I live in a warzone. Oh wait, no, I'm in St. Louis.

[Gypsy]

I watched this today.

This captures everything, better than I could ever say: http://www.upworthy.com/if-you-have-to-tell-your-kids-this-stuff-then-you-probably-arent-a-white-per?c=ufb2



Please watch it with an open mind. And an open heart.

 

[lulu]

My only point is that we don't have all the facts yet and I am withholding judgment.

 

[Gypsy]

My only point is that we don't have all the facts yet and I am withholding judgment.

I think that's fair.

 

[ame]

That video is heartbreaking and true. I mentioned that whole white privilege thing in my original post. I have no idea what it feels like to feel how they feel. Though I admit I now feel less comfort than ever before around law enforcement.

 

[ame]

My only point is that we don't have all the facts yet and I am withholding judgment.

we never will.

 

[ame]

Apparently tonight police rolled back up in armored vehicles and began firing smoke bombs and (unconfirmed) tear gas. It's been restored again by the state patrol, I am trying to follow Antonio French and figure out wtf happened. This is all in the last 20-30 min.

 

[Gypsy]

Apparently tonight police rolled back up in armored vehicles and began firing smoke bombs and (unconfirmed) tear gas. It's been restored again by the state patrol, I am trying to follow Antonio French and figure out wtf happened. This is all in the last 20-30 min.

I saw it on facebook. I was amazed.

I can't image ame. I'd be feeling angry and impotent, and yes, ashamed.

 

[AGBF]

I watched this today.

This captures everything, better than I could ever say: http://www.upworthy.com/if-you-have-to-tell-your-kids-this-stuff-then-you-probably-arent-a-white-per?c=ufb2

Please watch it with an open mind. And an open heart.

Before I logged onto the computer this morning, I read the newspaper. When I saw this posting by Gypsy, it reminded me of one of the several very moving letters to the editor in, "The New York Times" I had read today.

To the Editor:

Thoughts of a black mother to a mixed-race child:

The other night, I had to have him go over the rules again.

“But, Mom,” he whines, “I don’t go out at night.” At 10, he can think only of McDonald’s as the most interesting place he can go to after dark is. “Go over them for me anyway.” He sighs. Wiggling under his covers, he leans back on his fuzzy green pillow and recites:

“Don’t run after dark. It doesn’t matter if your little buddies are running or not. Don’t you run.

“Don’t put your hood up. People will think that you’re hiding your face. Keep your hands visible at all times. If you reach in your pocket, people will assume that you have a weapon. Always be scrupulously polite. Yes, sir, ma’am, officer. No, sir, ma’am, officer.

He looks at me and asks why. Why must he learn these strange rules that won’t apply until “forever from now”? And I hesitate. How to explain my fear? That six or seven years isn’t forever from now.

How do I explain the pure selfishness of my motives? That I see Emmett Till, murdered at 14 in Mississippi, in his eyes, Michael Brown in his height. That I’m afraid that I could never be as strong as their mothers were forced to be.

I brush the curls off his forehead. And I lie: “For the same reason I taught you to be careful around the stove long before I let you cook. Because if you follow the rules, you’ll be safe.”

ELICE A. SMITH
Salina, Kan., Aug. 15, 2014


Deb/AGBF

 

[packrat]

IF this is the way it is playing out, then YES they are a bunch of ****holes. What pisses me off to no complete end is the broad COPS are this way. COPS are that way. COPS are shitbags. **** THE PO-LICE vibe I get EVERY SINGLE TIME something happens. And it's an instant vibe-the very second a cop fires his service weapon, we are out to get him w/out knowing the facts of the case. NOT ONCE do I hear "This specific bunch of officers are taking the law into their own hands" "This officer X did something wrong" Nope. Cops. Always. That's what I get pissy about. And when I say we aren't there, NONE OF US is that cop and the man who was killed. NONE OF US knows what happened. People's eyes and minds see what they want sometimes. Or what they expect to see, sometimes. Not always. Not maybe even in this instance. But sometimes. Lumping everyone into the same category doesn't get us anywhere, and if nothing else, it ****s w/GOOD cops minds and their hearts. Do we want that? Ehhh feck it, they all think we're *******s anyway. I would never condone actions such as that cop took, if they were the wrong actions, and for the wrong reasons. No true officer would. But not all officers do bad things. That's what I get riled up about. And what very few people seem to get.

 

[momhappy]

This thread serves no purpose except to perpetuate the confusion, the negativity, etc. (no offense to OP).
I know very little about the actual case and withhold my judgement accordingly. I wasn't there - so why pretend like I could possibly know how it all went down (from shooting to looting….). I will probably never fully comprehend the situation, but I'm certainly not going to contribute to the chaos by finger-pointing, blaming, vilifying, stereotyping, etc. After all, none of that changes the actual events.

 

[Karl_K]

Packrat, I get it I really do but this is not an isolated incident.
I know in my area that the cops have killed several people unjustly in the last 10 years and paid out millions of dollars.
No we don't have all the facts of the original incident but we do have plenty of information of the jbt response to the protests.

We have thugs in armored cars pointing guns in peoples faces.
Growing up it was if someone points a gun at you they are trying to kill you and respond accordingly.
Gee isn't that what cops are taught?
Yet they go around pointing weapons at innocent people?

 

[AGBF]

This thread serves no purpose except to perpetuate the confusion, the negativity, etc.

In your opinion.

In my opinion it is one of the most important threads that has been started in Hangout this year and served the the purpose of raising questions among people that otherwise would not have been raised.

One of those questions is: why can the news media still be totally silenced, "blacked out" in ame's terms, in the United States. Our Constitution (in its Bill of Rights) guarantees us Freedom of the Press.

A second of those questions is: why is there still inequality under the law? Why is it still easier to be shot dead and harder to receive CPR (which was offered by a nurse on the scene but not allowed by the police) if you are a young, unarmed, black teenager than a young, unarmed, white teenager?

A third of those questions is why is it necessary for the police forces of the United States to arm the police, supposed our guardians, with tanks and armor and then to mask the policemen so that they cannot be identified? Why does a street in Missouri look like a war zone in Syria or Iraq or Afghanistan? As one of the letter writers to, "The New York Times" pointed out, the police should all be wearing large name tags or numbers to identify them so that they cannot be anonymous behind their masks and armor. Not that they should be in such garb with such weapons in the first place.

And many more questions were also raised in this thread started by ame.

When you say that she is perpetuating the, "negativity", I think you mean that she is perpetuating the questioning of authority. And as I said to packrat, when the police perpetrate unacceptable acts, the response from the public should be rabid anger. It should be the questioning of authority.

It is positive to look at one's governmental institutions and analyze them as ame did, not negative. We need more people thinking and analyzing and fewer people accepting any old thing the government happens to do. A democracy requires it.

Deb/AGBF

 

[momhappy]

This thread serves no purpose except to perpetuate the confusion, the negativity, etc.

In your opinion.

In my opinion it is one of the most important threads that has been started in Hangout this year and served the the purpose of raising questions among people that otherwise would not have been raised.

One of those questions is: why can the news media still be totally silenced, "blacked out" in ame's terms, in the United States. Our Constitution (in its Bill of Rights) guarantees us Freedom of the Press.

A second of those questions is: why is there still inequality under the law? Why is it still easier to be shot dead and harder to receive CPR (which was offered by a nurse on the scene but not allowed by the police) if you are a young, unarmed, black teenager than a young, unarmed, white teenager?

A third of those questions is why is it necessary for the police forces of the United States to arm the police, supposed our guardians, with tanks and armor and then to mask the policemen so that they cannot be identified? Why does a street in Missouri look like a war zone in Syria or Iraq or Afghanistan? As one of the letter writers to, "The New York Times" pointed out, the police should all be wearing large name tags or numbers to identify them so that they cannot be anonymous behind their masks and armor. Not that they should be in such garb with such weapons in the first place.

And many more questions were also raised in this thread started by ame.

When you say that she is perpetuating the, "negativity", I think you mean that she is perpetuating the questioning of authority. And as I said to packrat, when the police perpetrate unacceptable acts, the response from the public should be rabid anger. It should be the questioning of authority.

It is positive to look at one's governmental institutions and analyze them as ame did, not negative. We need more people thinking and analyzing and fewer people accepting any old thing the government happens to do. A democracy requires it.

Deb/AGBF

Yes, exactly, in my opinion.
Also, my post wasn't directed at any one person, so I certainly didn't say that OP was perpetuating negativity. I said that the thread in and of itself is perpetuating negativity (again, my opinion). I don't see anything productive here (and yet again, my opinion). I don't have issues with analyzing, questioning, thinking, etc., but those things can't happen (productively) without facts (yup, still my opinion).
Having said that, the discussion is clearly not for me, so I'll leave it at that and move on to other threads

 

[packrat]

Yes, it should be examined and should be questioned and should never be allowed to continue. But what I see, is instead of examining, and questioning, and asking why this is occurring and trying to get to the bottom of it, is anger and foaming at the mouth, directed at law enforcement as a whole. things happen slowly. They sneak up on us...softly. Words travel. Hate travels. Every time we shout down LE as a whole, rather than work at figuring out the core/root of the problem, we're letting things sneak up on us. Softly. It takes one person to think the cops are all after us, arming up for a full scale war on the population..and then the next one takes it up and then next one and then the next, and pretty soon you have an entire populace with a mistrust/distrust/disrespect/scorn for every LEO, everywhere. And that's not what is going to make things better. That's when we get officers shot in the face b/c they pulled someone over for something small. That's part of what stops daddies and husbands from coming home. Unwarranted fear. question question question, but don't incite to riot. Bc that's what I'm getting. Blood lust against LE, rather than anger at what happened and a desire to find out why and how to make it stop.

When I went to the spouse's day at the academy, one of the things we were told is "Be prepared for people to hate you" Be prepared for people to hate your spouse, you, your kids, full stop, based on nothing more than the uniform he wears. Be prepared to be the ONLY one, who understands, outside of the law enforcement community. And I have experienced this. And my husband has experienced this. And my kids have experienced this. And this saddens me. And people continue to incite, rather than work at solutions and find answers to problems.

So, that's fine. Let's continue down the path we're headed. Let's fight and scream and call for officers to die, and for their spouses and children to die (which I have seen not here, but elsewhere, too many times to count), let's continue to perpetuate the distrust, the misunderstanding, the hate, let's continue to do exactly what we're rallying *against* to a different group of people, and see where this gets us a few years down the road. When the average citizen is so frightened of LEO's b/c they're all after us, that they'd rather shoot them or fight them out of fear. Let's watch officers try to deal with that somehow, when they're also dealing w/the general bullshit of the law to begin with. Let's let innocent people be caught in the cross fire. And every time an officer is killed out of fear/ignorance/disrespect/mistrust, I'll close my eyes and say a word of thanks that it wasn't *my* officer, and say a word of condolence to the family of that fallen officer. And down the road should the fear and the hate and disrespect and mistrust spread its way to small town Iowa, with everyone's help of course cuz it won't spread on its own, I'll know that I can hold my fear for my husband when he walks out the door, to myself, rather than a support system. Because I need to not only be prepared to have people hate me for no reason, I have to be prepared to spend the rest of my life alone, b/c of the wrath of the citizenry who would rather spread hate than dig down for a reason and look for answers.

 

[Karl_K]

When I went to the spouse's day at the academy, one of the things we were told is "Be prepared for people to hate you" Be prepared for people to hate your spouse, you, your kids, full stop, based on nothing more than the uniform he wears. Be prepared to be the ONLY one, who understands, outside of the law enforcement community. And I have experienced this. And my husband has experienced this. And my kids have experienced this. And this saddens me. And people continue to incite, rather than work at solutions and find answers to problems.

When I was growing up cops were respected and were respectful to people.
Given just the min. interaction I have had with them these days that is no longer the case.
Pulling people over for no just cause to do paperwork checks in direct violation of the 4th amendment on a massive scale with the excuse they are looking for drunk drivers is just one example.

This would be a none story if the officer had used his PA system and said please get off the road for your safety.
Problem solved no one killed.

Treat everyone like the enemy and pretty much it is that way.
It is not a one way street they are being trained just like you said that the people are the enemy.
Treat enough people like the enemy and they become the enemy.
I am not advocating shooting anyone in the face or even hurting anyone except in legal and legitimate self defense.
Why should I not expect LEO to live up to that same standard?

 

[smitcompton]

Hey Packrat,

I think you ought to step back a little. The police handled this peaceful protest badly. Yes, from all accounts that i have read or seen it was a generally peaceful protest until the police arrived in war zone gear. The police caused the escalation, not the protesters. I think most of us good citizens want the police protected, but this was not a case where they were in danger. The protesters were in danger.

The Fergeson Police Force was removed by the Gov. as soon as he heard the facts. When behavior is wrong, it is just wrong. This is no way reflects on you or your husband or good policemen. . You should be as outraged as the rest of us.



Annette

 

[kenny]

Only a moron lumps all people from a group together, whether it's a race or police.
Who shives a git what morons think?

ame, thanks for starting this thread.
Sunlight is the best disinfectant.

Discussion is GOOD.
Silence perpetuates the problem.

I suspect people who want to hush this all up hold perspectives they know they should be, but aren't, ashamed of.
Discussion reveals this so it makes them uncomfortable.

 

[Kaleigh]

It should be discussed. It's a huge problem and one I see growing. Makes me sad. Of course I don't have an answer. But can't ignore it either.
I didn't have to tell my son about the rules that many parents are now telling their young sons... Has my son been harrassed or profiled by cops? Nope.
Hate that these kids have to answer to a whole different set of rules. But that's what it is like here.. SBT.

JMHO...

Glad this thread was started...

 

[Gypsy]

Yes, exactly, in my opinion.
Also, my post wasn't directed at any one person, so I certainly didn't say that OP was perpetuating negativity. I said that the thread in and of itself is perpetuating negativity (again, my opinion). I don't see anything productive here (and yet again, my opinion). I don't have issues with analyzing, questioning, thinking, etc., but those things can't happen (productively) without facts (yup, still my opinion).
Having said that, the discussion is clearly not for me, so I'll leave it at that and move on to other threads

A) Promoting thoughtful discussion and raising awareness is never negative. And it is certainly not without purpose.
B) If you don't like the thread, DO NOT READ IT OR REPLY TO IT. You don't get to decide for the rest of us what has value and what does not. You aren't OUR mother, and you certainly aren't a moderator, thank goodness. We are all adults here and we don't need a net nanny.
C) This DISCUSSION and this THREAD are not negative. And they do not promote "negativity". What is "negative" is what is happening in St. Louis. We are merely discussing it. If you do not understand the distinction, please let me know and I will be happy to explain the distinction.
D) Avoiding hard facts and issues by labeling them 'as negative' is, in my opinion, a complete abdication of our responsibilities as citizens. Have you ever thought about WHY we have the right to bear arms? We have the right to bear arms in order to protect us from the tyranny of government. We have that right so that if the government oversteps and impinges on our rights it is our RESPONSIBILITY to fight it. Now, I'm not advocating anyone take up arms against the cops in St. Louis. But looking into, trying to understand, AND SHARING KNOWLEDGE AND OPINIONS in whatever format, even a thread on the internet, is OUR DUTY. We live in a democracy. WE ARE THE GOVERNMENT. Not just our representatives. And if our representatives, like these select group of cops, are abusing and breaking laws it is our RIGHT and PRIVILEGE to HOLD THEM ACCOUNTABLE. That's why we ALSO have the right to FREE PRESS. SO that the press can KEEP US INFORMED. How are we supposed to do that if the freedom of the press is impinged on by a few select police officials? Well, ONE WAY we can do it, is by having people who are LIVING THESE ISSUES (like ame) share their experiences and MAKE US AWARE OF THEM. And that is what she is doing. In short, instead of criticizing this thread you should be THANKING ame for being a responsible citizen and patriot.
E) Ditto AGBF

 

[ame]

Yes, if you're going to crap all over my thread because you obviously feel differently than the rest of us and don't want a thoughtful discussion, please see your way out. You're entitled to your opinion.

We will never get all the facts. We just won't. The public never does get all the facts. That's a combination of little transparency and shitty media. We can only hope for a fair trial away from this area, and that all the witness testimony and security footage is in the hands of the investigators and they see what really happened and all admitted for the judge and jury. This kid did NOT deserve his fate. Period. Walking in the middle of a residential street is not illegal. In my suburb or Ferguson. There was no legal ground for that altercation to even begin. Beyond that, the city of Ferguson and it's citizens DID NOT deserve a goddamn militia to roll up on their protest, and that's gotta be agreed upon by now. I am so damn sick of the "these nwords deserve it. all these damn nwords bleeding our resources, what trash" comments I keep seeing,hearing, and reading as implication. WE ARE ALL EQUAL. ALL. EQUAL. People need a damn wakeup call and Ferguson was a pretty damn good alarm clock.

The latest:
-The Ferguson Police Chief has changed the story now three times. First they were sure it was him, here's the report and the stills. Then he came back a few hours later and said the Officer in question did not know this kid was related to the shoplifting situation, had no knowledge of that call, then a few hours later came back again and says that the officer saw the cigars in this kid's hands and assumed he was the suspect. They can't even keep their character assassination straight.

All quotes from this WashPost article:
"I did not see the suspect in the area,” an unidentified officer wrote in the report."

The key witness, Dorian, placed the cigars he was handed back on the counter. He did not walk out with any items. And the DOJ had already told the Ferguson Police not to release the stills and video. They did it anyway.


'In an unusual public disagreement, the law enforcement official newly in charge of security in Ferguson appeared to question the decision to name Brown as a robbery suspect. “I would have liked to have been consulted,” Missouri State Highway Patrol Capt. Ronald S. Johnson said Friday, adding that he would meet with Jackson to discuss “how that was released.’’

-The FBI wants more witnesses. Some of the witnesses saw it in person and are scared to come forward. Many who have come forward have provided video and photos of the incident.

-The county prosecutor has started a Grand Jury Investigation.

-Damn near everyone (senators, citizens) has been asking the Governor and state Atty General to relieve the County Prosecutor of his duties in this case. How this case goes will make or break the County Prosecutors reelection campaign, most likely.
"St. Louis County Executive Charlie Dooley later said he is leading an effort to remove the county prosecutor from the investigation because of bias. McCulloch is the person who will decide whether state charges will be filed against the police officer."


-One of our local news stations showed the involved officer's home on the 5pm news yesterday. It was met with absolute rage from the community, well, mostly white people on Facebook anyway. They apologized for doing that but as you can imagine that didn't do much to help and probably just made it worse. I don't agree with that choice, I think that was a key example of what's wrong with our media and the reporting of this kind of stuff.

-A curfew has been imposed for tonight from midnight to 5am. There were some instigators last night that the citizens and people like Antonio French were able to talk down, one of whom threw a bottle at police in a fit of hostility, and the citizens and Mr. French, among others, calmed the guy down. The citizens themselves have reigned in any attempts at looting--one of the targets was the convenience store in the video--and it is why they brought out the armor again, it was in and out quickly. There have been several confirmed reports that there are militia groups coming in from other cities stirring shit up, as well, that the Nation of Islam and Black Panthers are actually doing a fantastic job to keep the crowd in control.

 

[Kaleigh]

Living in Philly, we get this more than I can say... And the woman that raised me was black. Her brother spent his whole life in jail while public defenders didn't do their job. He got pardoned.. 18 and locked away... It's a very well known case..


I pray for justice for the family and hope they can get some peace...


And not to open a can of worms... I seem to hear cops rather than police... Cops being the slang term... I think cops has a negative ring to it... Police more respected but all mute to me at this point...

 

[AGBF]

Every time we shout down LE as a whole, rather than work at figuring out the core/root of the problem, we're letting things sneak up on us. Softly. It takes one person to think the cops are all after us, arming up for a full scale war on the population..and then the next one takes it up and then next one and then the next, and pretty soon you have an entire populace with a mistrust/distrust/disrespect/scorn for every LEO, everywhere.

...​

So, that's fine. Let's continue down the path we're headed. Let's fight and scream and call for officers to die, and for their spouses and children to die (which I have seen not here, but elsewhere, too many times to count)

packrat-

Calling for the de-militarization of the police force is not calling for the population to spit on the police. There are many civilized countries in which the police do not even bear arms and the citizens respect them.

I, personally, hold the police of my own town in the greatest respect. A couple of months ago when two officers I did not know came into a fancy tea shop, usually frequented by upper middle class women buying small salads and fancy coffees, I immediately asked the cashiers to put whatever they ordered on my bill. The police steadied the neck of my 93 year-old father when he fell down a flight of stairs to the basement and hit his head on the concrete last September. It turned out he had broken small bones in his cervical spine. The officer who came in before the paramedics arrived was smart and alert and caring enough to to hold his neck steady so that no further damage was done before an ambulance arrived. I love my local police. They, also, always treat my mentally ill daughter appropriately and with intelligence.

Criticizing the militarization of the police; the unconstitutional blackout of news; or the shooting of an unarmed black teenager is not disparaging all policemen.

Deb

 

[ame]

Tonight might get ugly but I am REALLY hoping not. The curfew being announced was not well received. It's about 40 minutes from going into effect, and the neighboring suburbs already have been in curfew for over an hour. There's a lot of venom being spewed about it, but while I get that they are being silenced before they're ready to stop screaming, it's pouring rain, and it's probably a good idea to take some time to reflect on the day, and get some rest. They have many more days ahead of them. It's thinning out, and hopefully people really take it seriously.

The looters come from elsewhere, and I hope if they come out again, they're immediately apprehended. I think it's safe to say everyone's about sick of that.

 

[Karl_K]

This is just getting more and more stupid.
State police used smoke and cs gas grenades on a few protesters who broke curfew then lied about using cs gas until they got got caught in the lie then said oh yea we did use it.

 

[momhappy]

Yes, exactly, in my opinion.
Also, my post wasn't directed at any one person, so I certainly didn't say that OP was perpetuating negativity. I said that the thread in and of itself is perpetuating negativity (again, my opinion). I don't see anything productive here (and yet again, my opinion). I don't have issues with analyzing, questioning, thinking, etc., but those things can't happen (productively) without facts (yup, still my opinion).
Having said that, the discussion is clearly not for me, so I'll leave it at that and move on to other threads

A) Promoting thoughtful discussion and raising awareness is never negative. And it is certainly not without purpose.
B) If you don't like the thread, DO NOT READ IT OR REPLY TO IT. You don't get to decide for the rest of us what has value and what does not. You aren't OUR mother, and you certainly aren't a moderator, thank goodness. We are all adults here and we don't need a net nanny.
C) This DISCUSSION and this THREAD are not negative. And they do not promote "negativity". What is "negative" is what is happening in St. Louis. We are merely discussing it. If you do not understand the distinction, please let me know and I will be happy to explain the distinction.
D) Avoiding hard facts and issues by labeling them 'as negative' is, in my opinion, a complete abdication of our responsibilities as citizens. Have you ever thought about WHY we have the right to bear arms? We have the right to bear arms in order to protect us from the tyranny of government. We have that right so that if the government oversteps and impinges on our rights it is our RESPONSIBILITY to fight it. Now, I'm not advocating anyone take up arms against the cops in St. Louis. But looking into, trying to understand, AND SHARING KNOWLEDGE AND OPINIONS in whatever format, even a thread on the internet, is OUR DUTY. We live in a democracy. WE ARE THE GOVERNMENT. Not just our representatives. And if our representatives, like these select group of cops, are abusing and breaking laws it is our RIGHT and PRIVILEGE to HOLD THEM ACCOUNTABLE. That's why we ALSO have the right to FREE PRESS. SO that the press can KEEP US INFORMED. How are we supposed to do that if the freedom of the press is impinged on by a few select police officials? Well, ONE WAY we can do it, is by having people who are LIVING THESE ISSUES (like ame) share their experiences and MAKE US AWARE OF THEM. And that is what she is doing. In short, instead of criticizing this thread you should be THANKING ame for being a responsible citizen and patriot.
E) Ditto AGBF

You've missed my point entirely. My opinions are simply opinions (just like everyone else here who has expressed opinions) - why one Earth would you presume that I feel like I have some authority as a mother, a moderator, a net nanny, etc.??? I'm not dictating anything. I'm just sharing that I don't think that parts discussion are productive and you're exactly right, I don't have to read or respond to anything. If others feel differently about the dialogue, then that's all that matters

 

[RandG]

Yes, exactly, in my opinion.
Also, my post wasn't directed at any one person, so I certainly didn't say that OP was perpetuating negativity. I said that the thread in and of itself is perpetuating negativity (again, my opinion). I don't see anything productive here (and yet again, my opinion). I don't have issues with analyzing, questioning, thinking, etc., but those things can't happen (productively) without facts (yup, still my opinion).
Having said that, the discussion is clearly not for me, so I'll leave it at that and move on to other threads

A) Promoting thoughtful discussion and raising awareness is never negative. And it is certainly not without purpose.
B) If you don't like the thread, DO NOT READ IT OR REPLY TO IT. You don't get to decide for the rest of us what has value and what does not. You aren't OUR mother, and you certainly aren't a moderator, thank goodness. We are all adults here and we don't need a net nanny.
C) This DISCUSSION and this THREAD are not negative. And they do not promote "negativity". What is "negative" is what is happening in St. Louis. We are merely discussing it. If you do not understand the distinction, please let me know and I will be happy to explain the distinction.
D) Avoiding hard facts and issues by labeling them 'as negative' is, in my opinion, a complete abdication of our responsibilities as citizens. Have you ever thought about WHY we have the right to bear arms? We have the right to bear arms in order to protect us from the tyranny of government. We have that right so that if the government oversteps and impinges on our rights it is our RESPONSIBILITY to fight it. Now, I'm not advocating anyone take up arms against the cops in St. Louis. But looking into, trying to understand, AND SHARING KNOWLEDGE AND OPINIONS in whatever format, even a thread on the internet, is OUR DUTY. We live in a democracy. WE ARE THE GOVERNMENT. Not just our representatives. And if our representatives, like these select group of cops, are abusing and breaking laws it is our RIGHT and PRIVILEGE to HOLD THEM ACCOUNTABLE. That's why we ALSO have the right to FREE PRESS. SO that the press can KEEP US INFORMED. How are we supposed to do that if the freedom of the press is impinged on by a few select police officials? Well, ONE WAY we can do it, is by having people who are LIVING THESE ISSUES (like ame) share their experiences and MAKE US AWARE OF THEM. And that is what she is doing. In short, instead of criticizing this thread you should be THANKING ame for being a responsible citizen and patriot.
E) Ditto AGBF

You've missed my point entirely. My opinions are simply opinions (just like everyone else here who has expressed opinions) - why one Earth would you presume that I feel like I have some authority as a mother, a moderator, a net nanny, etc.??? I'm not dictating anything. I'm just sharing that I don't think that parts discussion are productive and you're exactly right, I don't have to read or respond to anything. If others feel differently about the dialogue, then that's all that matters

Momhappy:

I appreciated your comments and the more tempered vain in which they were offered. Don't defend yourself for one second. I, for one, don't come to this forum to read profanity or comments which spew hatred, negativity and propagate stereotypes.

It's all very easy in cyberspace, protected by total anonymity and accountability, to say anything and people often do. It's what you do and say in the real world that matters. I happen to understand the spirit in which your comments were intended and thank you for trying to bring the discussion to another place. Enjoy your Sunday!

 

[ame]

This is just getting more and more stupid.
State police used smoke and cs gas grenades on a few protesters who broke curfew then lied about using cs gas until they got got caught in the lie then said oh yea we did use it.

There were rumblings that there would be people that disobeyed. I am sad that it was so nasty again.

I read this morning that there will be another autopsy done at the federal level.

 

[SB621]

I can't even comment on Ferguson. I'm worn out recently. Perhaps I'm the only one who feels the world is going to hell in a hand basket lately. The US is divided on race. Europe is screaming that Hilter should have finished the job, Iraqi is beheading those who won't convert from Christianity and Africa is STILL a general mess (pick your poison on a range of reasons there).

AME I'm glad you started the topic. Though I haven't been participating I have enjoyed reading.

 

[AGBF]

I happen to understand the spirit in which your comments were intended and thank you for trying to bring the discussion to another place.

I do not believe momhappy specified to which "other place" she wanted to bring the discussion, RandG. That was my problem with her comments.

momhappy appeared to take exception to this entire thread simply because it existed, because she didn't like having the topic discussed here. She said that the discussion was "negative". In other words, she objected to its seeing the light of day. That doesn't mean that she had specific criticisms of it. You did; you mentioned things like profanity, tarring all posters who spoke with one brush.

Please note that I never use profanity in my writing and also try to use as little slang as possible. I also strive to be courteous in my postings. I do not appreciate writing carefully only to be called names because a careless poster has an agenda of his own to promote. (Yes, that would be you.)

AGBF

 

[Kaleigh]

AGBF nice post.

To me, I didn't read profanity in posts... Saying Damn is profanity?? When someone is shot down and killed it's ok to say something other than heck what were they thinking.. I don't see profanity on here. Rather careful and thoughtful posts.. Yes we get spirited at times and as long as it's not over the top or offensive it's ok with me.... And again you don't have to respond or read if you don't agree... But telling us we can't discuss something that is relevant... Because you don't like it...

This may not be relevant to many. But it is to me and I care. So I would like to discuss.