Transitioning to single income...

[tammy77]

Very well said, Amc. I'm not even wasting my time responding to that demeaning post. Everyone from Circe to Amc summed it up for me already.

 

[missy]

My mom was a SAHM and I am forever grateful. It's time you cannot ever get back and I know she doesn't regret it and my sister and I were lucky she could be a SAHM. After my sister went to college she went back to the work force. Anyway, Circe said it best and thank you to her for doing that. I was disheartened to read TC's post and I am glad most PSers here don't feel that way. Motherhood is perhaps the most important job that ever existed. And I am in awe of good mothers because it is also one of the hardest (though hopefully one of the most rewarding).

 

[Rosebloom]

Very well said, Amc. I'm not even wasting my time responding to that demeaning post. Everyone from Circe to Amc summed it up for me already.

Plus 1

 

[SB621]

read http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/the-exchange/done-baby-boomer-reveal-deepest-financial-regrets-225707221.html

I recommend getting a nanny and not giving up your career to stay home with children fulltime. Perhaps scale back the hours but I would not give up a lucrative career to be some homemaker. Never in 300 years. Never. Too much of a step down. My mother worked as a teacher and we only had partJun-Jul-partAug with a fulltime homemaker at home. And we didn't need one, either. Motherhood is a thankless job, and one should not give up one's entire identity and career just to do motherhood. Homemakers often delude themselves that their kids need them more than those kids actually do. Whatever you do, definitely don't martyr yourself to do homemaker stuff. You will totally lose the respect of kids and spouse if you do. A lot of that role, the other members of the household can and should do for themselves.

I'm not sure what to say here. I would love to be a SAHM. I'd do it in a second if I could. I can't imagine ever regretting that I spent time raising my child. Would I miss my career? Maybe, but not more than I'd miss the opportunity to be with my baby. This post is basically saying that mothers don't matter and aren't needed. I can't think of anything further from the truth. My baby is only 10 months and already wants to be around me more than anyone else. He knows me and knows I'm his mom. That's not something that can ever be replaced by hired help. If someone's identity is completely tied to their career they probably shouldn't let children get in the way. Just my opinion. Motherhood isn't thankless. Sure, a kid may not thank you for making dinner or doing laundry, but when they smile when the see you or want you and only you when they are hurt or sick, that's all the thanks I need.[/quote]

My thoughts exactly. Well said AMC!

 

[MichelleCarmen]

My mom was a SAHM and I am forever grateful. It's time you cannot ever get back and I know she doesn't regret it and my sister and I were lucky she could be a SAHM. After my sister went to college she went back to the work force. Anyway, Circe said it best and thank you to her for doing that. I was disheartened to read TC's post and I am glad most PSers here don't feel that way. Motherhood is perhaps the most important job that ever existed. And I am in awe of good mothers because it is also one of the hardest (though hopefully one of the most rewarding).

This is a very sweet post! I love hearing the daughter of a SAHM praise the experience!

 

[monarch64]

read http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/the-exchange/done-baby-boomer-reveal-deepest-financial-regrets-225707221.html

I recommend getting a nanny and not giving up your career to stay home with children fulltime. Perhaps scale back the hours but I would not give up a lucrative career to be some homemaker. Never in 300 years. Never. Too much of a step down. My mother worked as a teacher and we only had partJun-Jul-partAug with a fulltime homemaker at home. And we didn't need one, either. Motherhood is a thankless job, and one should not give up one's entire identity and career just to do motherhood. Homemakers often delude themselves that their kids need them more than those kids actually do. Whatever you do, definitely don't martyr yourself to do homemaker stuff. You will totally lose the respect of kids and spouse if you do. A lot of that role, the other members of the household can and should do for themselves.

Super wonderful of you to grace us with your opinion, but I'll offer you a hearty "thanks, anyway!" I recommend that you visit a qualified physician to remove your head from your rectum. And, perhaps scale back the time you spend with your head inside your rectum. Never in 300 years could I envision someone with a head so far stuffed up their rectum. NEVER!

 

[marymm]

Very surprised and disappointed to see the lack of tolerance showed to fellow Pser TC1987's dissenting opinion.

 

[Circe]

I think the problem is less with the opinion, and more with its manner of expression. It's one thing to argue for the merits of being a working mother: it's another to do so by denigrating women who make different choices. I think a lot of people will resent the implication that their decisions are worthless and their families secretly hold them in contempt.

I've always thought the SAHM vs. WM debate was just another red herring to keep women fighting amongst themselves so they wouldn't, oh, shatter the glass ceiling and come to expect equal contributions from their partners during the third shift ....

 

[junebug17]

Very surprised and disappointed to see the lack of tolerance showed to fellow Pser TC1987's dissenting opinion.

Marymm, I agree with Circe - of course everyone is entitled to expess their opinion, but there are ways of expressing it without being overly critical, judgemental, harsh, disrespectful and just basically kind of mean. As Circe said, I think it was the way the opinion was expressed. I was also bothered by the sweeping generalizations in TC's posts, and how she presented her opinion as fact.

Missy's beautiful post is at least one small piece of evidence that not all children view their SAHM as a complete loser.

I was going to give my reasons for being a SAHM because TC's post made me feel I was under attack, but ! quickly realized I don't want to play that game and that by defending my decision, I'm allowing her post to get to me too much. I don't owe anyone any explanations about life choices I made. My life and my family are my business. And if anyone (my family included) wants to look down on me for how I've decided to live my life, so be it. I know in my heart I had good reasons for my choice.

I don't believe in being critical with regard to this particular life choice because each individual is different, and each family situation is different and I respect that people need to do what they think is best for themselves and for their families. As an outsider I would not presume to know that.

The fact that so many people were upset by TC's comments is an indication to me that she crossed some kind of line. I realize it's sometimes hard to pinpoint exactly where that line should be, and people will have different opinions as to where it should be, but the general consensus seems to be she found it and crossed it.

 

[distracts]

Very surprised and disappointed to see the lack of tolerance showed to fellow Pser TC1987's dissenting opinion.

I think the problem is less with the opinion, and more with its manner of expression. It's one thing to argue for the merits of being a working mother: it's another to do so by denigrating women who make different choices. I think a lot of people will resent the implication that their decisions are worthless and their families secretly hold them in contempt.

Yeah, it was extraordinarily offensive of her to say that YOU WILL TOTALLY LOSE THE RESPECT OF YOUR KIDS AND SPOUSE. Seriously?? Seriously? My mother was a stay at home mom. Everyone in the house respected the work she did to keep shit running. Now, she actually worked weekends at a hospital lab until I was in middle school, so I don't know if she full-on counts as a SAHM. But it meant a lot to me and my brother that she was always there if we ever had any issue. It's also incredibly judgmental to assume that SAHMs give up their entire identity. It makes me question whether she knows any. I know plenty of SAHMs and the only ones who seem to have given up their entire identities are the ones who imo didn't have much of one outside their husband to start with. Most of the mothers and SAHMs I know are exactly like themselves, just with mini-me attachments. It also seems to create an offensive false equivalence that one's identity is tied up irrevocably in one's career.

All the women in my family except two are or were SAHMs (the one blood-related to me runs a nonprofit, the other one is a doctor). They chose to give up their careers, but just because they gave up a paying job doesn't mean that they gave up on everything in life except their kids. All were involved in PTA and being class mothers - and idk if you have kids, but most schools can't provide a wide range of activities without this. All transitioned into full-time volunteer work once their kids learned to drive. My mother runs a nature center that is near a local elementary school and directs educational programs there that teach kids about nature and allow this underfunded school to provide fun field trips merely by sending a class across the street. One aunt is an environmental activist. One tutors ESL students all day with a nearby school. My grandmother spent much of the civil rights era at sit-ins. Because they chose to focus on something other than a paying career, these options to keep changing the world were open to them. They chose first to change it by having a hands-on role in raising their children to embody the values they hold dear, and, when that work was done, to change it by volunteering in ways that continued to embody those values. TC1987 may find all of those tasks thankless, but I was raised to value helping people regardless of what thanks or payment I receive in return, which makes them personally satisfying to me.

Which is not to say that women who aren't social activists are not also adding good to their families by staying at home. I just don't have any examples of that, because all the women I know who are SAHMs are also very active in volunteer work. That's also not to say that there is not value in being a working mother. I personally hope to continue working once I have a child, but I have no idea the way it'll shake out once that actually occurs. I think women should choose what makes them happy and fulfilled, and for some that will be staying at home and for some that will be working.

TC1987's comment showed absolutely no indication that she understands that people vary and may value different things in life. I think that and the offensive tone are what everyone is reacting to. There are many ways to say that staying at home may not be the right decision for someone without devaluing it as a choice. Rosetta and SB621 both spoke about their decisions to continue working and how those were the right decisions for them without insulting anyone.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Hey, how about us SAHDs? I changed more diapers than most PS women ..

 

[aviastar]

I think the problem is less with the opinion, and more with its manner of expression. It's one thing to argue for the merits of being a working mother: it's another to do so by denigrating women who make different choices. I think a lot of people will resent the implication that their decisions are worthless and their families secretly hold them in contempt.

I've always thought the SAHM vs. WM debate was just another red herring to keep women fighting amongst themselves so they wouldn't, oh, shatter the glass ceiling and come to expect equal contributions from their partners during the third shift ....

Once again, Circe took the words right out of my mouth.

It's not a matter of a dissenting opinion- Dreamer responded with a thoughtful, well reasoned post not two posts later supporting being a working mom and that hasn't been jumped on at all!

TC's post is not causing raised eyebrows because she has a different opinion, but because of her obvious, heavy, and dismissive condescension towards those who maintain homes and families, including nannies.

 

[Polished]

Heavy handed opinions that seek to dictate to others instructions for what to do actually leave people less able to make decisions that would personally suit them.

I've worked part time and I've really cherished the relationships and guidance I've been able to build with our three children over the years. That's not to say that I haven't noticed or admired some of my women friends with busy careers, who've done an amazing job raising their children, sometimes as single parents. My husband's the type to really go for a career and I think I would have resented the extra work load that would have fallen to me if I didn't have the time to do it.

 

[Octavia]

There was a recent article written by a woman who gave up an I-banking career to be a SAHM and wrote about her regrets that brought up basically the same discussion that is happening here. I don't remember where it originally came from because I read it from somewhere it was reposted.

Anyway, I'm a little torn on the issue, as I have never wanted to be a SAHM and don't think I would make a good one, but in some ways it seems so much easier and more practical (not in the sense that being a full-time caregiver is easy, but more lifestyle-wise in that you're always around to nurse when the baby needs it, don't have to mess with a kid's sleep schedules to get them to and from day care, things like that). And I'm sure once my LO is born, I will want to spend as much time with him or her as possible. BUT even though DH and I could probably swing it financially for now, my concern is more long-term. We would not be able to put aside an adequate amount for retirement if I wasn't working, and I firmly believe that one of the best gifts a parent can give their child is that parent's own independence later in life. I've seen how negatively a destitute elderly relative can affect a person's life (thankfully not my own family, but people close to me). When I think of the trade off -- a couple years now where I could stay home but can also ensure that my baby is getting plenty of care and attention even if I work, versus potentially many years of being a burden to my kid(s) down the road -- it really becomes a no-brainer for me. If I were an heiress or had made a gazillion dollars already, this probably wouldn't be a consideration, but the fact is that DH and I can really only rely on ourselves to provide for us and our little one, and for me that includes balancing what I/we need and want now with what is best for the future. Also, it's not so easy to hop on and off the career ladder in my field, so I would always be worried about wanting to go back to work, or needing to if something (heaven forbid) happened to DH or our marriage.

Lots to consider, for sure, and I think that as long as a person has fully thought through the impact of their decision -- either way -- it really comes down to choosing the option that makes the most sense for your own needs and priorities.

 

[MichelleCarmen]

Very surprised and disappointed to see the lack of tolerance showed to fellow Pser TC1987's dissenting opinion.

TC's post was very rude. I tend not to take posts like that one seriously, though, being posts where a person makes rude comments then just runs off and never responds to what was said. It's a basic case of hiding behind the computer screen

 

[Fly Girl]

I think the best way to transition to a single income is to practice living on one income before you quit your job. Start banking your income in a savings account, and live on his salary alone. After a couple of months, you will have a better idea of how the financial part of the arrangement will work for you. This way you can get your finances and accounts on track before dealing with the rest of the issues mentioned by others in this thread.

Good luck.

 

[Amber St. Clare]

read http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/the-exchange/done-baby-boomer-reveal-deepest-financial-regrets-225707221.html

I recommend getting a nanny and not giving up your career to stay home with children fulltime. Perhaps scale back the hours but I would not give up a lucrative career to be some homemaker. Never in 300 years. Never. Too much of a step down. My mother worked as a teacher and we only had partJun-Jul-partAug with a fulltime homemaker at home. And we didn't need one, either. Motherhood is a thankless job, and one should not give up one's entire identity and career just to do motherhood. Homemakers often delude themselves that their kids need them more than those kids actually do. Whatever you do, definitely don't martyr yourself to do homemaker stuff. You will totally lose the respect of kids and spouse if you do. A lot of that role, the other members of the household can and should do for themselves.

This is surprisingly insulting to a broad spectrum of women - mothers in general, SAHMs, nannies, the works. Don't generalize from your anecdotal experience.

One of the reasons that traditionally "female" tasks tend to be devalued is because of this idea that they're worthless, don't require any skill, anybody could do them. So women are either expected to perform this for free as mothers (and I don't just mean the at-home stuff: I also mean all of the community volunteerism which keeps the system functioning, from PTA on out) or they're expected to perform it for peanuts. Call me crazy, but I think somebody watching my kid should be earning more than minimum wage. I'm a lot more concerned with their skill level than I would be with just about any other profession.

And so it becomes a vicious circle: because traditionally female tasks are seen as worthless, women themselves become tarred with that same brush, and then carry its stigma out to professions in the broader spectrum. Did you know that until women took over the professions of secretary and teacher, they used to be considered higher-skill, and be recompensed at an appropriately higher level?

At any rate. For some people, there's a lot of pleasure and fulfillment to be found in devoting their time to their children - not necessarily for the rest of their lives, but frequently when their kids are young. It definitely carries a professional penalty, but, a) sometimes it's worth it, and, b) that's a problem with the system, not with the individual women who make that decision for themselves.

NakedFinger, could I ask ... are you planning for a distant future, or are you at that kind of cross-roads where maternity leave is almost up, or ...? Are you thinking of quitting altogether, or maybe going freelance part time?

My situation is pretty close to the one you outlined initially: as a professor in the humanities, I made a fraction of what my husband did. So, when his company transferred him the week I found out I was pregnant, I gave up a tenure-track job. I now earn a smaller fraction of his income teaching part-time, and take care of our son the rest of the time. Once he and potential future siblings are in school, I'll return to full-time, but for now, it's worth it. I think one reason it was so doable for us is that my husband is very much an each-according-to-his-needs, each-according-to-her-means type. He absolutely regards all the household money and labor as being communal: it's just a question of who's doing what at any given time. In fact, it took him a while to convert me. Initially, I wanted a pre-nup so it wouldn't ever appear that I was taking advantage of him, felt guilty about earning less, the whole shebang ... now, I'm just glad to have had this model of fiscal sanity to emulate! We have joint everythings - bank account, cards, the works - and while we'll discuss bigger purchases with one another, that's less because of money and more because we both want input into new furniture and the like. I think it's doable, so long as you guys talk everything through. Maybe some preemptive couples counseling, just to cover all the issues, even the ones that might not occur to you right now?

What Circe said.

What they both said. How demeaning and insulting this post is. I