Please help a new buyer with choosing the right rock

[blingbuyer]

Hello,

My head is spinning as i try to find the right ring for my lady.

I went to look at rings this weekend and saw one that looked great. They price as ~8500 for the rock and the setting as well as the band. I havent decided if i want to go with this or something a little bigger. However this ring looked very nice and they said it will look much bigger in the right setting. Is this a good value? What should i be asking these people when i look at a rock? They said they are able to sell it cheaper since they buy wholesale. Not sure if that is why i got a good deal or if thats just all sales pitch.

Below are the EGL USA stats:


DIAMOND CHARACTERISTICS
Cut (Shape and Style) PRINCESS1
Carat Weight 1.51 CT
Clarity Grade SI1
Color Grade G
PROPORTIONS
Measurements 6.42 x 5.96 x 4.54 mm
Table 80.6%
Depth 76.2%
Crown Height 7%
Crown Angle 37.6°
Pavilion Depth 66.6%
Pavilion Angle 40.8°
Girdle VERY THIN TO THICK POLISHED
Culet
OBSERVATIONS
Finish
Polish GOOD
Symmetry GOOD

It looked pretty nice to me. I could only see the inclusion looking with the magnifying glass. I was expecting to pay more so the price has me wondering if its too good to be true.

Thanks for the feedback.

 

[Dancing Fire]

The #s don't look good... stick with GIA graded stones..

 

[blingbuyer]

Which numbers dont look good? That will be helpful when i look at other stones. What should i be looking for and which categories are the most important?

Thanks.

 

[SirGuy]

AGS is worth consideration as well, especially considering it's a princess.

Also, I'd recommend reading this thread, regarding EGL reports: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/rapnet-bans-egl-reports-from-trading-network.205934/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/rapnet-bans-egl-reports-from-trading-network.205934/[/URL]

 

[blingbuyer]

thanks. I will read that. So what are the certs that i should be asking for when looking? AGS and GIA only? i am looking in the $8-12k range. If the EGL can get appraised for $17k like he said does that make it better?

 

[Gypsy]

You need to stop working with this jeweler. The appraisal amount is irrelevant, this guy is giving you a bunch of misinformation and trying to confuse you.

ON EGL:
[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/egl-certification-are-any-of-them-ok.142863/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/egl-certification-are-any-of-them-ok.142863/[/URL]
[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/rapnet-bans-egl-reports-from-trading-network.205934/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/rapnet-bans-egl-reports-from-trading-network.205934/[/URL]
[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/been-wondering-when-this-would-happen-lawsuit-over-grading.204318/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/been-wondering-when-this-would-happen-lawsuit-over-grading.204318/[/URL]

People are suing over bad EGL reports. EGL has been banned from Rapnet. Any jeweler pushing them is trying to unload these stones. Rats froma sinking ship. And that ship is EGL.

Stick to GIA or AGS 0 or 1 for light performance.

Okay. And use a different jeweler. Where are you, we can help you find a reputable one who has YOUR best interests at heart, not his own.

 

[blingbuyer]

Thanks. Im in North NJ. I have been reading a bunch of threads but not sure im very comfortable ordering a ring online without seeing it. Not that i really know what to look for.

The jeweler i went to was who my buddy bought his from who came highly recommended from a friend of his. So he does seem to trust this person. However, i want to do my due diligence.

 

[Gypsy]

Okay. So I actually lived in NJ when I was engaged. It was before I found Pricescope and my poor fiance ended up going to Philly, NJ, NY, and DE before he found a decent jeweler and a nice stone.

But that was over 10 years ago (the engagement).

So... I can simplify this for you. You are near NY so:

Call Brilliantly Engaged (formerly Engagement Rings Direct): http://www.brilliantlyengaged.com/

Ask for an appointment and tell them you are looking for a great princess with excellent cut and performance and give them your budget. Stick to H or better color. And SI1 or better and eyeclean. GIA/AGS only.

They will spend time with you, and will give you both personalized service and a lot of knowledge so you can make in informed choice.

Alternately, if you don't mind going a little further out to Long Island you can go to Good Old Gold: http://www.goodoldgold.com/ Do the same thing there: make an appointment, tell them you want a princess and give then your budget, etc.


You don't have to shop online. These are both brick and mortar stores. I have several friends who have happily purchased from both of them. I would personally purchase from either, and happily. And they will make sure you get both the knowledge you need to make a good decision, and make sure you get a nice ring for your lady.

And if you have the time... go to both. It's worth it to make sure you are getting what you need.

Most people don't know much about jewelry. Including your friend. Most of the long time posters here are jewelry hobbyists who know a lot about jewelry, so please take advantage of that.

Also if you do need an appraisal (and you might) you want to make sure you DO NOT go to one that is otherwise affiliated with any store. You want an independent appraiser that is working to help you... not one that is looking to make a sale by inflating an appraisal or by talking down another vendor's goods. I've heard good things about David Wolfe in NY, though I have never used him myself. http://www.justappraisers.com/

 

[blingbuyer]

Thanks. So as long as its GIA or AGS rated excellent or better it should be good?
WHen i do meet with them, what questions should i be asking?

Also how do negotiations work? Do you usually pay what the price says on the website or does one typically pay less? Do the diamonds typically appraise for more than the price? Should i get a 3rd party appraisal prior to purchasing? How much does that cost?

Thanks.

 

[Gypsy]

Thanks. So as long as its GIA or AGS rated excellent or better it should be good?
WHen i do meet with them, what questions should i be asking?

Also how do negotiations work? Do you usually pay what the price says on the website or does one typically pay less? Do the diamonds typically appraise for more than the price? Should i get a 3rd party appraisal prior to purchasing? How much does that cost?

Thanks.

With AGS and 0 rating on the light performance is enough. With GIA, no the lab report is not enough. GIA does not grade princesses for cut. Only AGS does.

The entire purpose of faceting a diamond is to reflect light.
How well or how poorly a diamond does this determines how beautiful it is.
How well a diamond performs is determined by the angles and cutting. This is why we say cut is king. With fancies though (anything other than a round brilliant), that is a little complicated. But no other factor: not color, not clarity has as much of an impact on the appearance of a diamond as its cut.

There really is no other way to determine if you have a good princess is to see images of the stones, see the stone in person, and then you need is a way to check actual light performance of your actual stone.

That's what an ASET image does. http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=education-performance Please read.
And ASET shows you how and wear your diamond is reflecting light, how well it is going at it, and where you are losing light return That is why you won't see us recommending vendors like Blue Nile, as they do not provide images or ASET images for their diamonds. James Allen and Good Old Gold do this. So do Brian Gavin and Whiteflash and High Performance Diamonds. If shopping in person, they will have the ASET scope for you.

Here is what I mean. Compare these two:

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut/1.00-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-sku-295886
G color
VS2
Depth 76.3
Table 69
Ratio: 1.01
Excellent polish
Good Symmetry
Girdle Medium

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut/1.00-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-sku-283672
G color
VS2 clarity
Depth 76.2
Table 69.9
Ratio: 1.02
Very good polish
Very good symmetry
Girdle Thin to Slightly thick

Numbers are VERY close right? And the first one has a better girdle. And while the symmetry on the first one is only good, that's not a disqualifier with princeses.

Now look at the pictures. The first one is a VERY dark stone, and frankly a dog as far as princesses go. Second one is an AGS0 with ideal light return and is very bright, with just enough patterning to provide contrast.

In summary. If you go to BE or GOG they will have an ASET. And they will show you how to pick stones in person.

 

[JulieN]

Terrible, 80% table. Are you looking for a square or a rectangle?

 

[blingbuyer]

Thanks. So as long as its GIA or AGS rated excellent or better it should be good?
WHen i do meet with them, what questions should i be asking?

Also how do negotiations work? Do you usually pay what the price says on the website or does one typically pay less? Do the diamonds typically appraise for more than the price? Should i get a 3rd party appraisal prior to purchasing? How much does that cost?

Thanks.

With AGS and 0 rating on the light performance is enough. With GIA, no the lab report is not enough. GIA does not grade princesses for cut. Only AGS does.

The entire purpose of faceting a diamond is to reflect light.
How well or how poorly a diamond does this determines how beautiful it is.
How well a diamond performs is determined by the angles and cutting. This is why we say cut is king. With fancies though (anything other than a round brilliant), that is a little complicated. But no other factor: not color, not clarity has as much of an impact on the appearance of a diamond as its cut.

There really is no other way to determine if you have a good princess is to see images of the stones, see the stone in person, and then you need is a way to check actual light performance of your actual stone.

That's what an ASET image does. http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=education-performance Please read.
And ASET shows you how and wear your diamond is reflecting light, how well it is going at it, and where you are losing light return That is why you won't see us recommending vendors like Blue Nile, as they do not provide images or ASET images for their diamonds. James Allen and Good Old Gold do this. So do Brian Gavin and Whiteflash and High Performance Diamonds. If shopping in person, they will have the ASET scope for you.

Here is what I mean. Compare these two:

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut/1.00-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-sku-295886
G color
VS2
Depth 76.3
Table 69
Ratio: 1.01
Excellent polish
Good Symmetry
Girdle Medium

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/princess-cut/1.00-carat-g-color-vs2-clarity-sku-283672
G color
VS2 clarity
Depth 76.2
Table 69.9
Ratio: 1.02
Very good polish
Very good symmetry
Girdle Thin to Slightly thick

Numbers are VERY close right? And the first one has a better girdle. And while the symmetry on the first one is only good, that's not a disqualifier with princeses.

Now look at the pictures. The first one is a VERY dark stone, and frankly a dog as far as princesses go. Second one is an AGS0 with ideal light return and is very bright, with just enough patterning to provide contrast.

In summary. If you go to BE or GOG they will have an ASET. And they will show you how to pick stones in person.

Thank you. I am starting to understand. So really, just by looking at a stone under light, you cant fully understand the performance without ASET correct? Now, if someone doesnt provide ASET or its not graded by AGS or GIA can i tell them to? For example, can i ask the jeweler i previously spoke(or the next one i speak with) with to have it rated by AGS or give me a ASET image if they dont provide one?

Also to note i am color blind. So i fear that my judgement looking at stones is not going to be the best. So does this mean i really should stick with AGS 0?

As far as AGS 0's go, what is the biggest i could get in my price range(up to ~$12k)?

THANK YOU AGAIN! for taking the time to explain this. much appreciated.

 

[blingbuyer]

Terrible, 80% table. Are you looking for a square or a rectangle?

Is there a table % that i should look to be around? Thanks!

 

[Gypsy]

Please call the two jewelers I recommended. Shopping in person is different than shopping online. In some ways it is riskier. You HAVE to have a very good vendor. And I've given you two of our best.

Stop working with this current guy, that was recommended to you by someone who knows NOTHING about jewelry and probably got ripped off themselves. And please call the jewelers above.

 

[blingbuyer]

Please call the two jewelers I recommended. Shopping in person is different than shopping online. In some ways it is riskier. You HAVE to have a very good vendor. And I've given you two of our best.

Stop working with this current guy, that was recommended to you by someone who knows NOTHING about jewelry and probably got ripped off themselves. And please call the jewelers above.

Thanks. I already reached out to brilliantly engaged. So i am hoping to visit them this week. GOG is a little far unfortunately. But if its really worth visiting i can probably find a way. I have a few friends that all want me to go to their guy. so i feel obliged to at least go and see what they have to offer. I just want to know what to ask when i do go. I put a hold on the stone i saw at the other jeweler when i was there (said he would hold it for 30 days while i do my due diligence). So i have to go back even if its to say no thank you and get my $100 deposit back.

 

[blingbuyer]

A few other questions.

If i plan to go with AGS0, then am i going to find a better deal online as opposed to brilliant engagement or GoG?

Any recommendations for a type of setting?

Thanks.

 

[Gypsy]

Mark's team at ERD/BE will take care of you.

Keep us updated. And yes, if you want to shop at different jewelers insist on an AGS0 graded princess.

 

[blingbuyer]

Mark's team at ERD/BE will take care of you.

Keep us updated. And yes, if you want to shop at different jewelers insist on an AGS0 graded princess.

Thanks. As far as their process goes at BE. When i go to look at rings, will they give me a few days to allow me to post the ASETs on here for your feedback? How does their negotiation work? Are they flexible or is it pretty much the price they show is the best price?

 

[Gypsy]

They have very good prices. There is very little negotiation because their prices compete with internet only vendors so they are competitive.
As for posting ASETs.

Read the links I posted for you. Learn how to read an ASET. And you won't need to post them here. It's very easy. And we can help you learn. That way, you can do the evaluation yourself.
That's what this process is about. Not us choosing for you. But us educating you so you can chose for yourself. Of course if you want our input, then post here and as BE to hold the stones 48 hours for you.

 

[blingbuyer]

I had a very good meeting with Mark. He gave me a tutorial, showed me out to view an idealscope. I am meeting with him again later in the week to see some of his selections in my price range.

 

[blingbuyer]

Another question. I have been reading about Solasfera Princess cuts. Thoughts on these? Are they really that much more brilliant than comparables?