and heated, but I am typically able to get through the conversation without tearing up...until it's over. It's like when the adrenaline rush is gone, and that "fight or flight" reaction is over, coming down from that my emotions kick in and I usually need a bathroom break to go compose myself and often have a few tears and a sniffle or two. After I'm calm, I have gone back to the person and spoken to them about the situation more in-depth and usually have been able to resolve things to the point that there aren't further problems. It sounds like you need some closure in this so that you can move forward and not be worried about grudges and more poor treatment from this person.

I imagine part of the problem here is that you couldn't get away from the attack/confrontation because you couldn't just walk away, and the person wouldn't listen to you when you were trying to tell her to back off. I suggest, if this happens again, that you be even more direct and simply tell her "BACK OFF," in a stern tone. Being polite does not get through to certain people when they're behaving inappropriately. That's not your problem, and it is your right not to have to work under hostile conditions. I hope the principal does not accept that person's actions against you and reprimands that employee.

So sorry you had to deal with this. Absolutely upsetting and not acceptable behavior. Over milk. Sheesh!

 

[packrat]

Thanks Monnie. One of the kids later that morning said she didn't feel good-she felt warm so I checked her temp which was normal, even a tish low. So I checked myself, like we always do, to make sure we're getting good readings. I normally run 97.5/97.7 and I was 100.0, so I knew I was still worked up. I also get red faced...the splotchy kind that's not pretty.

When I was out in the shop w/JD we were listening to the ipod so I could sing and chair dance..this one song that I don't even really care for that he happens to like came on and part of it is the guy says "quit it now" but it sounds like Kuh wit it na-ow so we spent some time laughing over if I'd said kuh wit it na-ow.

hahaha ohhh lordy the pettiness is unreal..last week there was two pieces of cake left after lunch b/c two kids were sick-so we took them back to our two teachers who don't do lunch tables, rather than throw them away, and she stormed down there to take them back b/c it wasn't fair to the three across the hall (two of whom are the pot stirrers)--even tho their program doesn't eat lunch and the 6 of us on the other side generally get screwed out of our lunch breaks and our sanity breaks. (not the two stirrers tho ohhh no)Cake. And they were literally like 2x2 inch pieces each. And she was LI-VID that we'd taken them. Frothing at the mouth mad.

And that's just ONE thing she's done. It's been two months of this on a daily basis. We've spent a lot of time standing there like this asking if this is really happening.

 

[aviastar]

Start documenting her poor behavior; calmly, eveny clinically- just the facts, with dates and times. It's much easier for a supervisor to take action, either counseling or eventually dismissing her with a pattern of behavior and complaints.

 

[pregcurious]

I think what you're describing is not confrontation, it's bad behavior. It is just as bad as glad-handing and avoiding confrontation, and saying stuff behind someone's back.

While confrontation is difficult, it can be done in a productive way, and it sounds like it was not done well.

There is also a place for anger, but not about pieces of cake at preschool. That is just stupid.

 

[monarch64]

hahaha ohhh lordy the pettiness is unreal..last week there was two pieces of cake left after lunch b/c two kids were sick-so we took them back to our two teachers who don't do lunch tables, rather than throw them away, and she stormed down there to take them back b/c it wasn't fair to the three across the hall (two of whom are the pot stirrers)--even tho their program doesn't eat lunch and the 6 of us on the other side generally get screwed out of our lunch breaks and our sanity breaks. (not the two stirrers tho ohhh no)Cake. And they were literally like 2x2 inch pieces each. And she was LI-VID that we'd taken them. Frothing at the mouth mad.

And that's just ONE thing she's done. It's been two months of this on a daily basis. We've spent a lot of time standing there like this asking if this is really happening.

Oh my goodness. You know, I think that sort of pettiness is caused by people feeling a total lack of control in their personal lives and taking their jobs SO SERIOUSLY because it's the only place they feel they are able to have power/make decisions/control. That said, it's not fair to the rest of the people who have to work with them! I deal with someone on a fairly regular basis who is just all over what's fair and what rules are being bent or whatever, and nitpicky and petty. But she has shared enough with me on a personal level that I am quite sure she gets worked up about stuff because it's the only part of her life she feels she can control. Unfortunately it affects others and she comes across as rude and obsessive. She definitely only sees the trees, not the forest, and will be the first to tell you a leaf is out of place. So annoying.

Glad you were able to laugh with your hubby tonight. That's good medicine for your soul. Hope things at work improve for you. Not sure about you guys, but cabin fever is an epidemic here and people are CUH-RAY-ZEE.

 

[luv2sparkle]

Yikes, Packie. This woman sounds like she has some emotional problems. Like one tick from crazy. Be careful. Documentation is a very good thing.

 

[azstonie]

Just for the sake of different considerations, I'm going to post the below. I'm not saying its correct or would be comfortable for you, but I'm going to throw it out there.

Drop the rope.

When you are in a no-win position, the only way to save yourself angst and upset is to drop the rope. The other person cannot tug at you, yank you, drag you or make YOU stumble and fall. If you drop the rope on them, THEY are the ones looking like a big fool.

Aggressors need the other person to get upset, "discuss" the situation, defend, explain, justify. Bringing others into the equation like a principal or supervisor or coworker just makes it even MORE delicious and successful for the aggressor. More attention=better in their eyes. They biggest fear they have is of being ignored. Even though she threw some poop your way, if you pick it up to throw it back, you still have poopy hands at the end of the day.

If you explain your feelings to an aggressor, your past experience, anything personal about yourself you are aiding the aggressor by telling them exactly where to press hard and repeatedly the next times.

If you engage, they win. If you engage, they will keep coming back to you to feed their craziness.

So this is why I had to learn: Drop the rope. Never JADE (justify, argue, defend, explain). Conduct YOUR life, your profession or business, and don't let them take up real estate in your head or job or family life.

(Its difficult to do this. I'm still practicing and learning how.)

 

[packrat]

weeelllll the principal said it's taken care of. She told her "don't worry about it" and she said "ok".


So. What a great resolution. hahaha. eh well. I'll document what I remember since she's been here and have it if I need it. I haven't spoken w/her today and I won't unless I need to.

 

[House Cat]

Just for the sake of different considerations, I'm going to post the below. I'm not saying its correct or would be comfortable for you, but I'm going to throw it out there.

Drop the rope.

When you are in a no-win position, the only way to save yourself angst and upset is to drop the rope. The other person cannot tug at you, yank you, drag you or make YOU stumble and fall. If you drop the rope on them, THEY are the ones looking like a big fool.

Aggressors need the other person to get upset, "discuss" the situation, defend, explain, justify. Bringing others into the equation like a principal or supervisor or coworker just makes it even MORE delicious and successful for the aggressor. More attention=better in their eyes. They biggest fear they have is of being ignored. Even though she threw some poop your way, if you pick it up to throw it back, you still have poopy hands at the end of the day.

If you explain your feelings to an aggressor, your past experience, anything personal about yourself you are aiding the aggressor by telling them exactly where to press hard and repeatedly the next times.

If you engage, they win. If you engage, they will keep coming back to you to feed their craziness.

So this is why I had to learn: Drop the rope. Never JADE (justify, argue, defend, explain). Conduct YOUR life, your profession or business, and don't let them take up real estate in your head or job or family life.

(Its difficult to do this. I'm still practicing and learning how.)

This.

It has been my experience that people like the woman you have described possess a certain set of behaviors. The most favorable of them all is a capacity to eventually hang themselves. I have learned to never give people like this any ammunition of any kind. This means that the cold shoulder is out of the question because they could possibly say that I was making their work environment hostile. Instead I am super sweet and kind, all the while I know that I am working her. I don't ask anything super personal and I don't get sucked into friendship. I am just very friendly in order to maintain appearances. I THINK anything I want about a person like this, but I share it with no one in the workplace.

Then I sit back and watch. People like this are completely incapable of maintaining face with large groups of people for long. They systematically alienate everyone around them. Soon, they are alone, not liked, a total thorn in management's side, and most likely will leave (playing victim) or will do something to get themselves fired.

I NEVER engage with this personality. Even when one thinks they are engaging in a diplomatic way, this personality turns things around, plays the victim, and even though you didn't do anything wrong, you will look as though you had.

To summarize, drop the rope, sweet as pie, laugh inside your head, never engage. Afterall, this is YOUR life and YOUR job that you are protecting. Screw her and her dramatic games. Don't take the bait. Each time you do, she gets a thrill.

 

[packrat]

Well part of the problem is the one who starts it all has run three people out in the last few years-and she's been there for 20 years. Doing the same thing over and over. So, since the others that have been there for years have been trying to get something done, and nothing has been b/c the principal doesn't like confrontation (to the point where the teacher isn't actually teaching the class, she spends her day wandering the halls and on pinterest so her kids are waaaay behind in benchmarks, and they run wild in the classroom, AEA has been brought in to no avail, and still, nothing is done) I don't think would behoove me to engage those people at all. If I'm asked a question, I will answer it, or if something applies to me, but that's going to have to be the extent of it. The vileness that comes from that woman (and now the three that tangled themselves up with her) is astronomical. I only deal w/the one at snack and lunch (after which she is supposed to go home, but now spends the rest of the afternoon hanging out in the other classroom, the four of them in a circle chatting on one side of the room while the kids do whatever behind them. The other ones who are pulling the strings, if I see them in the hall on the way to the bathroom, I will say excuse me as I walk past to the door. They just will become non essentials and I will have as little to do w/them as possible. We don't work in the same room, so thank the lord for that.

Last year the string puller went after the para in the room we connect with and I've never seen a confrontation like that in my entire life. Ever. I didn't know what started it at the time so didn't know what was going on and couldn't intervene. But the screaming OMG-this is a 60+ year old woman starting all of this mind you. And it all started b/c the para posted something on her FB wall (one of those saying poster things you know? Like...the pity train has derailed at shut your mouth avenue, that kinda thing) and the teacher in the other room decided it was meant toward her para, the pot stirrer, who doesn't have FB. So, the teacher printed it out, and went into the classroom in the middle of the night (!!!) and left it on her para's desk-went home and came back and did the whole "Oh hey I found this on your desk..." when the para came in the next day. She read it and went off the deep end toward the para who posted it--and it had nothing to do w/her! (buuuut if the shoe fits, she may as well lace that bitch up and wear it yes?)

I worked in a packing house. In raw meat and blood, with men and women who were VERY much the stereotypical white trailer trash--and they have made *preschool* more stressful and hostile than that.

And not 1 hour after the principal told me she took care of everything---the woman was doing the SAME exact things she has been doing the entire time and was one of the things she was accusing me of doing. Cuz it totally has been taken care of.

But I feel she has been allowed to rule the roost for so long, nobody will *really* stand up to her, so she is basically given the ok and allowed to bully and threaten and harass.

 

[MarionC]

Just for the sake of different considerations, I'm going to post the below. I'm not saying its correct or would be comfortable for you, but I'm going to throw it out there.

Drop the rope.

When you are in a no-win position, the only way to save yourself angst and upset is to drop the rope. The other person cannot tug at you, yank you, drag you or make YOU stumble and fall. If you drop the rope on them, THEY are the ones looking like a big fool.

Aggressors need the other person to get upset, "discuss" the situation, defend, explain, justify. Bringing others into the equation like a principal or supervisor or coworker just makes it even MORE delicious and successful for the aggressor. More attention=better in their eyes. They biggest fear they have is of being ignored. Even though she threw some poop your way, if you pick it up to throw it back, you still have poopy hands at the end of the day.

If you explain your feelings to an aggressor, your past experience, anything personal about yourself you are aiding the aggressor by telling them exactly where to press hard and repeatedly the next times.

If you engage, they win. If you engage, they will keep coming back to you to feed their craziness.

So this is why I had to learn: Drop the rope. Never JADE (justify, argue, defend, explain). Conduct YOUR life, your profession or business, and don't let them take up real estate in your head or job or family life.

(Its difficult to do this. I'm still practicing and learning how.)

Azstonie, this is good, I mean GREAT.

My friend who is a psychologist gave me advice about someone who would rant at me. He said to "step back" in my mind and really look at the person and think "OMG...this is a CRAZY person". Somehow it helped : )

 

[missy]

Just for the sake of different considerations, I'm going to post the below. I'm not saying its correct or would be comfortable for you, but I'm going to throw it out there.

Drop the rope.

When you are in a no-win position, the only way to save yourself angst and upset is to drop the rope. The other person cannot tug at you, yank you, drag you or make YOU stumble and fall. If you drop the rope on them, THEY are the ones looking like a big fool.

Aggressors need the other person to get upset, "discuss" the situation, defend, explain, justify. Bringing others into the equation like a principal or supervisor or coworker just makes it even MORE delicious and successful for the aggressor. More attention=better in their eyes. They biggest fear they have is of being ignored. Even though she threw some poop your way, if you pick it up to throw it back, you still have poopy hands at the end of the day.

If you explain your feelings to an aggressor, your past experience, anything personal about yourself you are aiding the aggressor by telling them exactly where to press hard and repeatedly the next times.

If you engage, they win. If you engage, they will keep coming back to you to feed their craziness.

So this is why I had to learn: Drop the rope. Never JADE (justify, argue, defend, explain). Conduct YOUR life, your profession or business, and don't let them take up real estate in your head or job or family life.

(Its difficult to do this. I'm still practicing and learning how.)

Azstonie, this is good, I mean GREAT.

My friend who is a psychologist gave me advice about someone who would rant at me. He said to "step back" in my mind and really look at the person and think "OMG...this is a CRAZY person". Somehow it helped : )

I love this advice Kristie and Jimmianne! I am going to see if I have the willpower to use it when necessary.

Packrat, I am glad things are under control for the time being and I trust everything will work out. Remember, you cannot reason with crazy so don't even bother. (((Hugs))) to you.