Price and cut for a D, VS2 1.51 round

[chriseric67]

I'm purchasing a D, VS2, 1.51 round diamond for $12,800. My only concern is that it was GIA certified in 2001 before they rated cut. measurements are 7.24x7.38x4.68, polish is rated Very Good, Symmetry is Good. Table is 58 and depth is 64.0 which seems a little deep. Girdle is extremely thin to medium. No flouresence.

Any thoughts on overall price and cut?

 

[krisjon]

It's cheap for a reason.
Something truly ideal cut with similar color/clarity would be considerably more $.

 

[Gypsy]

Way too deep. Pass.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Not a well cut stone...

 

[Texas Leaguer]

I'm purchasing a D, VS2, 1.51 round diamond for $12,800. My only concern is that it was GIA certified in 2001 before they rated cut. measurements are 7.24x7.38x4.68, polish is rated Very Good, Symmetry is Good. Table is 58 and depth is 64.0 which seems a little deep. Girdle is extremely thin to medium. No flouresence.

Any thoughts on overall price and cut?

The reason people are advising you to pass is because cut quality is the key to the diamond's magic. Top cut quality will enable peak light performance - fire, brilliance, sparkle. Getting a good deal on a diamond of nice size, color and clarity is wonderful. But you don't want to do it at the expense of the magic.

 

[Gypsy]

The entire purpose of faceting a diamond is to reflect light.
How well or how poorly a diamond does this determines how beautiful it is.
How well a diamond performs is determined by the angles and cutting. This is why we say cut is king.
No other factor: not color, not clarity has as much of an impact on the appearance of a diamond as its cut. An ideal H will out white a poorly cut F. And GIA Ex is not enough. And you must stick to GIA and AGS only. EGL is a bad option: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/egl-certification-are-any-of-them-ok.142863/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/egl-certification-are-any-of-them-ok.142863/[/URL]
So how to we ensure that we have the right angles and cutting to get the light performance we want?
https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/diamond-cut
Well one method is to start with a GIA Ex, and then apply the HCA to it. YOU DO NOT USE HCA for AGS0 stones. HOWEVER -- we don't need to do that with your stone. A stone wtih 64% depth is NOT going to have the right angles for optimal light performance AND is going to face up small for it's stated carat weight (which this one is doing).
https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/holloway-cut-advisor is how you can determine if your stone has the right angles.
The HCA is a rejection tool. Not a selection tool. It uses 4 data points to make a rudimentary call on how the diamond may perform.
If the diamond passes then you know that you are in the right zone in terms of angles for light performance. Under 2 is a pass. Under 2.5-2.1 is a maybe. 2.6 and over is a no. No score 2 and under is better than any other.
Is that enough? Not really.
So what you need is a way to check actual light performance of your actual stone.
That's what an idealscope image does. https://www.pricescope.com/wiki/diamonds/firescope-idealscope
It shows you how and wear your diamond is reflecting light, how well it is going at it, and where you are losing light return. That is why you won't see us recommending Blue Nile, as they do not provide idealscope images for their diamonds. BGD, James Allen, GOG, HPD, ERD and WF do.

The Idealscope is the 'selection tool'. Not the HCA.
So yes, with a GIA stone you need the idealscope images. Or you can buy an idealscope yourself and take it in to the jeweler you are working with to check the stones yourself. Or if you have a good return policy (full refund minimum 7 days) then you can buy the idealscope, buy the stone, and do it at home.


Now if you want to skip all that... stick to AGS0 stones and then all you have to do is pick color and clarity and you know you have a great performing diamond. Because AGS has already done the checking for you. That's why they trade at a premium.

 

[Gypsy]

You would be better off BY FAR with an eyeclean G SI1 GIA Ex cut with a good HCA score and a strong idealscope.

 

[chriseric67]

Thanks everyone for all the replies. I always hear that the difference between 1 or 2 color grades isn't noticeable to most people and that I wouldn't notice an SI-1 vs VS-2 if it's eye clean. Would this cut quality actually be noticeable either? The closest comparable diamonds I've found with these proportions are rated Very Good for cut even given the 64 depth

 

[EvangelineG]

Yes, yes and yes. The cut quality is much more noticeable than clarity (the eye can only see things that are of a certain size), and colour (some people seem to be more colour sensitive and some less so, and a well cut stone will appear much brighter and whiter than a poorly cut one even if its colour grade is a bit lower).

When I first started diamond shopping at B&M stores, most of the diamonds looked pretty good to me. Except for the ones with large obvious inclusions, they all looked great and sparkled under the intense jewellers lighting, some a bit nicer or whiter than others, but not a huge difference. Then I was shown my first ideal cut diamonds (hearts on fire brand-seriously overpriced but beautiful) and the difference was unbelievable. Those things danced! And had so much visual presence and edge to edge sparkle that smaller carat sizes looked considerably larger than the ones I had previously been looking at. There was no going back for me after that.

I recommend finding some ideal cut diamonds to look at locally. Hearts on Fire are carried all over the place. Look at them with your own eyes, and then decide for yourself whether cut quality is worth the money to you personally. And then you can come back here to get help choosing the diamond that is right for you for the best price.

 

[Texas Leaguer]

Thanks everyone for all the replies. I always hear that the difference between 1 or 2 color grades isn't noticeable to most people and that I wouldn't notice an SI-1 vs VS-2 if it's eye clean. Would this cut quality actually be noticeable either? The closest comparable diamonds I've found with these proportions are rated Very Good for cut even given the 64 depth

According to all knowledgeable diamond people, as well as GIA themselves, the quality of the cut has more impact on beauty than any other characteristic. And given that the GIA cut grading system is quite broad, even a "very good" cut involves a significant compromise in beauty versus a precision cut ideal. So yes, this cut quality will be noticeable, especially in lower light situations (the real world) when compared to a top cut.

It's a little like the Mohs scale for hardness in that diamond is 10 and sapphire is 9. It sounds pretty close but it is estimated that diamond is orders of magnitude harder than sapphire, even though they represent the top two spots.