Ruby questions and LA referrals?

[London]

Look up Intergem. You must have a big one that comes to the LA area.

Thank you! I'm going to look into it!

 

[minousbijoux]

Look up Intergem. You must have a big one that comes to the LA area.

Thank you! I'm going to look into it!

You will have the time of your life - just don't bring any forms of currency!

 

[London]

Look up Intergem. You must have a big one that comes to the LA area.

Thank you! I'm going to look into it!

You will have the time of your life - just don't bring any forms of currency!

haha

 

[slksapphire]

hi london,

have been out of town ... sorry i'm a little late in getting to your post.

robert genis generally posts agl prestige reports (or their stats) for his rubies. most are smaller than what you are looking for, but you can get a sense of the reports and pricing.

http://www.preciousgemstones.com/rubyfs.html

i think you have gotten good advice and you are smart to look at gem fairs. there is no way you will get a fine, untreated 3 ct ruby for under $30,000. at that price point, if you are looking for truly superb color, you are looking at 1-2 carats.

if you are seeking fine color but want more size, you may want to consider star ruby or cabochons (i like the sugarloafs). i think they are a wonderful option. look forward to following your search.

 

[London]

hi london,

have been out of town ... sorry i'm a little late in getting to your post.

robert genis generally posts agl prestige reports (or their stats) for his rubies. most are smaller than what you are looking for, but you can get a sense of the reports and pricing.

http://www.preciousgemstones.com/rubyfs.html

i think you have gotten good advice and you are smart to look at gem fairs. there is no way you will get a fine, untreated 3 ct ruby for under $30,000. at that price point, if you are looking for truly superb color, you are looking at 1-2 carats.

if you are seeking fine color but want more size, you may want to consider star ruby or cabochons (i like the sugarloafs). i think they are a wonderful option. look forward to following your search.

Thank you slksapphire.

Yep, I have shrunken my size requirements to 1 - 1.5 carats to stay below budget. I was actually seriously looking at this one but I do wish it was more of a step cut. Are Robert Genis's prices for the unheated burma rubies a good estimation of what I should expect to spend for this carat range? If so that would be great because I would love to dabble in a few other colored stones with the excess funds

http://www.preciousgemstones.com/1153burufs.html

 

[London]

Look up Intergem. You must have a big one that comes to the LA area.

Thank you! I'm going to look into it!

You will have the time of your life - just don't bring any forms of currency!

I've been looking through the website and there is one coming up close to me in a few months! have you been? Do you know if their will be legit vendors with GIA or AGL certified colored stones? I'll probably go either way but was curious what to expect.

 

[slksapphire]

london, i personally have not been looking for your exact specs so it's hard for me to comment on pricing without any real data. however, genis' prices certainly appear to be reasonable.

i have never purchased from robert genis and do not know the details of his return policy. but, in my opinion, it would be impossible for me to purchase/keep a fine ruby without seeing it in person. that is why i like gem shows. but an online seller is fine as long as the seller offers a reasonable return policy (returns accepted for any reason, within a reasonable time period, with no restocking fee).

 

[chrono]

I looked everywhere but could not find his return/refund policy. I would email him to inquire and if he allows a full refund and return with a decent review period, you have nothing to lose.

 

[London]

Thank you slksapphire and Chrono.

I was at a retail store looking at two rubies yesterday and both had GRS certs that said "vivid red." Both stones seemed to be very close in the shade of red. Do you know if all GRS certified "vivid red" are close in shade? Or does GRS have a large shade range that they call "vivid Red"?

 

[chrono]

I was at a retail store looking at two rubies yesterday and both had GRS certs that said "vivid red." Both stones seemed to be very close in the shade of red. Do you know if all GRS certified "vivid red" are close in shade? Or does GRS have a large shade range that they call "vivid Red"?

I am afraid I do not know the answer to your question because GRS does not provide any explanation as to how they categorize each colour quality.
http://www.gemresearch.ch/certs/certalbm.htm

 

[London]

I was at a retail store looking at two rubies yesterday and both had GRS certs that said "vivid red." Both stones seemed to be very close in the shade of red. Do you know if all GRS certified "vivid red" are close in shade? Or does GRS have a large shade range that they call "vivid Red"?

I am afraid I do not know the answer to your question because GRS does not provide any explanation as to how they categorize each colour quality.
http://www.gemresearch.ch/certs/certalbm.htm

Thank you Chrono

I was afraid of that... So I guess what I am gathering from the chart you posted is rubies from Mozambique are "vivid Red"? Gosh I wish it wasn't so unclear!

I may be considering Mozambique in addition to Burma. It's easier to get in the US and what is most most important to me is color and that the stone is unheated and completely natural. I am doing some comparison internet searching to try and figure out how much of a savings I would get if I went with Mozambique instead of Burma in hopes of a slightly larger stone...

 

[London]

I was at a retail store looking at two rubies yesterday and both had GRS certs that said "vivid red." Both stones seemed to be very close in the shade of red. Do you know if all GRS certified "vivid red" are close in shade? Or does GRS have a large shade range that they call "vivid Red"?

I am afraid I do not know the answer to your question because GRS does not provide any explanation as to how they categorize each colour quality.
http://www.gemresearch.ch/certs/certalbm.htm

Thank you Chrono

I was afraid of that... So I guess what I am gathering from the chart you posted is rubies from Mozambique are "vivid Red"? Gosh I wish it wasn't so unclear!

I may be considering Mozambique in addition to Burma. It's easier to get in the US and what is most most important to me is color and that the stone is unheated and completely natural. I am doing some comparison internet searching to try and figure out how much of a savings I would get if I went with Mozambique instead of Burma in hopes of a slightly larger stone...

Nope this is not true. Just saw a Mozambique GRS cert with "vivid red (GRS type "pigion blood")"...

 

[slksapphire]

if GRS' description of "vivid red" is anything like "vivid blue" for sapphires, it's not worth the paper it's written on. i believe there was a thread about this relatively recently. i personally have seen more than a few "vivid blue" GRS cert-ed sapphires and color has been all over the map in my opinion.

 

[chrono]

We've seen some GRS vivid red rubies on PS that had most of us scratching our heads, which is why I shared that link. GRS has no explanation as to how they come up with their colour designation (which obviously doesn't take tone into account) and they have descriptors that do not help at all.

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/opinions-on-this-ruby.192906/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/opinions-on-this-ruby.192906/[/URL]
[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/mozambique-ruby-did-i-paid-too-much-for-it.183603/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/mozambique-ruby-did-i-paid-too-much-for-it.183603/[/URL]
[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/grs-sapphire-color-classification.32306/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/grs-sapphire-color-classification.32306/[/URL]
[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/my-ruby.37636/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/my-ruby.37636/[/URL]

 

[minousbijoux]

Now "Pigeon Blood" on the other hand is clear as day.

 

[London]

So my search continues. I have been in touch with a few different people so waiting to see what pops up. In the meantime I have continued researching and learning what I can.

Since I have opened up my search to other origins except Burmese rubies that raises the question of origin hierarchy. I know that at the end of the day a fine ruby is a fine ruby but if color and everything else is equal would the other mines like, Madagascar, Tanzania, Mozambique, Winza (any other mine I may be missing) all be lumped in the same category? Or is there a hierarchy within these mines too?

 

[chrono]

London,
Please drop origin for the moment. Only consider origin IF the ruby has the colour you want. A brownish ruby from Burma will not have as much value as a rich intense red ruby from Tanzania. It is colour that counts, first and foremost. Every mine produces gems with varying degrees of quality, ranging from unfacetable to extremely fine, so one cannot say definitively that buying a Burmese ruby is going to guarantee a quality ruby.

To answer your question (if all else is equal), there are several mines in each country with some more well known than others. With Burma as an example, Mogok is better known for producing more fine rubies. Mong Hsu is better known for producing lower quality rubies. Other Burmese mines include Nawarat, Nayaseik, Sagyin, and Katpana regions.

 

[slksapphire]

IF all other factors (color, cut, etc) are equal (which they never are), my view is that with respect to origin, it is burma and everything else. i don't think collectors differentiation much among the "everything else."

 

[minousbijoux]

IF all other factors (color, cut, etc) are equal (which they never are), my view is that with respect to origin, it is burma and everything else. i don't think collectors differentiation much among the "everything else."

Well said.

 

[London]

So my search continues. I have been in touch with a few different people so waiting to see what pops up. In the meantime I have continued researching and learning what I can.

Since I have opened up my search to other origins except Burmese rubies that raises the question of origin hierarchy. I know that at the end of the day a fine ruby is a fine ruby but if color and everything else is equal would the other mines like, Madagascar, Tanzania, Mozambique, Winza (any other mine I may be missing) all be lumped in the same category? Or is there a hierarchy within these mines too?

Eeek sorry, I think my question was confusing because Madagascar, Tanzania, and Mozambique are the origins where the mines are located where as Winza is a mine in Tanzania...

Thank you for your responses Chrono, slksapphire, and minousbijoux.

 

[chrono]

Okay, I understand your question now. Agree with everyone else than IF everything else is equal other than origin (incredibly rare situation), then Burmese trumps all.