Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in NYC.

[pandabee]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

I'm with ya'. I get a flu shot every year too and I agree, it hurts. One of my children is absolutely terrified of vaccines. The last time they had one,it took the doctor and an extra nurse to hold my child down. My kids get the flu vaccine every year too, but I choose the mist now to avoid the shots. Vaccines are worth it though.
I think that in addition to my flu vaccine, I'm going to request a shingles vaccine this year too. I don't think that they recommend them unit about age 50 (and I'm only in my mid-40's), but I've known too many folks (in their 40's) get the shingles (and some cases have been VERY extreme). A good friend of mine got shingles on her face! It sort of makes me wonder what's going to happen in regards to shingles with the kids who have gotten the chicken pox vaccine (which is a required vaccine now). I asked my doctor friend about that just last week and he said that they have no clue what to expect because there's simply no data yet.

Just an FYI, since it's not CDC approved for patients under 50 years old, there is probably little chance you will find a medical provider willing or even able to give you the vaccine until then unfortunately. I do understand your fear though, my mother had shingles twice before she was even 50 so I have been trying to convince her to get the shingles vaccine now in case she gets it again!

This topic really gets me going too, as a member of the medical community. The worst part is, I was reading an article that studied different ways to disprove various arguments against the benefits of vaccinations and you know what the most effective method was? ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. That's right. People who are so vehemently against vaccinations will not listen to medical reason, will not respond to pictures of side effects caused by the diseases that we are trying to vaccinate against, etc etc.

What can anti-vaccers say in this thread and who would want to? The "full attack mode" tone is very strong and clear.

What is left for them to say? It's been made clear that their stance against vaccinations can really hurt themselves and others. This issue isn't as simple as as "I don't like it" or "it's against my beliefs"... this is when your actions (or lack thereof) affect everyone's health. I'm not saying that to be mean ...people can die. They are dying.

This exactly. Basically the anti-vaccination movement is a very selfish one as evidenced by the comments people have brought up such as "well everyone else is vaccinated so it's okay" meaning they do not need to be held responsible for helping others be protected.

 

[momhappy]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

I'm with ya'. I get a flu shot every year too and I agree, it hurts. One of my children is absolutely terrified of vaccines. The last time they had one,it took the doctor and an extra nurse to hold my child down. My kids get the flu vaccine every year too, but I choose the mist now to avoid the shots. Vaccines are worth it though.
I think that in addition to my flu vaccine, I'm going to request a shingles vaccine this year too. I don't think that they recommend them unit about age 50 (and I'm only in my mid-40's), but I've known too many folks (in their 40's) get the shingles (and some cases have been VERY extreme). A good friend of mine got shingles on her face! It sort of makes me wonder what's going to happen in regards to shingles with the kids who have gotten the chicken pox vaccine (which is a required vaccine now). I asked my doctor friend about that just last week and he said that they have no clue what to expect because there's simply no data yet.

Just an FYI, since it's not CDC approved for patients under 50 years old, there is probably little chance you will find a medical provider willing or even able to give you the vaccine until then unfortunately. I do understand your fear though, my mother had shingles twice before she was even 50 so I have been trying to convince her to get the shingles vaccine now in case she gets it again!

This topic really gets me going too, as a member of the medical community. The worst part is, I was reading an article that studied different ways to disprove various arguments against the benefits of vaccinations and you know what the most effective method was? ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. That's right. People who are so vehemently against vaccinations will not listen to medical reason, will not respond to pictures of side effects caused by the diseases that we are trying to vaccinate against, etc etc.

What can anti-vaccers say in this thread and who would want to? The "full attack mode" tone is very strong and clear.

What is left for them to say? It's been made clear that their stance against vaccinations can really hurt themselves and others. This issue isn't as simple as as "I don't like it" or "it's against my beliefs"... this is when your actions (or lack thereof) affect everyone's health. I'm not saying that to be mean ...people can die. They are dying.

This exactly. Basically the anti-vaccination movement is a very selfish one as evidenced by the comments people have brought up such as "well everyone else is vaccinated so it's okay" meaning they do not need to be held responsible for helping others be protected.

My doctor friend said that I could easily request a shingles vaccine.

 

[ksinger]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Ah, just deserts! Go Twitter!

http://www.slate.com/blogs/bad_astronomy/2014/03/17/jenny_mccarthy_antivaxxer_gets_remedied_on_twitter.html

 

[momhappy]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

^Wow! Thanks for sharing, singer. That was hilarious

 

[msop04]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Ah, just deserts! Go Twitter!

http://www.slate.com/blogs/bad_astronomy/2014/03/17/jenny_mccarthy_antivaxxer_gets_remedied_on_twitter.html

This is great!!! ...too bad the stupidity will continue.

 

[TooPatient]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Thanks Jane & Ksinger!

I am (thankfully!) very skeptical of studies and put a lot of time into doing deeper research so am familiar with the CDC site. The other link I hadn't seen yet, so that is great!

My comment about lack of FACTS is more generally meant. We have the internet and are swamped with information, but so many people are not taught how to identify fact from rumor (anxiety, fear, lie, etc). These are important skills that are hugely lacking in our society. I'd love to see drs mention vaccines (including boosters!) to patients more frequently and make links to FACTS easily accessible to people.

 

[erinl]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

What can anti-vaccers say in this thread and who would want to? The "full attack mode" tone is very strong and clear.

My kids are totally immunized but I totally agree with you Chrono. This is a lynch mob, not a discussion.

 

[kenny]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

What can anti-vaccers say in this thread and who would want to? The "full attack mode" tone is very strong and clear.

My kids are totally immunized but I totally agree with you Chrono. This is a lynch mob, not a discussion.

… as it should be.

Even in this day of PC-everything stupid and dangerous does not get respect.
People who are pro-run-redlights would and should also be met by a lynch mob.

Your liberty ends when you hurt others.

 

[erinl]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

I think everyone who has not had their titres checked in the last three years is just as culpable as the villain moms in Brooklyn. Not that I would get a straight answer from posters on that one.

 

[aljdewey]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

"What would you do if one of your children was legitimately vaccine-injured? Would you continue to vaccine this child, and would you vacc your other kids?"

There is no perfect solution - either side of the equation (to vax or not) carries risk. Vax has potential side effects, and the illness you don't vax against has potential to kill.

If I were weighing risk, I'd think the severity of consequence from disease would outpace the severity of side effects for most vaccines. If I were weighing probability, I'd think the likelihood of contracting/suffering the disease would be higher than the likelihood of catastrophic effects from vaccine. On both of these points, vaccinating would seem to carry the higher likelihood of safety.

I feel as though non-vaxxers are guided more on emotion/belief and less on reason/foundation, and that would reinforce my feeling that it's likely safer to choose the side that lives in reason/logic instead of emotion.

In the above situation -- one kid vaxx injured -- I'd press to see if doctors could isolate what properties were in the vaxx my kid reacted to (eggs, etc.) and look for alternative vaxx that might not contain those elements. I'd want to test my other kids to see if they share the same sensitivities; if so, pursue alternate vaxx for them too and if not, go with primary vaxx.

I feel very strongly that we can't have vaccines made mandatory by law without jeopardizing our overall freedoms (slippery slope).

I'd agree we can't make them mandatory, but I do think that we have every right as communities/societies to prohibit those exercising those freedoms from exposing everyone else to risk. I agree with doctors being able to deny access to their practices; I agree with schools refusing to admit students who aren't vaccinated.

With choice comes responsibility. If you exercise your freedom in choosing to remain unvaxx, you should equally support and expect others to exercise their freedoms in choosing to prohibit your contact with them in community settings.

 

[TooPatient]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

I think everyone who has not had their titres checked in the last three years is just as culpable as the villain moms in Brooklyn. Not that I would get a straight answer from posters on that one.

I don't quite agree with you but I do agree with you. Which is to say that those of us (myself included!) who have not had titres checked are adding to the problem that is allowing these awful diseases to come back but how many people even know to look? I had no idea I needed to consider more vaccines (other than the usual flu and what my dr brings up) because I had always been taught that you have them as kids and are just good to go.

This is where I feel we need to have accurate information out there for people to see. You can't educate yourself on something and make an educated decision if you never knew there was a decision to be made!


Alj -- So much more articulate than I am! Your entire post is great! Including social pressures to vaccine, banning un-vaccinated kids from public schools, requiring volunteers to have titres checked, etc. Vaccinating should remain a choice, but we should also be able to choose to avoid those who don't vaccinate. I'd even be willing to submit my titres to the college if they wanted to require all students & staff be checked and vaccinated as needed.

 

[packrat]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Average Joe doesn't know to check titres. I'd never even HEARD of it until after working at the Dr.'s office. It had never been mentioned. It's hard to blame those who have no idea, just like getting boosters. Those who KNOW need to bring it up.

 

[Haven]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

I love this thread and want to thank everyone for sharing so much valuable information here.

I am a new mom, my son is 15 months old today, and he has been fully vaccinated on the recommended schedule. I believe in vaccinating, and am fully vaccinated myself. The scary thing is that the anti-vax movement seems ubiquitous to this new mom. Nearly any time I peruse any sort of parenting website, blog, play group, etc. I am confronted by bits of propaganda that give me pause, EVEN THOUGH I know that vaccinating is the right thing to do, and EVEN THOUGH my child is vaccinated and will continue to be vaccinated on schedule.

My son has had a mild reaction (moderate fevers) to every vaccination so far, except the flu shot. It is hard to see him feeling ill after every shot, and I get nervous every time he gets another one.

Anyway, this is a sort of ramble. I'm short on time and sleep so I apologize for that. But this thread is exactly what I needed right now, since I've been nervous about his upcoming MMR shot and how he will react to it.

 

[alexah]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Poor girl I remember when I started college, they wouldn't let me on campus until all my shots were up to date; I guess not all schools do that?

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20140318/DACK9A7G0.html

 

[kenny]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Doctors have a dilemma.
Should they allow unvaccinated kids into their offices?
Those kids need medical care too, but it puts all their other patience at increased risk.

Here's one doctor's perspective.

http://www.slate.com/articles/life/family/2014/03/measles_outbreak_in_new_york_city_should_pediatricians_treat_unvaccinated.html

 

[amc80]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Doctors have a dilemma.
Should they allow unvaccinated kids into their offices?
Those kids need medical care too, but it puts all their other patience at increased risk.

Here's one doctor's perspective.

http://www.slate.com/articles/life/family/2014/03/measles_outbreak_in_new_york_city_should_pediatricians_treat_unvaccinated.html

Our pediatrician includes a sheet with all of the new patient paperwork that basically says "We follow the CDC schedule for vaccinations. If you don't wish to vaccinate, it is best if you find a doctor who shares your viewpoint." Or something similar.

 

[recordaras]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

I'm actually quite surprised most doctors don't check titres - it was the first thing my GP did at our first physical, so I thought it was pretty much standard practice.

 

[kenny]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

I'm actually quite surprised most doctors don't check titres - it was the first thing my GP did at our first physical, so I thought it was pretty much standard practice.

The measles vaccine alone is estimated to prevent 1 million deaths worldwide every year per this article about the vaccine's creator, Maurice Hilleman.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A48244-2005Apr12.html

I couldn't google up how many deaths are the result of bad tires but found this from a lawyer site, which has an interest in reporting high numbers.
http://www.yourlawyer.com/topics/overview/aged_tires



Death count: One million every year vs. 128 over a few years.

Yeah, when it comes to threats to public health tires rank right up there with vaccines.

 

[amc80]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

I'm actually quite surprised most doctors don't check titres - it was the first thing my GP did at our first physical, so I thought it was pretty much standard practice.

The measles vaccine alone is estimated to prevent 1 million deaths worldwide every year per this article about the vaccine's creator, Maurice Hilleman.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A48244-2005Apr12.html

I couldn't google up how many deaths are the result of bad tires but found this from a lawyer site, which has an interest in reporting high numbers.
http://www.yourlawyer.com/topics/overview/aged_tires



Death count: One million every year vs. 128 over a few years.

Yeah, when it comes to threats to public health tires rank right up there with vaccines.

I can't tell if this post is sarcastic or not....but you know she said titres, right?

 

[kenny]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

I just thought the thread could use a little levity.

 

[amc80]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

I just thought the thread could use a little levity.

In that case it was pretty funny

 

[random_thought]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

I encouraged DD to just say no the Gardasil "ovarian cancer" vaccine.

I don't feel the iffy science is worth the risk. It MAY help prevent ov cancer, IF it's caused by a few types of HPV (link no proven).

The ovarian cancer rate is actually extremely low, usually 8 out of 100,000 women, .008% of women. Ever wonder why your gyn is so relaxed about giving you your pap smear results? Because it's really not that prevalent.

http://www.cdc.gov/cancer/ovarian/statistics/race.htm

Meanwhile, your chance of being in a serious accident in a car are 1 in 40.

It seems they've been checking under the wrong hoods all these years.

Lucky for me I guess, I'm probably one of those 8. My mother has had ovarian cancer and I also have endometriosis which leads to increased levels. If it MAY help prevent it for me, hell yes I'm going to get it.

Am I allowed to say hell?

 

[momhappy]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

What can anti-vaccers say in this thread and who would want to? The "full attack mode" tone is very strong and clear.

My kids are totally immunized but I totally agree with you Chrono. This is a lynch mob, not a discussion.

I have to agree. There is little room for discussion in this thread - unless you are pro-vaccine. It has been worded as such that not a single anti-vaxxer would dare post here out of fear alone. Even though I am very much pro-vaccine, I happen to think that it would be much more productive if the conversation included dialogue from both sides.

 

[Sky56]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

My Mom died from ovarian cancer...and I think the chance of me dying in a car wreck is higher...but what I am curious about...what about people with egg allergies? Eggs are my one and ony allergy and it is bad. Not life threatening but I get very sick from them, I even had to have a few minor surgeries because of my reaction to them, before I knew to stay away from anything containing them.

I can't get the flu vaccine because of eggs, but correct me if I am wrong. I have to catch it naturally. When I do, I shut down my life and take to bed, and I recover well.

 

[momhappy]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

The gardasil vaccine is intended to provide protection from cervical cancer - not ovarian cancer.

 

[Asscherhalo_lover]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

My Mom died from ovarian cancer...and I think the chance of me dying in a car wreck is higher...but what I am curious about...what about people with egg allergies? Eggs are my one and ony allergy and it is bad. Not life threatening but I get very sick from them, I even had to have a few minor surgeries because of my reaction to them, before I knew to stay away from anything containing them.

I can't get the flu vaccine because of eggs, but correct me if I am wrong. I have to catch it naturally. When I do, I shut down my life and take to bed, and I recover well.

People with allergies to vaccines are not the people who I would deem an "anti vaxxer", they are the group of people who the rest of us can help protect by all being vaccinated.

 

[ksinger]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

My Mom died from ovarian cancer...and I think the chance of me dying in a car wreck is higher...but what I am curious about...what about people with egg allergies? Eggs are my one and ony allergy and it is bad. Not life threatening but I get very sick from them, I even had to have a few minor surgeries because of my reaction to them, before I knew to stay away from anything containing them.

I can't get the flu vaccine because of eggs, but correct me if I am wrong. I have to catch it naturally. When I do, I shut down my life and take to bed, and I recover well.

CDC indicates there are versions of the flu vaccine that do not use eggs....

 

[random_thought]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

The gardasil vaccine is intended to provide protection from cervical cancer - not ovarian cancer.

Well I'm also screwed in that regard lol. You name it, my mom's had it unfortunately.

 

[kenny]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

My Mom died from ovarian cancer...and I think the chance of me dying in a car wreck is higher...but what I am curious about...what about people with egg allergies? Eggs are my one and ony allergy and it is bad. Not life threatening but I get very sick from them, I even had to have a few minor surgeries because of my reaction to them, before I knew to stay away from anything containing them.

I can't get the flu vaccine because of eggs, but correct me if I am wrong. I have to catch it naturally. When I do, I shut down my life and take to bed, and I recover well.

People with allergies to vaccines are not the people who I would deem an "anti vaxxer", they are the group of people who the rest of us can help protect by all being vaccinated.

+1

 

[SB621]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

I sort of like the lynch mod mentality going on. At least it is not a ghost down on PS.
For what it's worth in NC NO ONE I knew vax their kids. I remember being pregnant with our second child and at the park one day all he neighborhood ladies were talking about how brave Jenny McCarthy was. I wanted to beat my head against a brick wall. Normally I try not to judge others, by for the love of green grass and blue skies you are betting your children's health and possible their lives on a person who is only known for being a playboy playmate!!!! I asked them what articles they had read up on which made them feel comfortable denying vaxs. The answer was they saw JM on Letterman.

I get some people don't want to vax for religious or health reasons, but the parents who do it because it is considered the latest granola crunchy fad is what really irritate me.