shape
carat
color
clarity

which of the > 2 carat genfix rubies for a ring?

jeffd

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 30, 2002
Messages
45
hi,

need to get off the mark on a ring for my wife. Gemfix has a good rep here, which of these do you like best and why?

http://www.gemfix.com/ruby.html

tia,
 

ephsea

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jan 9, 2014
Messages
181
Easy one. #542 for color and size. Lack of heat is a bonus. And a pricetag to go alone with it. :bigsmile:
 

Starzin

Brilliant_Rock
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While I agree that #542 is a stunner - first things first, what is your budget for the overall stone and setting have you any ideas how you/your wife want this set? There are many more resources for rubies that we can point you to if necessary once we know these things. Also if this is for a particular celebration what is the time frame?

Please also read https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/new-to-coloured-gemstone-buying-read-this-first.174284/. Lots of good information in the whole thread and rubies in particular on the second page.
 

jeffd

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 30, 2002
Messages
45
thanks, 542 is within my budget of $15k. is it fairly priced? stones from other vendors I should look at?

As for setting, I was thinking it best to pick out the nicest stone I can afford and then pick out the setting.
 

Starzin

Brilliant_Rock
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In that case, I think it would be worth your while to contact Andrew and get the stone for approval. You will have to pay up front but he has a good return policy (please read it) and is amenable to the approval process.

I'll have a look for some others now we have a budget. You will typically need $3,000-$4,000 for a custom setting though given the size of #542 you may well be able to find a semi-mount to fit via one of the vendors on the recommended list (sticky at top of forum).

Have you looked at rubies in jewellers near you to "get your eye in" as it were? I would strongly recommend seeing a few in person. Rubies differ in colour and clarity and only you can be the judge of what you find appealing in this regard once all other considerations are met. I've attached one of the loveliest rubies (IMHO) I've seen purchased here - known as Timmy's ruby and it's final setting. If you search that term - Timmy's ruby - you may find his search thread for interest.

As for setting, I was thinking it best to pick out the nicest stone I can afford and then pick out the setting.
What an entirely sensible idea :)) I'll be back in a little with some pictures of the major options e.g. halo, 3-stone etc before getting into details of each type. Platinum or white/yellow gold?

Be aware also that the forum tends to be quiet on weekends.

timmys-ruby.png

timmys-ruby_0.png

bodanza50dd18-claw-set.jpg
 

Starzin

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I forgot to say that the fact that #542 comes with an AGL report stating it is unheated is a bonus of the rarest kind for a stone this large and lovely.
 

Starzin

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Athenaworth's "Rudolph ring" - unfortunately now sold. Lots of lovely photos which is why I'm posting the link to the thread. Note that this has a double halo, meaning two rows of diamonds around it.
 

iLander

Ideal_Rock
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6,731
I would call gemfix and discuss your options. They probably have more than what you see on the website. Or go with the one suggested at the top of this thread. If you can afford it, then grab it. It's amazing. The size is excellent too because you can buy an off the rack (calibrated) 7mm cushion setting which is waaaayyy quicker and cheaper than custom. :appl:
 

jeffd

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 30, 2002
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thanks for all the help! Timmy's thread was a great read but his reports of seeing the same ruby from different vendors at different prices was...concerning. I'll give gemfix a call on monday.

- I had been in touch with robert genus, I did enjoy our conversation but he had a limited supply of rubies.

- I work in nyc, about five blocks from the diamond district, so I've seen some rubies in person but it's a pretty high pressure environment and I didn't enjoy the experience.

I've looked at a bunch of recommended vendor sites, it seems like gemfix has the best selection but open to all suggestions. if anyone has time, would very much appreciate links to other rubies I should consider.
 
S

SparkliesLuver

Guest
I'm not a ruby expert but I figured I'd throw this one in for consideration (and let the more experienced PSers weigh in).

2.02 cts, 7.2x6.2x4.8mm
Burmese ruby
Does have inclusions and heat, but it seems to have great color and fire
atggems.com

_22327.jpg
 

pregcurious

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 18, 2009
Messages
6,724
Timmy's ruby looks like it has better crystal than 542, but 542 may have he famous ruby glow if it has some silk. The other stones pale in comparison.

Africa Gems also has good selection of rubies around 2 carats and above. In general the are reputed to have high prices, and when I looked at their unheated rubies, that seems to be the case. You can look there for a point of reference.

EDIT: Woofmama, I was writing as you were also posting. That stone you suggested is lovely. It is heated though, so it would be interesting to see it in person and see how it compares to 542.
 

Starzin

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jeffd|1410637336|3750448 said:
thanks for all the help! Timmy's thread was a great read but his reports of seeing the same ruby from different vendors at different prices was...concerning. I'll give gemfix a call on monday.

- I had been in touch with robert genus, I did enjoy our conversation but he had a limited supply of rubies.

- I work in nyc, about five blocks from the diamond district, so I've seen some rubies in person but it's a pretty high pressure environment and I didn't enjoy the experience.

I've looked at a bunch of recommended vendor sites, it seems like gemfix has the best selection but open to all suggestions. if anyone has time, would very much appreciate links to other rubies I should consider.
I'm pleased you managed to find Timmy's thread, he had a couple but I didn't have them bookmarked and they're difficult to find again because he has deleted his profile.

Good-oh on giving Gemfix a call. I had a look at Robert Genis' site but he only had two or three which, although lovely, were more expensive and smaller though with what looked like better crystal. However if you've spoken to him then we can mark that one off.

AJSgem has a large inventory but they are nearly all heated. This brings a consideration of it's own. For a large, well cut, heated ruby you would expect to pay much less than for unheated. However heated gems also (usually) gain clarity, provided we are talking ONLY heating and not other treatments - trust but verify with an AGL lab report. Use the sort feature to get a selection in your price range, PS wouldn't let me post that link for some reason.

However... if you are to spend a large amount on a ruby there are those who would say it should be unheated. Richard Hughes is an acknowledged ruby/sapphire expert and you might be interested in what he has to say about it in this article as well as getting his opinion on rubies from different origins.

StarRuby has at least one that may be of interest but looks far pinker in the photos which may be simply that it is flooded with light. Please note they are in India and cannot export Burmese rubies to the USA.

This is about 1mm larger and pinker than the Gemfix and is from Madagascar, unheated, has a GIA report and a good price. You can email for more photos/video.
http://www.starruby.in/store/madaga...-eye-clean-unheated-intense-purplish-red-ruby

Good colour, size, unheated, GRS report and wonky bottom - but very inexpensive, so I would be aware of the S3 clarity. Secret purchase for pendant later on?
http://www.starruby.in/store/mozamb...rtified-unheated-cushion-cut-ruby-from-niassa

Avoid stones with large windows - anything that has a smooth blurry or clear bit in the middle of a still picture - normally to be avoided at all costs but unless you manage to find a precision cut one, is somewhat inevitable. Small ones may "close up" (become unnoticeable) once set.

While Africagems does have a reputation for premium prices, it also has a large selection and there may be a PS discount or negotiation room. I've posted three below which give alternate shape options.

Sorry for the "book" :oops:

3rubies-ajsgem.png
 

jeffd

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 30, 2002
Messages
45
Starzin|1410669956|3750682 said:
Good-oh on giving Gemfix a call. I had a look at Robert Genis' site but he only had two or three which, although lovely, were more expensive and smaller though with what looked like better crystal. However if you've spoken to him then we can mark that one off.

AJSgem has a large inventory but they are nearly all heated. This brings a consideration of it's own. For a large, well cut, heated ruby you would expect to pay much less than for unheated. However heated gems also (usually) gain clarity, provided we are talking ONLY heating and not other treatments - trust but verify with an AGL lab report. Use the sort feature to get a selection in your price range, PS wouldn't let me post that link for some reason.

However... if you are to spend a large amount on a ruby there are those who would say it should be unheated. Richard Hughes is an acknowledged ruby/sapphire expert and you might be interested in what he has to say about it in this article as well as getting his opinion on rubies from different origins.

StarRuby has at least one that may be of interest but looks far pinker in the photos which may be simply that it is flooded with light. Please note they are in India and cannot export Burmese rubies to the USA.

This is about 1mm larger and pinker than the Gemfix and is from Madagascar, unheated, has a GIA report and a good price. You can email for more photos/video.
http://www.starruby.in/store/madaga...-eye-clean-unheated-intense-purplish-red-ruby

Good colour, size, unheated, GRS report and wonky bottom - but very inexpensive, so I would be aware of the S3 clarity. Secret purchase for pendant later on?
http://www.starruby.in/store/mozamb...rtified-unheated-cushion-cut-ruby-from-niassa

Avoid stones with large windows - anything that has a smooth blurry or clear bit in the middle of a still picture - normally to be avoided at all costs but unless you manage to find a precision cut one, is somewhat inevitable. Small ones may "close up" (become unnoticeable) once set.

While Africagems does have a reputation for premium prices, it also has a large selection and there may be a PS discount or negotiation room. I've posted three below which give alternate shape options.

Sorry for the "book" :oops:

first, thanks so much for your time!
- I have some pictures from robert, they are lovely, if anyone wants to see them, lmk and I'll post (as long as it's not against forum rules)

- I had looked at starruby, they have a really nice one from burma for what looks like a great price but alas, as you point out, they can't export to the U.S. I liked the one you linked to but found it too pink.

- I *loved* the richard hughes piece, thanks for the link, it was a great read. I''d definitely consider a great, heated ruby at significant savings but I''ve not been able to find anything like that. I do tend to agree with him, unheated is probably the way to go when spending a lot on a ruby.

- Africagems has some wonderful rubies but on the face of it, they're not price competitive. I'm a good negotiator, but wouldn't even know how to get started on a gem other than asking for a lower price. I guess the point is that I can't objectively debate value with a gem expert.

- I''ve started wondering about the size of the ruby in the ring. at what size does the ruby become...not tasteful/elegant. I know this is a personal decision but I've generally been thinking 1 carat is too small, 2 carats is just about right and 3 carats starts to get too big. Any thoughts on this would be appreciated...also, maybe I should be focused on size rather than carats?
 

Starzin

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Sep 26, 2011
Messages
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first, thanks so much for your time!
===
You're welcome :))

- I have some pictures from robert, they are lovely, if anyone wants to see them, lmk and I'll post (as long as it's not against forum rules)
===
By all means post the pictures. Consumers are allowed to post pictures of any stones, sold or unsold and we're always happy to drool particularly when Robert's website pictures are soooo small.

- I had looked at starruby, they have a really nice one from burma for what looks like a great price but alas, as you point out, they can't export to the U.S. I liked the one you linked to but found it too pink.

===
Yes, the Burmese one would have been my pick too. Fair enough on the colour of the one I linked.

- I *loved* the Richard Hughes piece, thanks for the link, it was a great read. I''d definitely consider a great, heated ruby at significant savings but I''ve not been able to find anything like that. I do tend to agree with him, unheated is probably the way to go when spending a lot on a ruby.
===
:bigsmile: I'm pleased you enjoyed it - Hughes' articles are a trip since his writing style is always just that bit irreverent. Willingness to consider unheated opens the field up but let's see how you get on with #542 first.

- Africagems has some wonderful rubies but on the face of it, they're not price competitive. I'm a good negotiator, but wouldn't even know how to get started on a gem other than asking for a lower price. I guess the point is that I can't objectively debate value with a gem expert.

===
I understand.

- I''ve started wondering about the size of the ruby in the ring. at what size does the ruby become...not tasteful/elegant. I know this is a personal decision but I've generally been thinking 1 carat is too small, 2 carats is just about right and 3 carats starts to get too big. Any thoughts on this would be appreciated...also, maybe I should be focused on size rather than carats?
===
:lol: There's a saying around here that "people vary". We have one member with a finger size of 4.5 who rocks 3-5ct stones - 10x8 - dripping in diamonds with ease (yes Chrono I'm looking at you) see her "Traffic Light trio" though not all her stones are this large and she does have a knack of picking impeccable colour. Others feel that 5mm or 6mm round is their limit. The right stone is a matter of preference but also colour, cut and clarity and a small stone whose colour packs a punch can be seen across a room. It can also be enhanced by a setting with some diamonds.

In general we always advise to concentrate on the dimensions rather than the caratage until and unless you are down to comparing two stones. Corundum is also heavier than other material and size/carat is not comparable to other stones.

This can also be a matter of lifestyle. Does your wife work? We have medics for whom a large ring is inconvenient having to put on/take off gloves all the time. Others work in Social Services where they feel wearing a large ring every day is inappropriate. It can also depend on whether your wife is used to wearing rings/jewellery.

As a broad brush, I think your reasoning is fine but is tempered by budget and availability. For gems as with anything else, quality is king. Again, are we working to a time frame on this?

One more contact for consideration - I tripped over this ruby dealer while hunting the forum for something. I know nothing about them and have not seen them referenced before (if anyone else knows please chip in). However seeing they have an office in NYC you might like to give them a call and see what eventuates. No inventory online unfortunately.
http://www.ahakimi.com/
 

chrono

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Messages
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Because rare gems are cut to maximize as much as possible (colour and carat weight), the cut is rarely consistent, hence a 2 carat ruby could well face up as large as a 1 carat ruby. I would focus on the size, rather than the carat weight. Have you reached out to Constantin Wild?
www.gemstone.de

I am not crazy about NSC but they might something you like:
http://www.thenaturalsapphirecompany.com

Palagems might also have something for you. You'll have to go through a jeweller of your choice to inquire about pricing.
http://www.palagems.com/home.htm
 

jeffd

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 30, 2002
Messages
45
I spoke to andrew at gemfix. he said the #542 is nice but does not glow. He has a heated ruby around the same size that's actually more expensive than the one we like on his website. He described it as a little more pink but internally flawless. I'm going to figure out a way to see both.

chrono:
- thanks for the pointer to constantin, I had looked at his website, I'll send him a note.
- if you're not crazy with nsc, I see no reason to do business with them. There are plenty of other vendors.
- palagems actually has a number of nice rubies but figuring out price seems a hassle as I'd like to get the price for a number of them.
 

Starzin

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Messages
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I spoke to andrew at gemfix. he said the #542 is nice but does not glow. He has a heated ruby around the same size that's actually more expensive than the one we like on his website. He described it as a little more pink but internally flawless. I'm going to figure out a way to see both.

One of the corundum conundrums unfortunately. As Andrew no doubt discussed with you, glow is (usually) caused by some silk. Silk is caused by inclusions. Glow and clarity are often something of a trade-off. So are heat, clarity and price.

It would be great if you could see both to compare.

Word from another thread is that Wilds are in Hong Kong at the moment so it may may a few days until you hear from them. I don't know if you are aware of his ebay store unfortunately there are no rubies listed there at the moment.
 

chrono

Super_Ideal_Rock
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With it being a heated stone and at that price, I would want a lab report telling me how much flux healing/residue it has.
 

jeffd

Rough_Rock
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Nov 30, 2002
Messages
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yeah, thanks, actually, based on my limited knowledge, 20% off doesn't yield a bargain since the base price of their stones seems high. As promised, here is a photo from robert genis. I think these may be too small for the ring I have in mind but it would be interesting to hear people's thoughts. I have an email from robert with his suggestion which I can share.

rubies.jpg
 

Starzin

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Oh boy, now that's what I call colour! Why doesn't he put THOSE photos on his site :love:

So the sizes are....?
And the ring you have in mind is....?

There's lots of ways of enhancing a small stone and as I said before, the right colour will be seen across the room no matter if it is small.
 

jeffd

Rough_Rock
Joined
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Messages
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:), with TQIR rating:

1) 1.01 Very Good - http://www.preciousgemstones.com/101burufs.html
2) 1.14 Excellent - http://www.preciousgemstones.com/114burufs.html
3) 1.41 Excellent to Very Good - http://www.preciousgemstones.com/141mongrufs.html

and here is an excerpt from an endearing note from robert:
"Therefore, if you asked Cap Beesley, before he retired, he would say the 1.14 is the best stone. As you can tell from the video, it looks the largest, too. Always the worst salesman who rarely chooses the most expensive stone, if it was my $$$, I would choose the 1.14."

thoughts? go for one of these?
 
S

SparkliesLuver

Guest
Starzin said:
Oh boy, now that's what I call colour! Why doesn't he put THOSE photos on his site :love:

+1 :drool:

I shall have a #2, please. ;-)
 

Starzin

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I think you have to see it. From what you said about the StarRuby one, it may be that you find that colour too purple, did you talk to Robert about that?

The size is what most people would regard as within the bounds of normal.
What video - link please.

#2 - which is what I had already picked :bigsmile:
 

Starzin

Brilliant_Rock
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Thank you!!

The video has the advantage of being able to stop and start and it's a bit closer to the rubies. The fact that they have had the middle one recut is a definite plus and the angle of the stones to the camera and maybe reflection from something is making it difficult but it does remind me of Timmy's.

Nonetheless what I do see are facets winking on and off!

Robert's recommendation is the icing on the cake.

So when does it arrive? :bigsmile:
Remember you don't have to buy it - if it doesn't speak to you it isn't your stone, no matter what anyone else says.
 

jeffd

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 30, 2002
Messages
45
I'm thinking about getting 2 and 3 from robert and #542 from gemfix and returning two. My sense is that #542 is a nice stone for a collector but might not be as nice in a ring as Andrew said something like "it's very nice for an unheated ruby of it's size." I am a little concerned my wife will just pick the largest ruby, so another option is to just go with #2 :angel:

anyhow, does my approach make sense?
 

Starzin

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It makes eminent sense. If you can manage to get the three in hand at the same time, I think it would be really good for comparison purposes and you would not be left wondering if you should have seen "the other one"

I am a little concerned my wife will just pick the largest ruby, so another option is to just go with #2 :angel:

Bummer! I thought it was going to be a surprise :bigsmile:
Only you can be the judge of that.
 

chrono

Super_Ideal_Rock
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#2 really grabbed my eye in the video. :lickout:
 
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