Ebola arrives in America tomorrow on a fancy private jet

[Trekkie]

Thomas Eric Duncan has died in Dallas, Texas: edition.cnn.com/2014/10/08/health/ebola-us

Now we wait to see if his family has managed to avoid infection.

 

[Calliecake]

Thomas Eric Duncan has died in Dallas, Texas: edition.cnn.com/2014/10/08/health/ebola-us

Now we wait to see if his family has managed to avoid infection.

Along with the paramedics who took who took him to the hospital, and those who rode in the ambulance afterward.

 

[missy]

Thomas Eric Duncan has died in Dallas, Texas: edition.cnn.com/2014/10/08/health/ebola-us

Now we wait to see if his family has managed to avoid infection.

Along with the paramedics who took who took him to the hospital, and those who rode in the ambulance afterward.

OMG, how awful. I didn't know about the paramedics and the others.

I have questions. Why was Thomas Duncan given an experimental drug and not the drug the other infected Americans were given? Was it too late in the game for him? Also, why did the hospital ER turn him away when he first went there. Could have been a different outcome and I just cannot help wonder what happened? A tragedy all around. My heart goes out to his family and those families of the people infected because of him.

 

[Trekkie]

Thomas Eric Duncan has died in Dallas, Texas: edition.cnn.com/2014/10/08/health/ebola-us

Now we wait to see if his family has managed to avoid infection.

Along with the paramedics who took who took him to the hospital, and those who rode in the ambulance afterward.

Yeah, and the homeless man who travelled in that ambulance after Thomas Eric Duncan and then tried to evade quarantine: www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/10/06/homeless-man-found-ambulance-ebola-thomas-duncan/16796563

 

[chemgirl]

Missy: zmapp was available in extremely limited supply and it has simply ran out. The manufacturing process is extremely slow (requires modified plants to mature).

 

[missy]

Missy: zmapp was available in extremely limited supply and it has simply ran out. The manufacturing process is extremely slow (requires modified plants to mature).

Thanks Chemgirl. Now I understand why they were unable to give that to him. I hope they can figure out a way to start making it in larger supply and more quickly as to prevent further deaths.

 

[Trekkie]

.

 

[Calliecake]

Missy, I had heard they are out of the drug that was used to treat the two patients that were brought back from Africa. It also did not sound like there was a quick fix for getting more of the medicine. Pretty scary. I can't believe that we have not done more to prevent people who may have been exposed from entering the country.

 

[missy]

Missy, I had heard they are out of the drug that was used to treat the two patients that were brought back from Africa. It also did not sound like there was a quick fix for getting more of the medicine. Pretty scary. I can't believe that we have not done more to prevent people who may have been exposed from entering the country.

Yes, I agree. In the beginning of this thread I stated that the threat of infecting others in America with Ebola is not from bringing those infected American scientists/doctors over in a controlled manner but is from the general population bringing it over here unwittingly and via Commercial plane travel. Just what happened unfortunately and I am not sure what can be done to prevent similar further contagious infections from happening but clearly something needs to be done. Even if that is to say anyone traveling in the Ebola infected regions cannot re-enter the general population in the USA until the incubation period is over. Safety first. If one must travel to infected areas they have to pay the price so as to prevent infecting others.


Thanks for that info Trekkie.

 

[ksinger]

Missy, I had heard they are out of the drug that was used to treat the two patients that were brought back from Africa. It also did not sound like there was a quick fix for getting more of the medicine. Pretty scary. I can't believe that we have not done more to prevent people who may have been exposed from entering the country.

Here ya go.

Why One Public Health Expert Thinks Airport Ebola Screening Won't Work
http://www.npr.org/blogs/goatsandsoda/2014/10/08/354408155/why-one-public-health-expert-thinks-airport-ebola-screening-wont-work

"Consider the case of Ebola patient Thomas Eric Duncan, who traveled to the U.S. from Liberia and is now in critical condition in a Dallas hospital. He would not have been detected either in Africa or the U.S. because he was not exhibiting any signs of the virus.

Or consider the case of Australia and the 2003 SARS outbreak. The country's airports screened more than 1.8 million incoming passengers for the airborne virus and found 794 with elevated temperatures. They held those travelers for additional testing, but no one turned out to have SARS.

Singapore and Canada saw similar results: millions of passengers screened, and few if any SARS cases detected. Meanwhile, thousands of people saw their travel plans disrupted and in some cases were quarantined for a week or longer.

Plus, Gostin says, many people know how to game the system. During the SARS outbreak, Gostin was on a flight to Beijing when the airline flight attendants began handing out Tylenol to first-class passengers. They were encouraged to take the medicine, to be sure they passed fever screenings.

And he worries that false positives could divert money and manpower away from actual Ebola cases.

"Just the other day, at Newark airport, someone came in with vertigo." He claims that high-level officials spent hours dealing with that one false alarm: "It's kind of not what you want."

..why are new entry screenings being implemented? Gostin says it might have to do with an age-old tradition: The public gets scared and demands that the government protect them.

"And governments, even if they know better, will sometimes reply to that political outcry," Gostin says. "They're under a lot of pressure to do something [to] make the public feel reassured, even if it really doesn't make them safer."

As my husband quips, cheap, easily available globe-hopping travel is GOING to kill us. It's great until it isn't. This is the downside, and short of closing our borders (and we see how easy THAT is) there is very little we can actually do. If we did what we would really need to do to stop anyone with ebola from entering, international travel would cease. I think we all agree that isn't really an option.

 

[zoebartlett]

Thomas Eric Duncan has died in Dallas, Texas: edition.cnn.com/2014/10/08/health/ebola-us

Now we wait to see if his family has managed to avoid infection.

Along with the paramedics who took who took him to the hospital, and those who rode in the ambulance afterward.

Wait, the paramedics didn't die, did they? I think we're waiting to see if those who helped Duncan develop symptoms, right?
According to CNN, there's a person who claims he's come into contact with Duncan who may have gotten sick.

Also according to CNN, enhanced screening will start at 5 US airports.

 

[distracts]

Why was Thomas Duncan given an experimental drug and not the drug the other infected Americans were given? Was it too late in the game for him? Also, why did the hospital ER turn him away when he first went there. Could have been a different outcome and I just cannot help wonder what happened?

1. There is no more ZMapp

2. Presby is one of those hospitals that is notorious in the region for ER re-admissions, which is the way they measure "turned patients away without actually figuring out what the heck is wrong with them." It's not, like, a mystery. It's just a shitty ER, especially if you are black or don't have insurance, and this guy fit both categories.

Another interesting treatment: http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-your-health/wp/2014/10/02/a-liberian-doctor-is-using-hiv-drugs-to-treat-ebola-victims-the-nih-is-intrigued/

 

[telephone89]

It's interesting to see the difference between the hysteria in North America vs the denial in West Africa. 1 person in North America has it and everyone is freaking out. A few thousand in Africa had it, and most people are still not following the best practices/in denial they will get it/etc.

 

[Calliecake]

Thomas Eric Duncan has died in Dallas, Texas: edition.cnn.com/2014/10/08/health/ebola-us

Now we wait to see if his family has managed to avoid infection.

Along with the paramedics who took who took him to the hospital, and those who rode in the ambulance afterward.

Wait, the paramedics didn't die, did they? I think we're waiting to see if those who helped Duncan develop symptoms, right?
According to CNN, there's a person who claims he's come into contact with Duncan who may have gotten sick.

Also according to CNN, enhanced screening will start at 5 US airports.

Hi Zoe, You are correct. No paramedics have died or gotten sick. I believe one of the people who came to quarantine Thomas Eric Duncan's apartment and was in the apartment has become ill. It will be another 48 hours before they know if he has Ebola.

 

[Calliecake]

Missy, I had heard they are out of the drug that was used to treat the two patients that were brought back from Africa. It also did not sound like there was a quick fix for getting more of the medicine. Pretty scary. I can't believe that we have not done more to prevent people who may have been exposed from entering the country.

Yes, I agree. In the beginning of this thread I stated that the threat of infecting others in America with Ebola is not from bringing those infected American scientists/doctors over in a controlled manner but is from the general population bringing it over here unwittingly and via Commercial plane travel. Just what happened unfortunately and I am not sure what can be done to prevent similar further contagious infections from happening but clearly something needs to be done. Even if that is to say anyone traveling in the Ebola infected regions cannot re-enter the general population in the USA until the incubation period is over. Safety first. If one must travel to infected areas they have to pay the price so as to prevent infecting others.


Thanks for that info Trekkie.

They stated on the local Chicago news tonight that they were going to begin screening at O'Hare Airport NEXT week. I have no idea why they are waiting.

 

[Matata]

Well, I guess it was bound to happen. Other vectors to consider for infection. Let's make sure we don't get shat upon by a carrion eating bird. The implications are staggering.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/08/ebola-dog-excalibur-euthanized_n_5956026.html

 

[zoebartlett]

Thomas Eric Duncan has died in Dallas, Texas: edition.cnn.com/2014/10/08/health/ebola-us

Now we wait to see if his family has managed to avoid infection.

Along with the paramedics who took who took him to the hospital, and those who rode in the ambulance afterward.

Wait, the paramedics didn't die, did they? I think we're waiting to see if those who helped Duncan develop symptoms, right?
According to CNN, there's a person who claims he's come into contact with Duncan who may have gotten sick.

Also according to CNN, enhanced screening will start at 5 US airports.

Hi Zoe, You are correct. No paramedics have died or gotten sick. I believe one of the people who came to quarantine Thomas Eric Duncan's apartment and was in the apartment has become ill. It will be another 48 hours before they know if he has Ebola.

Oh okay, I wondered if I missed something. I think the other person is a deputy sheriff who didn't have direct contact with Duncan. I think the latest CNN report I heard was that he hasn't had any symptoms yet so they're hopeful it's not Ebola. Better to be cautious and get checked out though, just in case.

I was listening to NPR yesterday morning and they were interviewing medical professionals in Alabama (or was it Arkansas?) who will be training/helping others in Liberia and SL. They described the process of putting on and taking off the has mat suit and how tricky it is to keep everything covered. They had a lot of difficulties. It was an interesting interview.

 

[ksinger]

Thomas Eric Duncan has died in Dallas, Texas: edition.cnn.com/2014/10/08/health/ebola-us

Now we wait to see if his family has managed to avoid infection.

Along with the paramedics who took who took him to the hospital, and those who rode in the ambulance afterward.

Wait, the paramedics didn't die, did they? I think we're waiting to see if those who helped Duncan develop symptoms, right?
According to CNN, there's a person who claims he's come into contact with Duncan who may have gotten sick.

Also according to CNN, enhanced screening will start at 5 US airports.

Hi Zoe, You are correct. No paramedics have died or gotten sick. I believe one of the people who came to quarantine Thomas Eric Duncan's apartment and was in the apartment has become ill. It will be another 48 hours before they know if he has Ebola.

Oh okay, I wondered if I missed something. I think the other person is a deputy sheriff who didn't have direct contact with Duncan. I think the latest CNN report I heard was that he hasn't had any symptoms yet so they're hopeful it's not Ebola. Better to be cautious and get checked out though, just in case.

I was listening to NPR yesterday morning and they were interviewing medical professionals in Alabama (or was it Arkansas?) who will be training/helping others in Liberia and SL. They described the process of putting on and taking off the has mat suit and how tricky it is to keep everything covered. They had a lot of difficulties. It was an interesting interview.

Drat! My husband had NPR on yesterday morning and I heard bits of that piece wafting in to my room too. I tried to find it later, but couldn't. And yeah, it was an eye-opener. I kinda had the general idea suiting up for ebola situations was difficult, but wow. These were motivated and trained medical people and they still made many mistakes. It would make instructive listening for anyone who can't quite understand how docs and other care-givers get infected.

 

[distracts]

It would make instructive listening for anyone who can't quite understand how docs and other care-givers get infected.

Yeah, it's not that the disease's mechanisms of transmission aren't understood, it's that protecting yourself 100% from them is hard, and doing it over and over again gives you new opportunities for error, and people make mistakes and then get sick and possibly die. And that's sad. But it's not mysterious. I mean, if you're in a war and someone effs up and gets shot, no one, absolutely no one, suggests that it's because bullets suddenly don't operate on straight-line trajectories. We understand how they work. It's just that people sometimes do something they're not supposed to, even when they had all intentions of doing the right thing, even when they thought they were doing the right thing. That people make mistakes is a truth that is not going to ever go away. That sometimes those mistakes are fatal is another.

re: The deputy currently at the hospital: "Monnig’s condition is listed as good, with no fever, vomiting or diarrhea. His condition is not consistent with an early stage Ebola diagnosis, according to the statement provided by the hospital."

I sincerely doubt this dude has ebola. I am sick right now with something HORRIBLE that makes me feel like I'm DYING but I have only a low fever and no vomiting or diarrhea. The other symptoms the news reports that he has? I also have. A bunch of D-town people I know have been getting that this month and I bet it's what he has. I am probably missing the Dallas Stars season opener tonight because of it.

ALSO though Presbyterian is not managing this very well internally. I am acquainted with several nurses there and am fb friends with them and my feed is full of "omg ebola! A doctor just told me the deputy definitely has ebola!" and general hysteria. This has been repeating around every six hours since he was admitted. The hospital really needs to be, like, issuing internal releases or getting on a loudspeaker and making announcements or something.

 

[iLander]

I was listening to NPR yesterday morning and they were interviewing medical professionals in Alabama (or was it Arkansas?) who will be training/helping others in Liberia and SL. They described the process of putting on and taking off the has mat suit and how tricky it is to keep everything covered. They had a lot of difficulties. It was an interesting interview.

I think a good training method would be to dust the suit with a harmless pink or blue powder, while the worker is inside.

Okay, now try and get it off without getting any pink powder on yourself.

It's hard to train with something invisible.

 

[zoebartlett]

It would make instructive listening for anyone who can't quite understand how docs and other care-givers get infected.

Yeah, it's not that the disease's mechanisms of transmission aren't understood, it's that protecting yourself 100% from them is hard, and doing it over and over again gives you new opportunities for error, and people make mistakes and then get sick and possibly die.

That's pretty much what they said during the interview. Putting the suit on and then taking it off 3+ times a day is apparently really difficult and exhausting. They're not allowed to touch the outside of the suit, so they have to remove it from the inside, if that makes sense. I hadn't really thought about that aspect of it, but apparently they'll need much more training themselves before heading to WA to help others.

Ksinger, I think I found the interview I listened to: http://www.npr.org/2014/10/08/354507416/cdc-sets-up-mock-ebola-ward-set-up-in-alabama

 

[missy]

Missy, I had heard they are out of the drug that was used to treat the two patients that were brought back from Africa. It also did not sound like there was a quick fix for getting more of the medicine. Pretty scary. I can't believe that we have not done more to prevent people who may have been exposed from entering the country.

Yes, I agree. In the beginning of this thread I stated that the threat of infecting others in America with Ebola is not from bringing those infected American scientists/doctors over in a controlled manner but is from the general population bringing it over here unwittingly and via Commercial plane travel. Just what happened unfortunately and I am not sure what can be done to prevent similar further contagious infections from happening but clearly something needs to be done. Even if that is to say anyone traveling in the Ebola infected regions cannot re-enter the general population in the USA until the incubation period is over. Safety first. If one must travel to infected areas they have to pay the price so as to prevent infecting others.


Thanks for that info Trekkie.

They stated on the local Chicago news tonight that they were going to begin screening at O'Hare Airport NEXT week. I have no idea why they are waiting.

I just heard on the morning news that they are implementing screening procedures at our area airports with screenings at JFK airport starting tomorrow. I guess it takes time to get all procedures in place. You know how slowly government works.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/09/us/us-to-begin-ebola-screenings-at-5-airports.html

http://nypost.com/2014/10/08/jfk-airport-to-begin-enhanced-ebola-screening/

 

[Calliecake]

They will be begin screening at the following 5 US airports.

JFK New York
international Newark
Chicago O'Hare
Washington Dulles
Atlanta

 

[telephone89]

I doubt the screenings would do anything. One of the previous articles posted said that airline employees were handing out packs of tylenol to take before you land to get rid of any fever (during SARS times). They are only checking for a fever really, which is one of the early signs. Easy to get rid of, easy to have and NOT have ebola.

 

[lyra]

Canada is taking new measures:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/ottawa-urging-canadians-in-three-ebola-ravaged-west-african-countries-to-leave/article21071407/

Ottawa is urging any Canadians living in Sierra Leone, Guinea and Liberia to leave the Ebola-ravaged countries while they still can, warning that the government cannot guarantee it would be able to evacuate expatriates who fall ill in West Africa.

Canada's Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development updated its travel advisories for the three countries hardest hit by the Ebola outbreak Friday with a new recommendation that Canadians, "consider leaving by commercial means while they are still available."

"We want them to think about coming home for two reasons. We know that if they’re nonessential personnel, we want those who are there to be able to focus on the people that are sick," she said. "We want them to be able to have all of those resources focused on containing the virus. We also know that those countries don’t have strong health care systems like we have here in Canada."

Effective immediately, anyone who arrives in Canada from the Ebola-affected countries will be sent for a mandatory health assessment by a quarantine officer, she said.

Until now, travellers from West Africa would only be sent for a health assessment if they self-identified as sick or as having had contact with an Ebola patient.

 

[starshine]

One of the nurses who had contact with Duncan during his second stay at the hospital has tested positive.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/10/12/health/ebola/index.html

 

[Asscherhalo_lover]

Brooklyn had an Ebola scare with a teen traveling from the Sudan which has thankfully been cleared. I work in Brooklyn, ugh.

 

[kenny]

Yes that hospital ER screwed up royally.
Patient told nurse where he just arrived from Liberia but attending physician didn't get the word.
Now the million-dollar question is, "WTF! WHY NOT!?!"

Some are blaming the move from paper medical records to electronic/computer software.
That hospital uses computers, not paper, for medical records.

My old doctor, who still uses paper records warned me that trusting software is a can of worms.
My current doctor spends more time reading and typing into his computer than talking to or facing me during an office visit.
I hate it.

Apparently my old doctor was right.
Below is an article about how the shortcomings of electronic medical record keeping may be responsible for the Ebola outbreak here.
Unfortunately the article gets ugly-political ... but the part about why electronic record keeping is inferior to paper I find very significant.

I hope the wealth, power and political connections of this woman and her medical records company does not obscure the investigation of what went wrong with the medical records software and let Ebola loose in America.

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/389817/ebola-electronic-medical-records-and-epic-systems-michelle-malkin

 

[ksinger]

Yes that hospital ER screwed up royally.
Patient told nurse where he just arrived from Liberia but attending physician didn't get the word.
Now the million-dollar question is, "WTF! WHY NOT!?!"

Some are blaming the move from paper medical records to electronic/computer software.
That hospital uses computers, not paper, for medical records.

My old doctor, who still uses paper records warned me that trusting software is a can of worms.
My current doctor spends more time reading and typing into his computer than talking to or facing me during an office visit.
I hate it.

Apparently my old doctor was right.
Below is an article about how the shortcomings of electronic medical record keeping may be responsible for the Ebola outbreak here.
Unfortunately the article gets ugly-political ... but the part about why electronic record keeping is inferior to paper I find very significant.

I hope the wealth, power and political connections of this woman and her medical records company does not obscure the investigation of what went wrong with the medical records software and let Ebola loose in America.

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/389817/ebola-electronic-medical-records-and-epic-systems-michelle-malkin

Yeah, I agree that electronic records are not this wonderful panacea we've been led to believe. Deliberated manipulation after entry by god only knows who (but probably someone who doesn't have your best interests at heart) and errors, are just too easy, depending on the software used. My husband, in spite of the constant drumbeat to do everything electronically, still keeps his parallel paper grade and attendance books, and they've saved his bacon more than once, since he's well known for doing it.

 

[kenny]

It wouldn't surprise me if the software is written such that you have to click a few times to find a patient's travel history ... since before now it was not such a HUGE RED FLAG.
An overworked and rushed ER doctor may not have drilled down a few menus to find it.
Again travel history wasn't as significant yesterday as it is today.
Hindsight is 20/20.

On paper more can be visible at a glance.

So often with computers the excuse given is, 'But all the information is there" Just find it.
No consideration is given to how user friendly access to that info is ... especially for us over 40, who grew up without menu-driven everything.