Big, lower quality, diamonds?

[MsP]

So, I recently found out that my father has been ring shopping for my mother in hopes of finding a new engagement ring for their anniversary. He''s been very busy at work(you know how big executives are

) and is running out of time. I''ve stepped in and told him that I would look around and see what I could find...here I am.

A little background on the current(and original) ring:

It was bought by his parents for their engagement present. It is .52ct RB, IF, I color, with certs. It is fairly old, so I doubt it is H&A, etc. My mom likes it for sentimental reasons but has no clue about diamonds(cut, clarity, color scale, etc). I know shes not very clarity or color picky as when we were out shopping one day she made the comment that this one ring was really pretty(later found out it was I2

). She likes warmer stones... a good friend of hers has an L and my mom really likes it.

Guidelines I''ve been given:

1. Warmer stone: not brown or yellow but not white. Somewhere in the H-K area.
2. Not to pay for clarity that cannot be seen. ie, don''t buy a VS2 when it looks nearly the same to the eye as an SI2.
3. Between 1.5-2cts.
4. Any shape except for heart.
5. Simple solitare, no sidestones, but not classic tiffany style.

Ideas on where to find this?

I don''t really have a budget, but I know that he won''t go for anything that''s not a "good deal". I know that to most of you, and myself, color, cut, and clarity mean a lot. But this doesn''t seem to be a big concern... as long as it is not completely clouded or peppered, it may be okay.

Thanks!

 

[reena]

any idea at ALL what shape she'd like or a ballpark budget? that's at least a starting point.

 

[MsP]

I know that she doesn't really like princess(radiant, asscher, any square). I think that a round or pear would be the best bet. All of her other dimaonds are round except for one which is princess, but she never wears it.

As for budget, I really don't know. I would say the less, the better. Like I said above, it depends on the stone. The larger the stone, the more he would be willing to pay. He can afford alot more than what he is willing to buy.

Also, I have been looking at DiamondsbyLauren's colored stones and some of those look incredibly appealing. Ideas?

 

[reena]

okay, so maybe a 1.5-2c round brilliant diamond in the H-K color range, with SI1 or SI2 clarity. since you're willing to go with a warmer color stone and lower clarity, you could perhaps afford a diamond that's very well cut. (people here will tell you that the cut is really what's going to determine the stone's overall beauty.)

i'd plug some of those numbers into the pricescope search engine to get an idea of the price range you're looking at.

 

[denverappraiser]

Good Morning, welcome to Pricecsope.

Based on your description, I would concentrate on the center diamond. The ring itself will be come an important issue but the real money is going to be associated with the diamond.

1) Read the tutorial on the main pricescope page or here. It will help you to learn the lingo that the jewelers and dealers are using. Terms like 'eye clean SI2' mean different things to different people.

2) Use the 'search for a diamond' feature on the front page and play with the different variables. This will give you a pretty good idea how size, clarity, color etc. relate to each other and how changes in them will affect the price. This should give you a pretty good idea what you can expect to see for a particular budget.

3) Go shopping. There are lots of stores out there that will be happy to show you what they have. The question of shape is a pretty basic one and you will need to decide if you are more interested in a pear, oval, round or whatever. Don't ask the stores to order in special stones for you until you've got a pretty good idea what you want in the way of size, shape and price.

4) Get serious about the shopping. Pick a dealer or two that you are comfortable doing business with and get down to the nitty gritty details. If they're an online shop, get down to talking about specific stones. If they have a storefront, and they don't have in stock what you want, have them make an offer of a specific stone that they can get. There are lots of people on the forum that love to analyze specific stones if you ask them to help. Just post a message here. If it looks good, have them show you the actual stone you can look at it in person. If you don't love it, don't buy it. Repeat this step if necessary.

5) Get an independent appraisal. This will confirm that it is what you've been told, that you are paying an appropriate price for it, and will let you know if you've overlooked something that you forgot to ask. There are independent appraisers in most major cities (except, apparently, Buffalo NY) and you can find one with the find-an-appraiser link at the top of the page or by clicking here
If the appraiser says something that causes a problem, send it back, otherwise you've got your diamond.

6) The shopping process for the ring itself is actually pretty similar to the above. It's likely that you've now found a jeweler to work with that you like. Ask them about rings. Most diamond dealers, both online and on the street, sell rings as well. Chances are pretty good that if you like their approach to diamonds, you'll like their approach to jewelry. They may just have exactly what you're looking for. When you get the final ring done, go back to the appraiser and get the paperwork done up on the completed project.

It's more fun than it sounds and there's lots of help to be had here.

Neil Beaty, GG ISA
Independent Appraisals in Denver

 

[quaeritur]

Here's one to start with... I'm not finding much within those parameters...

2.27 ct K SI2

 

[MsP]

Just to be clear: This ring is not for me. It is for my mother.

I have been told not to inform her of this, and she is fairly easy going so I'm sure she sill be happy with whatever we(myself, her daughter, and my dad, her husband) pick out.

I did the search engine thing, but when a stone is graded SI2, some look good and others don't. Without pictures, it is really hard to tell. To a normal person(ie a non diamond educated... most of the population) is an SI2 a good grade? I am somewhat anal about clarity but I don't want my views to impact the purchase. As long as it is not horrible, I think she will be happy. Seems like there are quite a few 1.5-1.7ct for 4-5K... that seems fairly reasonable to me!

Besides DBL, are there any other dealer that carry colored stones(more than a slight hue of yellow, more saturated fancy colors). I think this may be a good option for a unique ring. I could integrate her other diamonds as sidestones.

Thanks!

 

[Todd07]

I have just been climbing up the learning curve. Here are the suggestions from one novice to another.






- Sounds like your dad wants to give Mom a visually beautiful stone (i.e. well cut). Best starting place is to use the "Search by Cut Quality" link on the PS home page: https://www.pricescope.com/sift.asp This will weed out the bad performers and help you find something that is really beautiful. An I-J, 1.5+ carat, VS2-SI1, well cut (HCA font>

- Some SI2 are great and some are bad, depends on the stone. An expert may need to see the stone to tell you. If you are looking on-line, pick a vendor and select 2-3 stones that they have in house. For White Flash look through their A Cut Above and Expert selections, for Dirt Cheap Diamonds look through their signature series (I-J color). Most of the vendors have an equivalent category. They can send you pictures and idealscopes of these stones plus their resident expert can look them over and discuss their merits and appearance while you are on the phone. Select 1-2 stones to be sent to a local indepent appraiser for you to view in person.




Good Luck

 

[reena]

i love fancy colored stones but my understanding is that you will usually pay a premium for them, if that's a concern.

you might check out www.icestore.com.

 

[chialea]

If price is a concern, and you like fancy yellow or orange, you could always go with the Gemesis lab diamonds. (www.gemesis.com) They looked lovely to me, and they're real diamonds, produced in a lab, which I think is incredibly cool

(they're also less expensive than natural, with more colour. the oranges are knockout, but don't have the skin tone to wear them)

There's another place who cuts lab-made diamonds, but they don't ever seem to have many of em around. I can dig up the link if you're interested.

 

[alexah]

Another lab-created diamond website is Takara but i remember reading something on their site that it's not v common that they are able to cut the lab-created diamond to much over 1 ct...

 

[Diamondsbybree]

I would check with David again at Diamondsbylauren.com.
I am sure he has the side stones you are looking for.

 

[MsP]

Hmmmm.... takara and gemesis have some great looking 1.4-1.8 stones... extremely reasonable prices too! I will check with DBL, and I want to do a search on these gemesis and takara stones(see advantages/disadvantages).

Although she's never seen one, wouldn't a 1.8ct vivid yellow asscher(or a 1.6 oval) look great in a pave, two toned bezel setting?

I sure would love it!

Thanks for the recs!

 

[valeria101]

----------------
On 8/25/2004 1:59:52 PM anovice wrote:



Guidelines I've been given:

1. Warmer stone: not brown or yellow but not white. Somewhere in the H-K area.
2. Not to pay for clarity that cannot be seen. ie, don't buy a VS2 when it looks nearly the same to the eye as an SI2.
3. Between 1.5-2cts.
4. Any shape except for heart.
5. Simple solitare, no sidestones, but not classic tiffany style.

----------------

I wish I saw this earlier... Hope there is still room for a little 0.2, point by point, and then, you tell me if the conclusion sounds reasonable

#1. There is a serious difference between H (very white) and K (smething that most would call not-perfectly white). If "tint" is not a problem but on the contrary, I would start thinking K - L, not H.

#2. SI2 is great, but each stone is different so these have to be seen to know what you are getting. Both the cut of the stone and the type of inclusions will make a serious difference.

#3. & #5 no comment, these are better talked about with some selection of stones in sight.

#4. How about an old cut diamond? Not only these shapes are priced very attractively, but the vast majority available are actually not colorless so they are liked as they come. It is perfectly feasible to find such pieces loose, but mounted is more likely. Stores like Fay Cullen and Antiquengagementrings get often talked about around here and they are worth a browse.

There are a couple of old min cut pieces at DBL, and some listed here.
Actually, a pS search turned up 20 Old European cut diamonds between J and L color, 1.5 and 2.5 cts, Vs1 and I1 clarity.

Looking for depth above 58% and table below 58%, there still were a few among which THIS and THIS for example.

These old cuts are more often found in replica rings, but modern solitaires that flatter a cushion shape would do great, I would think.

 

[valeria101]

... and "Stephan" (by PS avatar) had a three carat M color cut into an awesome super ideal H&A round. You may wnat to take a look, if the receipe sounds good

 

[strmrdr]

The one thing nice about a k-l diamond is that added clarity doesnt cost as much as the higher grades.
check this one:
http://www.goodoldgold.com/1_85ct_k_vvs2_h%26a.htm

and this one:
http://www.goodoldgold.com/1_74ct_k_vvs1_h%26a.htm


this one:
http://www.goodoldgold.com/2_27ct_k_si2_h%26a.htm

 

[MsP]

A slight tint is okay so maybe k-l is more what I should be looking for. As for antique cuts, she has a 2ct(maybe a little bigger) OEC in a filigree setting. She never wears it because she doesn't like the setting. I have tried to convince her to reset it but won't for sentimental reasons.

I am really liking the idea of a colored gemesis stone. I'm going to talk to my dad about it an see what he says.

Thanks!

 

[valeria101]

----------------
On 8/26/2004 9:40:19 AM anovice wrote:



I am really liking the idea of a colored gemesis stone. I'm going to talk to my dad about it an see what he says.

----------------

Clear ! It's just that the tytle of the thread (that "lowe quality") really did not bring H color in mind and thought to make sure what the lowest end of your range really is

If you do go for Gemesis (or some other maker of diamonds for that matter) news would be appreciated, of course. I had no idea Chatam wan also in the biz, but it seems that they do (LINK)

 

[chialea]

----------------
On 8/26/2004 9:55:37 AM valeria101 wrote:


I had no idea Chatam wan also in the biz, but it seems that they do (LINK)

----------------

So, my experience with them:

either they're not in the biz, or they have really, really, really terrible customer service. I've never managed to hear back from them.

I love the sapphire I ended up with, but we were really trying to get a lab-created blue or green for a while, and it doesn't seem to be possible yet.

Yellow and orange are really easy, though, which is great for those with the skin tones to wear 'em

 

[fancycoloredfan]

I have a gemesis diamond that i bought online and it's gorgeous - vivid yellowish orange. I would highly recommend at least taking a look at them. I think chatham does do cultured diamonds - thought I don't know how large/small or the colors. I have an asscher cut and I honestly love it so much. For an anniversary present, it's nice to go with something different as well.

-Ariana