Australian seeking advice on loose diamonds

[callumev]

Long-time reader, first time poster. The wiki guides and forum posts on this site are amazing and have given me a lot of foundation information for talking to some of my local jewellers.

I’m from Australia and I’m hoping to get some advice on purchasing a loose diamond for an engagement ring (and what online stores are best for Australians).

From reading up on everything I’m considering buying a loose diamond online and having the diamond mounted on a custom made band at a local jewellers (prefer the idea of having someone to take the ring to if something goes wrong or if it needs repairs, etc.).

Due to the exchange rate my Diamond Budget is fairly low in terms of US dollars (US$2600/AU$3300) with the Customer Band (US$1500/AU$1900).

I'm looking at a simple and thin (1.8mm-2mm) solitaire setting (4 or 6 prong) Band in gold (white or rose), leading towards rose gold due to it matching her pale skin tone. Also keen to keep it all the same colour so no white gold prongs on a rose gold band (This is the closest I've been able to find to what I'm looking for, online http://www.bluenile.com/au/build-your-own-ring/monique-lhuillier-classic-solitaire-18k-rose-gold_50692?action=18k%252BRose%252BGoldSelect&track=alternate-metalsCustomizer). I've been told that I'll lose some of the whiteness in colour of the diamond by not having white gold prongs on a rose gold ring but I'm cool with that.

Hoping to get some advice from you all on Diamond choice and Vendor choice. I've mostly been looking at shops I've found that are Australian friendly: Blue Nile (no photos but cheaper) and James Allen (more expensive but good photos).

Looking at concentrating on Carat (0.65-0.85) and Cut (Ideal and 2 or less HCA score), substituting for a less colour quality (H to I) that's as eye clean as possible (SI1 or above). Also trying to keep polish and symmetry excellent.

Here are a few examples from James Allen:

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.70-carat-i-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-420647

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.70-carat-i-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-435245

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.81-carat-i-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-420198 (was AU$3400 but now sold)

I'm noticing that when I look at Blue Nile I can get the same/better price on the above conditions with VS2 clarity.

Jewellers keep trying to get me to aim lower in Carat and increase my Colour to at least G but I'm keen for all your thoughts on my situation/stats!


Sorry for the lengthy post!

The main questions I'm hoping you can all help me with:

Are there any other Australian friendly loose diamond sellers that I should check out? (also Blue Nile or James Allen, which is better for my situation?)

Any call outs regarding my Diamond conditions that I should be careful of or change?

I'm open to all suggestions so please tell me if you think there's a way I could be doing this smarter/better!

Thanks in advance!

 

[JamesW]

I'm based in Australia and went with Whiteflash, who were/are excellent. Couldn't be happier with the customer service. As you will be told by PS'ers, the problem with Blue Nile is obtaining images such as real life photo, ASET & IdealScope. James Allen have the best online system for viewing diamonds, and can obtain you 3 ASET images (choose wisely). I found that James Allen didn't have any settings to my liking. Upon researching through here, I was confident in my diamond choice, and these thoughts were confirmed by Whiteflash, who brought the diamond 'in-house' and conducted additional imaging for me. It's up to you, but I still think you're better off buying diamond & setting from the same vendor. Even if you have issues, postage is cheap (in the scheme of things) and even then, I'm sure a local jeweller can help if all else fails. Good luck with the journey! It seems never ending at first!

 

[KobiD]

Another Aussie here.

I went with James Allen leading up to Christmas to take advantage of their black friday specials (on settings only). I probably rushed into my purchase due to said specials as well, but ended up with a .62 AGS0 Ideal I VS1 for a few hundred under your stone budget (in USD), and the discount on the setting put me just shy of 1 CTW. Totally stoked with the overall process and quality of the product.

In terms of customer assistance they were very pleasant to deal with and answered all of my questions. If you purchase the ring and setting through them they will assemble and also engrave at no cost. Postage is free, and they also fill out the free trade agreement documentation (no duties). You pay a simple brokers fee and the 10% gst to fedex and then it turns up packaged well.

I haven't looked into White Flashs fine details but I imagine they would be right on par.

 

[callumev]

Thanks guys, been having a look through Whiteflash and they look pretty good too (more options are always good!)

KobiD: How are you finding the I colour? I had jewellers strongly urging me against it so I'm a bit curious of first hand impressions.

 

[KobiD]

We're somewhat regional, so exposure to quality diamonds in the flesh has been pretty minimal. I have been around the local shops though. Locally, the missus had her eye on a setting with a .7ish center stone. She'd had her eye on it for about 4 years, and finally convinced me to have a look. Typically I'd avoid stores as I have a dislike towards sales people who always put on the plastic fake friend chit chat, and push for a sale.. but I had a look and nearly ended up buying the one she wanted. Luckily they wouldn't meet me at what I considered to be a fair price, and then the diamond research began/continued which lead me to where I was.

In hindsight, the center stone they were pushing was so deep it faced up smaller than a .6ct, and was only graded fair. I'm stoked I dodged that bullet.

With the I colour, we went with a 18ct yellow gold, and the ring also has a trio pave. Due to the quality of the cut, the I faces up as white as the F-G coloured side stones. From the side, to me its clear. I don't see any colour. I can see some where the gold prongs wrap over, but thats expected. The center stone does get quite a bit darker when in direct sunlight, but puts on a hell of a fire show to compensate. I'm sure if you had a range of stones laid next to eachother I'd see the warmth of the I, but on its own in yellow gold its not a concern in the slightest.

 

[arkieb1]

Somewhere like Blue Nile is probably going to be the cheapest, then JA. If our dollar tanks some more local places like Jogia and a couple of ones in Sydney and Melbourne might also be options worth considering;

http://www.jogiadiamonds.com.au/diamonds/diamonditem.php?code=SS1869

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/aus-where-to-purchase-loose-princess-cut-in-syd-or-online.208018/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/aus-where-to-purchase-loose-princess-cut-in-syd-or-online.208018/[/URL]

Garry in Melbourne;

http://www.hollowaydiamonds.com.au/

 

[callumev]

Thanks arkieb1!

Jogiadiamonds seem very competitive in terms of pricing, my only concern would be that there's not a lot of photos (some seems to have Idealscope and some have low quality photos).

Reading the details on the website it looks like you can pay $200 deposit and they "call in" the diamond to take HD photos/video. I'm wondering if you can decline after seeing the photos/video and get the deposit back (or keep checking more diamonds until you find one you like).

Has anyone had any experience with this company?

Edit: I assume you'd also not have to worry about 10% GST for imports as they're based in WA?

 

[KobiD]

I got the impression they are bringing them in from overseas. They absorb the GST, but in the end you pay for it. Basically they just act as a broker on your behalf.

 

[callumev]

So I'm seriously considering this diamond from jogia:

http://www.jogiadiamonds.com.au/diamonds/diamonditem.php?code=SS1869

My one question is the table angle of 32 seems much lower than the normal recommended 34-35. Is this going to cause any issue?

I'm now looking at a custom band similar to the 1477 setting at 77 diamonds http://www.jogiadiamonds.com.au/diamonds/diamonditem.php?code=SS1869


Thoughts?

 

[callumev]

Sorry, should read "Crown Angle". Was on my phone so couldn't look up the correct terminology.

Cheers,

 

[KobiD]

The 32CA is balanced with the 41.4PA. If you run it through the HCA calc it'll likely show as a BIC. Almost a 60/60 with big table. The shallow crown height will favour the return of white light (brillance) over dispersion (fire). It depends on personal taste, but the ideal scope looks good so it won't be a dud by any means.

I think you'd find a more balanced stone at a better price elsewhere.. especially if you drop the colour a range and get an ideal vs super ideal. It depends what you're looking for.

 

[KobiD]

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3114514.htm
Something like this will end up about the same price with the current dollar and then GST.

Or the one below will save you a few more dollars for an unbranded stone.
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/0.70-carat-h-color-vs2-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-426109

 

[dneal12]

I remember seeing a post in the bling forum about someone having a really positive experience with joiga.

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/the-forum-engagement-ring-folder-eye-candy.5429/page-299']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/the-forum-engagement-ring-folder-eye-candy.5429/page-299[/URL]

 

[callumev]

Thanks for the advice/information everyone, it's really helpful!

The main reason I'm leaning towards Jogia is because I can custom make a band/setting for a lot cheaper than my local jeweller so I can use more of my budget on the diamond, rather than the band/setting (we're talking a A$1,000 difference judging by the prices on Jogia's website). The majority positive feedback is also helping the decision making process. I might look through the international section but it seems a bit more risky (a lot of the ones around this range don't seem to have as good IdealScope outputs).

 

[adele_h]

Hello!

I've contacted Jogia in the past, and my understand is that you can call in a number of diamonds for you $200 fee (i.e. if they call in one and you don't like it, they will call in another) - but if you decide to go elsewhere, you lose the $200 deposit.

Other than that, they seem very flexible!

 

[callumev]

Hello!

I've contacted Jogia in the past, and my understand is that you can call in a number of diamonds for you $200 fee (i.e. if they call in one and you don't like it, they will call in another) - but if you decide to go elsewhere, you lose the $200 deposit.

Other than that, they seem very flexible!

Thank you! That's great info

 

[KobiD]

And in reality, its much easier having someone else do the leg work. The current dollar really doesn't put you that far in front at the moment.

 

[arkieb1]

The stone they have is a 60/60 stone. Big table, which gives you a good spread, good white light return but not optimal in all lighting conditions and not what we classify as a "Super Ideal cut" it scores over a 2 on the HCA (the rejection calculator up the top tabs labelled tools where you enter the info on the diamond certificate and it gives you a score if you would like on the performance of the diamond.) The lower the score in theory the better the diamond.

Given our dollar is still in free fall you might consider telling them you are a fussy Pricescope member and you would like to see if they could call in a better scoring Hearts & Arrows stone with a smaller table and better HCA. They have found a couple of nice stones for other members in the past which is why I mentioned them. If you live near there and can go see them even better, especially if they could call in a stone with a small table and a good HCA and that way if they have the 60/60 diamond in stock you can visually compare the two and pick which one appeals to you the most. First step would be hassling them asking what else they could source for you (asking for examples of what they could potentially get for you, should cost them nothing to look up via a data base on a computer) and then pay them the fee if you are happy with their answers.

If not, places like Blue Nile, James Allen and Whiteflash, Brian Gavin, Victor Canera and Good Old Gold are all trustworthy and reliable, it's just a matter if you do decide to purchase from overseas picking a nice stone (with the help of members) I'd be going for a Super Ideal if you do go down this pathway and then sticking to your decision because it IS costly if you have to send things back and forth....

If our dollar was at parody I'd say just buy from overseas back then it was cheaper and easier, if you are after a Super Ideal, I'd also probably recommend this path as being faster and costing around the same to just a bit more now our dollar is falling. You need to decide what you feel most comfortable with, what is going to be the best option for you and what you want in a stone. And also what options (if any) Jogia can come up with. If our dollar continues to fall and they can call in a range of decent stones for you to pick from it might be $200.00 well spent.

 

[adele_h]

Direct quote from email correspondence in December

With the $200 deposit, upon the diamond coming in and you don't like and may have changed your mind, you are more than welcome to go ahead with another diamond.
The $200 is interchangeable, as long as you eventually decide on one of our diamonds.
Post a review if you wind up using them!

 

[callumev]

Sounds like a good plan arkieb1!

I've been looking through their international selection online and haven't been able to find any that have IS photos as good as the local one.

There's a lot of Ideal cuts that have a good HCA score but have IS images with lots of white.

Example:

http://www.jogiadiamonds.com.au/diamonds/diamonditem.php?code=J8350271
http://www2.jogiadiamonds.com.au/images/certs/J8350271-image.jpg
HCA Score - 1.0

I thought if the cut was good and HCA score was good that the IS image would normally reflect that. I feel like I'm missing something here

 

[KobiD]

Thats not an IS Image. Just a typical hearts and arrows viewer image. It will show your optical symmetry, but not neccessarily the light performance.

If you search within the following parameters to get a stone in, and then have Jogia send you the IS/ASET you should find a stone which performs well quite easily. If its a dud, have them find another.

Table 55-58
CA 34-35
PA 40.5-40.9
Depth up to 62.4

You should be able to narrow it down quite easily. Remember to compare actual sizes vs carat weight. The cut will affect the spread. No use spending more on a .7 over a .67 if the extra weight is going to be held in the depth/girdle.

Perhaps these from a quick view
http://www.jogiadiamonds.com.au/diamonds/diamonditem.php?code=J8314801
http://www.jogiadiamonds.com.au/diamonds/diamonditem.php?code=J8262356
http://www.jogiadiamonds.com.au/diamonds/diamonditem.php?code=J8407108 - Table maybe a bit large, getting back towards 60/60


Loads to check from. I'd ask them to source you some. Be better if their website had advanced search option.

 

[callumev]

Perfect, thanks!

I thought it looked like a weird IS image, haha.

 

[KobiD]

Are you still working within the $3000ish dollar budget AU? or have you extended it based on the dollar and import costs?

 

[KobiD]

Working within your $3300 budget ($3225AUD).

http://www.gia.edu/cs/Satellite?pagename=GST%2FDispatcher&childpagename=GIA%2FPage%2FReportCheck&c=Page&cid=1355954554547&reportno=2161887753

http://www.jogiadiamonds.com.au/diamonds/diamonditem.php?code=J8378407

Its .64ct. Measures at 5.57 x 5.58 x 3.39mm. H VS1. Nice Thin to Med Girdle. Feather and pinpoint inclusions, and at VS1 will definitely be eye clean and likely even clean at 10x to the untrained eye. Proportions are a nice middle ground 34CA, 40.8PA. If its got decent optical symmetry it should be a nice stone. Definitely worth a look within your budget.

 

[KobiD]

Or if you want to drop a colour to I and jump up to .74ct VS2 34/40.8 combo, and save more dollars ($3050AUD), this one would be an option too!

http://www.gia.edu/cs/Satellite?pagename=GST%2FDispatcher&childpagename=GIA%2FPage%2FReportCheck&c=Page&cid=1355954554547&reportno=15367150

http://www.jogiadiamonds.com.au/diamonds/diamonditem.php?code=J8340911

I'd try and see if they'll call both this stone and the one above in, and compare them for you. Both score a neat 1.0 TIC on the HCA.

 

[callumev]

Well I was budgeting $1800-$1900 for a customer setting/band made locally but I think I can get Jogia to do the same thing for $850 So my budget for Diamond has gone up to $4350 max seeing as I'm saving on import fees and the customer band

 

[KobiD]

Good stuff, but just because you have extra doesn't mean you need to spend it, or if you're going to spend it to best meet your needs.

IE Compare these two.

Diamond #J8378407
Weight: 0.64ct
Colour: H
Clarity: VS1
Measurements: 5.57 x 5.58 x 3.39
Table: 57%
Depth: 60.7%
Regular: A$3225.69 (inc GST)

Diamond #J8350271
Weight: 0.70ct
Colour: H
Clarity: VS2
Measurements: 5.69x5.71x3.52
Table: 56%
Depth: 61.7%
Regular: A$3945.18 (inc GST)

Is the extra .1mm spread worth $720? Thats your call. Note the smaller one has better clarity too, but holds less weight in its total depth. Both these stones share similar proportions. Decisions decisions. If the budgets up, why not shop for a bit more spread for your dollar?

 

[callumev]

I'm keen to use my budget to it's limit to get the best diamond I can afford

 

[KobiD]

Whats the new magic figure for the stone? I'll have a look later.

Best diamond depends on a few factors (mainly what you value though). Size, clarity, colour, cut, light performance?

 

[callumev]

My priorities from most important to least important are light performance/cut -> size -> clarity -> colour.

From what I've been looking at the final product will probably be a super ideal cut, 0.7+ carat, VS2+, H+