Drunk words...Sober Thoughts?

[FrekeChild]

PiP, I just want to say that I feel for you. I really do. I understand if you don''t come back for a while either. I think you''ve handled these comments extremely well, and major kudos to you for that.

Having said that, I understand that your relationship with this therapist is very close and you feel very comfortable with her. However, I am wondering from what you''ve said if perhaps you''ve gone close to as far as you can go with her. Often a client and a therapist/counselor can extend their relationship to the point where their discussions are no longer helpful or make a difference for the client. Just something to think about. I never really took that into consideration, but it does make sense.

I''m also curious as to what kind of therapy she practices. If I were you, I''d think about scheduling an appointment with someone who works with relationships or substance abuse problems as a specialty. I would also think about going to an Al-Anon meeting, just to see what they have to say. Your SO might even be able to go with you if you feel comfortable with that.

Whatever you choose, ((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((BIG HUGS))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

I''m sorry you''re having to go through this.

 

[bee*]

Date: 3/25/2009 10:58:22 AM
Author: prettylnpink419


I am my own best friend. I don''t understand why some of you have even made comments like that. I am not someone that thinks poorly of myself. I have very ambitious goals for myself and I am my own best friend. I have considered how all of my opinions will affect me most importantly. It is not like I''ve been going through this all along and not thinking about myself.

If your best friend came to you and said that her bf threatened murder, be it drunk or sober, what would you say to her-you would tell her to run and not look around. I think that''s why you''re getting comments like that.

 

[Porridge]

EDITED - it's all been said before anyways.

I'm just going to say again that I'm so sorry you're going through this, it's just awful. I'm thinking about you and sending all the good thoughts your way. You sound like a wonderful person. {HUGS AND DUST}

I hope you know we all just have your best interests at heart. I hope you come back and tell us what your doing and how it's going. I hope it will be good news.

 

[kindred]

I have not read all of the replies but this guy definitely sounds like an abuser. It will get worse. Everything else was bad enough, but the fact that he threatened to murder you really makes me worry. Some people say stupid things when drunk, but what he said is not just "stupid" stuff. I think you need to get out of the relationship ASAP.

 

[LtlFirecracker]

Look, I think everyone at every age has their prospective, but I think it is fair to say that many people got that prospective my making their own mistakes and coming to their own conclusions despite the advice that was given to them.

I see where Smurfy is coming from because I have been in a bad situation. Plenty of people said "run" "leave the guy now" and you know what I did? I stopped talking to them because I felt like they didn''t understand. Yes it is illogical, yes it is stupid. The person who got though to me was the person who didn''t tell me what to do, but held my hand while I was trying to figure things out, the day I made the right decision, and for months afterwards so that I wouldn''t go back. I know it is not logical, but having all these judgmental people made me feel more isolated, even though they were right!

PIP. All I would say is take the time to do some self reflection, and think about it. Are these the qualities of a partner that you always dreamed about? Some probably will be, some will not. And think about this. The more invested you become in a person, the less incentive they have to hide their dark side. I read somewhere that a lot of women hope that the things that they don''t like about a person will get better when they are married. But that is not true. They will most likely get worst. The person you have in front of you now will probably be the same person in the future.

 

[SparklyLibra]

Date: 3/25/2009 1:54:37 AM
Author: Mediterranean

Date: 3/25/2009 1:32:22 AM

Author: havernell

Date: 3/25/2009 12:49:44 AM


Author: prettylnpink419


I know he is in a dark place right now and part of me feels like how can I leave him there and abandon him...isn''t a relationship about thick and thin and good times and bad?

Thanks for the update PIP! Many of us here have been wondering how you are doing! I''m glad both you and your boyfriend are seeking the help of doctors and therapists- keep it up!



I do just want to respond to this one part of your post. While it''s true that relationships are about going through both good and bad times, in a healthy relationship the good times should FAR outweigh the bad times. From all you''ve told us about your relationship, it sounds like for a while now, the bad times have outweighed the good (even before the night he texted you). You said in a previous post that you said to him ''Everytime you look at me its like you are angry or upset but won''t tell me why.'' This makes me think that things haven''t been right with your relationship recently if every time you look at him you get anger rather than love from him. It sounds like you are always super stressed out by your relationship, and that''s not good for anyone. Honestly ask yourself if the good times have outweighed the bad in your relationship recently...



I think your boyfriend needs time to figure his life out before he can really be a committed partner to you. He needs to feel fulfilled in a job and making his own money (rather than feeling like you are supporting him), he needs to live in a place of his own (not his parents or his cousin''s), and he needs to cope with his depression. Once he''s gotten himself figured out, then perhaps you two can have a mature, EQUAL relationship. But until that happens, the relationship won''t work because *you can''t save him from himself*, and he''ll just resent you for trying. You are just going to drag yourself down if you keep trying to save him because **he needs to decide to save himself**, otherwise he''ll never get better (just like smokers can be forced to quit, they have to decide themselves to quit). Sometimes tough love is necessary, and letting him go for a while to fix himself may just turn out to be the best thing you ever do for him. That''s NOT abandoning him- that''s doing the healthy thing for both him and yourself.



You can be in love with the right person at the wrong time. Sounds like this is definitely the wrong time for you guys because of the personal turmoil that your boyfriend is in. I would break things off with him and give him the space to find himself and to get back on his feel by himself (in order to rebuild his ego). Once he is a healthy and happy person again, then you could begin dating again. If you two are really meant to be, you will get back together when he is ready to be an equal partner to you.



I''m sorry you are going through all of this, but you need to take care of yourself first and foremost. Keep us posted on what''s going on so that we can continue to support you through this rough time.

I agree with ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING Havernell said.... Also, the ''through thick and thin'' stuff only works if BOTH partners are doing that. He''s not exactly sticking with you through ''thick and thin'' if he''s resenting you for doing well. He''s allowing his ego issues to tear the relationship apart at the seams! He''s OK with you lying to your employers to scam benefits for him, and that can''t make him feel good about himself... If he''s to become healthy as a human being, he''s got to have the lifeline cut. No cash infusion from you, no groceries, and no insurance. It may seem cold at first, but when it jolts him into doing things for himself, his sense of accomplishment, and the pride he feels in himself for doing things on his own merit will boost his self confidence, and that, I think, is the key to eradicating this war of vengeance upon you that his faltering ego is waging!

DANG MED! You took the words right.out.of.my.mouth! Scary. Anyway, I agree with you. Very rarely does resentment ever really "go away". It may lie dormant for a while, but the ability to resent one''s spouse for doing well is a personality flaw, not a behavior. It''s a deficiency that only loooooong and intense therapy can even begin to bandage. You know why? Because it all begins with the person harboring the resentment. It''s usually a self- esteem issue which only by admitting it''s existence and exposing it in all it''s ugliness will begin to heal.

He has to get to a place where he uncovers all the layers in order to find out WHY he resents you, and not what you do to draw it out of him, but WHAT it is EXACTLY that he is beating himself up over....

You doing well is just the forum that these issues are being manifested THIS TIME... What will it be next?

Love does not compete with one''s spouse. It encourages and takes pride in the others'' successes.

If he does not love himself, how can he love you.

People cannot give what they do not have.....

I''m praying for you.

 

[Treasure43]

Sending much dust and hugs your way PIP!

I don't think anyone here means to say they won't support you if you choose to stay in the relationship. Ultimatly, it's your choice and we're here to support you no matter WHAT your choice is. I can only speak for myself but I doubt anyone here will feel they have wasted their time by giving you advice, even if you decide not to take it.

The resentment your SO feels for you is concerning because while I understand he is going through a difficult patch and meds and alcohol were involved, testing you SO by threatening to murder them is hardly common. Resentement, if not resolved, can eat away at and ruin a relationship. Perhaps it might be best if you took some time and let him get himself togethe. At this point , from what you've said, it kind of sounds like he may not be in a place where he can be a good partner to you and he may not be able to deal with his resentment.

That said, I think the reason you're getting so many comments that may be difficult to hear/read is because honestly I think many of us are truly terrifed for you. While we don't know you and know only your situation as it has been told to us, I think it raises red flags for many (especially those who have gone through similar situations). If my best friend came to me with the exact same situation I would tell her to get out. The reason I say this is that it's very easy to justify what is happening without realizing it and letting things slide. As another poster said, I have never been so worried about someone I have never met. The whole situation is extemely difficult.

As for your therapist, you know her better than us. However, therapists are human and inflict their own thoughts, feelings, etc. onto patients at times. Even though she's gotten you through some tough times and you feel close to her, it couldn't hurt to consult with another therapist and see if you can gain any additional perspective. An unbiased, professional therapist might really help to shed some light on the situation. Yes your therapist has a past with you, but I can't help but wonder if this past colors some of her advice to you on this issue. Anyway, my point is that there's no harm in seeking another opinion.

I understand how difficult it must be to get all these opinions and then hear the completle opposite thing from loved ones around you. What it comes down to is that advice is just that, advice. It's up to you to make the final choice. I know when I make a decision I listen to EVERYONE'S advice, but in the end I do what I feel is right.

Good luck with whatever choice you make. I'll keep you in my thoughts and prayers.

 

[decodelighted]

Date: 3/25/2009 8:11:21 PM
Author: LtlFirecracker
Look, I think everyone at every age has their prospective, but I think it is fair to say that many people got that prospective my making their own mistakes and coming to their own conclusions despite the advice that was given to them.

But when you''re 41 you know that its perspective

. (Although I am still a terrible speller)

 

[Haven]

Date: 3/25/2009 3:38:50 PM
Author: purrfectpear

Date: 3/25/2009 2:28:44 PM
Author: decodelighted
Smurfy, there''s plenty of reason to mention age. Just because *you* don''t like it, doesn''t mean it isn''t a valid piece of information. It pretty redundant to go around telling everyone that if they mention being older that they''re being condescending (IYHO). WE ALL GET THAT YOU THINK THAT. However most don''t agree with you.

Exactly.

If you want to go through life pretending that you are just as smart and wise today as you will be ten years from now, fine. De Nile is more than a river in Egypt

There isn''t a woman on here in her 30''s who won''t admit she''s wiser now than she was in her 20''s, 40''s to 30''s, etc. If you don''t get wiser with more years of life experience then you''re just doing something wrong !!!

No one is saying you''re a dummy if you''re 19 or 21, just that you don''t have the same breadth of experience that you will with some years. The fact that you''re so overly sensitive about the whole age issue is PROOF that you lack the maturity that will come with some age

Yes, I agree. My favorite high school teacher once told me that maturing is all about looking back periodically at yourself five years earlier and saying "Man, was I such a dork! I didn''t know anything at all." He was right.

How wonderful to have the opportunity to learn from the experiences others have had without having to go through them ourselves.

 

[Haven]

PiP--We''re here to support you in whatever decision you make. We''re just concerned for your own personal safety and happiness, which is why some of us are coming across sounding harsh.

And you have handled yourself with such grace in this thread, well done.

 

[Rock_of_Love]

Pretty...I have been thinking about you so much lately and what you have been going through. I hope you have been able to take some time for yourself to reflect...and give yourself a big HUG!!! I can see that it is tearing you up inside.

I think what folks lately are saying is good advice about taking a step back. It would be really healthy for you (and him) to just take a breather to sort of re-evaluate where you are in your relationship, what you mean to each other, what the future holds, etc. It would probably also help with looking at the big picture. Often when people say "Take a Break" it can be scary because all we hear is "break"...meaning "break up," but don''t look at it that way. Just give yourself, say, a month or so, of not seeing or talking to each other, just so you guys can think clearly about your own life and self.

Just to add a little from my experience, I really notice that men in general are verrrrry different when they don''t have anything going for them in life...no career, no money, and no definite plan for the future. Men are "taught" to be the providers and society, maybe consciously or subconsciously, makes them feel less of a man if they aren''t providing. I never realized how big of a deal that is until my BF was out of work for a period of time. Boy was he a different person!!! Very irritable...we fought a lot. To sum it up, he was just very unhappy with himself and didn''t know how to deal with it. And...men are strange...they will never say "I''m unhappy/depressed because I''m out of work and am not providing for you" they just act like jerks! On the opposite spectrum, when he is working, I can just tell how much happier he is and that he takes pride in himself...and that makes for lots of love and kisses!!

I''m not saying you should wait for him to "get it together" but one thing I agree with that your therapist said is that he won''t feel better about himself until he does "get it together"...and who knows how long that could take!!!

*If* he is "the one" then maybe you guys will work through this. But, taking a breather is probably the best thing right now so you can evaluate that with a clear head. And, remember, there are a lot of good "ones" out there.

 

[Smurfysmiles]

Date: 3/25/2009 8:11:21 PM
Author: LtlFirecracker
Look, I think everyone at every age has their prospective, but I think it is fair to say that many people got that prospective my making their own mistakes and coming to their own conclusions despite the advice that was given to them.


I see where Smurfy is coming from because I have been in a bad situation. Plenty of people said ''run'' ''leave the guy now'' and you know what I did? I stopped talking to them because I felt like they didn''t understand. Yes it is illogical, yes it is stupid. The person who got though to me was the person who didn''t tell me what to do, but held my hand while I was trying to figure things out, the day I made the right decision, and for months afterwards so that I wouldn''t go back. I know it is not logical, but having all these judgmental people made me feel more isolated, even though they were right!


PIP. All I would say is take the time to do some self reflection, and think about it. Are these the qualities of a partner that you always dreamed about? Some probably will be, some will not. And think about this. The more invested you become in a person, the less incentive they have to hide their dark side. I read somewhere that a lot of women hope that the things that they don''t like about a person will get better when they are married. But that is not true. They will most likely get worst. The person you have in front of you now will probably be the same person in the future.

well said, this is basically what i was thinking but did not manage to convey, thank you for helping me to clarify

 

[D2B]

Just a number of points.

- what has stood out to me and has me really concerned as well, is your post where you say all of your friends family, think he is really nice. That to me given what has happend is a red flag. No-one can get along really well with everyone, if everyone really thinks he is great, than I would think he is play acting - and very well. I am not expressing myself welll, but when you read some of the profiles of abusers, esp those who long term abuse and one day snap and do horrific things, often you hear friends and neighbours say what a wonderful friendly man he was - perfect etc. and that is the problem, no one is so wonderful that everyone loves them, esp coupled with the comments and issues that are there in black and white.

- your therapsit. - I am concerned about her advice. Like a doctor some are great with some issues and not so great at others. when you think your doctor, therapist is so good that you wont consider getting a second option, I would worry. If she is good, then a second oppinion will only support what she has said. But if you were my sister, best friend I would say, humour me, please get another perspective, it cant hurt.

-there is a reason why a bunch of strangers who have not met your SO are all saying the same thing, we are not clouded by things, but go on the facts presented - unemployed, depressed, disrespectful to you (comments re strippers when drunk), resentful of your success and finally talk about murder.

The plain facts are clear - you need to stop enabling him and let him go to find the help he needs. In a way if you really loved him you would let him go to face the reality and get his own self back. on top of this, you need to look after yourself first and be safe and loved in a postiitve way.

again, sorry about the bluntness, but the sentiments are genuine and the caring is real, I have never met you but I am so concerned about you and the fact that your family and friends think he is soooooo nice is a real worry for me, when the facts your present, indicate he is hiding his true nature really well and working at being nice.

good luck, please get a second oppinion.

pb

 

[partgypsy]

Wow this guy sounds like my older brother, alot. My brother can be the sweetest guy but when he drinks is the biggest ass*** you can imagine. When he had money he would spend it all on his girlfriend at the time. However his longest relationship, he was only irregularly employed, and so sat at home drinking and living off his girlfriend, and maybe for a boost to his self esteem cheated on her. However if they had a fight he would be crying enough to split his spleen how much he loved her and would die if they broke up etc. But if he loved her, he certainly didn''t respect her. And the love seemed more like dependence than true love. As far as being likeable my brother always brings up how other people are so much more nicer to him than his own family, and our reply is, well they don''t have to live with you. From my own experience being dependent or codependent with someone brings out the worse in him. As my mother always bailed him out of the problems he had, she created a monster.

I really like what another poster suggested, is that he needs to get on his feet by himself so he can feel good about himself again. Feel free to give him emotional support during this time, but as you are not married you should separate your financials because it is causing resentment and damaging whatever potential future relationship you might have. I also think if he is able to go to some kind of counseling this would be good.
As far as his family, friends thinking you are weird, that''s NOT what it is. They are thinking with relief we have pink to take care of him, let''s not jepordize this set up or well have to take care of him!

 

[LtlFirecracker]

Date: 3/25/2009 8:48:58 PM
Author: decodelighted

Date: 3/25/2009 8:11:21 PM

Author: LtlFirecracker

Look, I think everyone at every age has their prospective, but I think it is fair to say that many people got that prospective my making their own mistakes and coming to their own conclusions despite the advice that was given to them.

But when you're 41 you know that its perspective

. (Although I am still a terrible speller)

Even as I continue to get older and wiser in the ways of the world (I turn 30 in less than a month), spelling will always be a challenge and I will forever be dependent on the help of others and technology - although my mac failed me this time

. But I will probably never get that one wrong again now that I have gotten some insight from someone who is wiser than me on the topic

 

[swimmer]

Date: 3/25/2009 7:01:32 PM
Author: bee*

Date: 3/25/2009 10:58:22 AM

Author: prettylnpink419



I am my own best friend. I don''t understand why some of you have even made comments like that. I am not someone that thinks poorly of myself. I have very ambitious goals for myself and I am my own best friend. I have considered how all of my opinions will affect me most importantly. It is not like I''ve been going through this all along and not thinking about myself.

If your best friend came to you and said that her bf threatened murder, be it drunk or sober, what would you say to her-you would tell her to run and not look around. I think that''s why you''re getting comments like that.

If one of us posted that when a bf binged on a rare occasion he sent sexually objectifying, degrading, threatening, and manipulative texts, what would actions would you suggest to her? I add my words of comfort to the chorus here, but it sounds like he is in a very bad place and pulling you down just as you have gotten up to the edge from your own bad place. You are a strong woman who fought to be where you are. Can you risk him pulling you back down? It is good that you say you are putting yourself first, I hope your actions echo that.

When your mom and sister read his messages, what did they say? What would your best girlfriends say?

 

[tlh]

Date: 3/26/2009 9:34:44 AM
Author: swimmer
If one of us posted that when a bf binged on a rare occasion he sent sexually objectifying, degrading, threatening, and manipulative texts, what would actions would you suggest to her? I add my words of comfort to the chorus here, but it sounds like he is in a very bad place and pulling you down just as you have gotten up to the edge from your own bad place. You are a strong woman who fought to be where you are. Can you risk him pulling you back down? It is good that you say you are putting yourself first, I hope your actions echo that.

When your mom and sister read his messages, what did they say? What would your best girlfriends say?

Swimmer this is a good point. Pretty, did you honestly show these messages to your mother and friends? I am guessing, she has shown them only to her therapist. Because if she does decide to stay with him, I seriously doubt she would like to have her family and friends know what horrible things he took time to WRITE let alone say. Kind of self preservation/ defense.

Pretty. I do not judge you at all. Whatever decision you make, is YOUR decision. NOT OURS, NOT HIS, NOT YOUR FAMILY, NOT YOUR FRIENDS, NOT YOUR THERAPIST.... YOURS. Either decision, to leave or to stay, will require a lot of strength, courage and support. I have seen what happens to men when they lose their jobs. It is not them. They drink, are depressed, and it changes them. The older they are when the great layoff happens - the harder it is for them to bounce back out of the hole. I don''t know you or your SO, but the MURDER comment to me, just SCREAMS HATRED and RESENTMENT... that your success makes him feel worse about himself... so the depression that usually gets turned inwards (suicide) got displaced outwards (murder). Depressed people sometimes say things in order to get attention and sometimes they go to extremes... however his extreme is one that RESENTS YOU currently.

It is your life. I am not one to tell others what to do, as I can only be a sounding board for what you''ve written. I understand that you are conflicted... and no matter what you decide, I''ll be here... because either path, is bound to be a bumpy ride.

HUGE HUGS. I am soo sorry that you have to be faced with this right now, considering how everything looked so great in the rearview, but things are just so difficult right now.

 

[MaggieB]

Pretty, my heart goes out to you. BOY have I been there. I was the girl who always had to have the fixer-upper. Even with all of the perspective I''ve gained with age, I still have no idea why, but my late teens and early twenties were filled with really great guys that just had a few issues, you know, they weren''t like that ALL the time . . . blah blah blah.

I don''t know if I had one particular aha moment, but this one kind of stands out. My boyfriend came down to my office and proceeded to be a bit of a jerk. He had had a bad day and was being kind of whiny and short with me. I didn''t even see it as anything really. After he left, the ladies in the office turned to me and go, THAT''S your boyfriend? And as I started making excuses for him, they just totally dismissed me, and one of them says, "Maggie, don''t waste your breath. The guy is a loser, okay, and frankly I''m extremely disappointed that this is what you think you are worth." Don''t think that this meant anything to me at the time! I just filed it under, well you just don''t understand how great my boyfriend USUALLY is. But that comment, along with many, many others, just slowly ate away at me for a couple of years until one day I just GOT it.

I want a PARTNER in life, not someone to mother, not someone to babysit, not someone to fix, I want someone who has their stuff together and can love me, support me, and give me a fantastic life (I''m not talking about financially.) Your boyfriend is showing you who he is. He''s someone who is angry, desperate, and cruel. I feel very sorry for him, I hope he gets help, but he is not boyfriend material. Even if he hadn''t said the thing about murdering you, which is by the way instant cause to leave and never look back, he STILL is not partner material. It doesn''t matter that he''s not that bad, it matters that he''s not good enough.

And since I''m old, I can tell you how my fixer-uppers turned out. Joe got married and has been arrested for domestic abuse at least three times that I''m aware of. (I occasionally run into his sister.) Mark graduated from alcohol to cocaine and is now in prison. My cousin''s fixer-upper, Jeff, whom she dated for 8 years before she finally had to move on, died if cirrhosis of the liver at 42.

They give you signs of how things are going to turn out. Pay attention to them.

 

[princesss]

Pretty, people will judge. Just be confident enough in your decision to brush it off.

FWIW, I ran this situation by my BF, and asked what he would do if his friend was dating a guy that he''d met and seemed really nice until something like this happened. He looked completely shocked and said, "I''d tell her to leave. If I liked the guy it would suck, but I''d tell her to leave." No hesitation.

And, btw, your BF *is* that guy. He may not always show it, but you''ve seen it now.

 

[House Cat]

PIP,

I''ve read to page 5, and can do no more, I feel that I need to comment.

I know that you feel your therapist is a professional and that you trust her. I think you should ask her this question: "How would fighting for my boyfriend further my PERSONAL goals that we have set in therapy?"

I think you really need to know the answer to this. If you have some sort of commitment issues or difficulty in relationships, where you drop someone because a hair is out of place, then I can see why your therapist might be encouraging you for this growth opportunity...BUT...if not, then your therapist is encouraging codependence and this is no good. If you have ANY parental issues, such as alcoholism, mental illness, serious illness, drug abuse, physical/verbal abuse, anything like that at all, then you are taking a codependent role and you should reevaluate your relationship with your therapist and maybe start looking for a new one.

I''m sorry that you have been treated this way.

 

[newbie777]

I am so sorry that he said those horrible comments to you... just put yourself in our shoes... and maybe we all haven''t been in yours. But either way - do what you feel is best for YOU.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

PIP,

I just wanted to return and say that your therapist is definitely in the best place to evaluate this situation because she has known you for a long time and she does know him as well. We are in no way able to really make clear calls on this from such limited information. I will say again that most people here clearly have not experienced seeing someone combine meds and excessive alcohol, and they do not understand that the people say things that they really are not in control of. As long as he can control never again drinking while taking medication, then I am not so concerned about the things he said that night. It just can''t ever happen again. But clearly, he is having difficulty adjusting to the unemployment and has some issues of resentment about your not helping him move, etc. Those do concern me. Life is full of ups and downs, and we all need to have someone who will make it through those times and stay mentally stable. if I loved someone, I would probably do exactly what you are doing, and that is making a timeline to see how he handles getting back in school, etc. I''d probably lovingly tell him that you want everything to work out because you do love him, but there are going to be certain steps that have to be taken for the relationship to go forward...therapy, no alcohol, no more resentment expressed toward you, etc. If he can''t do those things, then you would at least know you tried everything possible. My hope for you is that the ultimate decision will be made very clear for you. {{{hugs}}}

 

[asscherisme]

You are not married to him
You don''t have kids with him
He threatened murder

Run, fast. Seriously. If you were my daughter and you came to me for advice I would beg you to leave him and be frightened, no terrified if you stayed.

Alcohol is no excuse. Its like saying someone who commits murder is not responsible because they are drunk? Someone who rapes is not responsible because they are drunk.

I think the alchohol took the lid off repressed stuff that has been building.

I would save yourself future grief and possible danger and leave NOW.

Joking about murder is so not OK not a little bit, not at all. And if I was in a relationship where someone joked about it I would take it very seriously.

 

[asscherisme]

Date: 3/25/2009 1:14:03 AM
Author: Resonance.Of.Life
Well it sounds like you are off to a good start.. however I personally do know how hard it is to leave someone in a situation like that.

My ex who actually threatened me with murder did try to make good on it when he just totally snapped out of the blue during an argument and tried choking me to death. He snapped out of it randomly after I was flopping around like a fish trying to get free... and he cried and told me he was so sorry and he didn''t mean to do it. He was blubbering about how much he loves me and how relationships are about the good times and the bad (him trying to play on my love for him.. manipulation). But honey, seriously... a relationship is NOT supposed to hurt you like that.

It is hard, but I know too... YOU have to realize it''s time for YOU to leave because nothing we say, including your therapist, can sway how you feel nor your decision to stay.

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE, think of your own self first!

Resonance, that is so scary. I am so glad you got out safe and hope OP learns from your expeirence and has the strength to leave.

 

[KimberlyH]

Date: 3/28/2009 3:25:07 PM
Author: diamondseeker2006
PIP,

I just wanted to return and say that your therapist is definitely in the best place to evaluate this situation because she has known you for a long time and she does know him as well. We are in no way able to really make clear calls on this from such limited information. I will say again that most people here clearly have not experienced seeing someone combine meds and excessive alcohol, and they do not understand that the people say things that they really are not in control of.

DS, I, and I''m sure others who have suggested this relationship doesn''t appear to be the best choice for her, do understand that this is a possibility. It doesn''t change the fact that PIP''s boyfriend is making really poor choices regarding his life in general (no job, not looking, drinking excessively, etc.) and if she were my close friend or family member I''d tell her the same thing, get out. From all that she''s shared this guy isn''t ready or capable of being in a committed, loving relationship, whether he''s on meds and drinking to the point he''s so out of control that he threatens to murder her or not.

 

[QueenB29]

Pretty--

I''m a chronic lurker, but I had to reply to you. Your posts made my jaw drop. Long--sorry.

I don''t know you. I don''t know your BF. I only know what you''ve chosen to share, but I must agree with many of the other posters, that I am very, very concerned based on the information available. If one of my girlfriends had told me what you posted, I would tell her to leave. If she didn''t want to do that, I would tell her to proceed with great caution, with her eyes open. You seem to be doing this, which is great.

I do know how hard it is to see someone you love show an entirely different side. My husband has a terrible temper. Last Thanksgiving, 2 months after our wedding, we were driving back from my inlaws and he was in a very bad mood from the traffic. Our dog got sick in the car and he started screaming at her. When I told him to cool it, he threatened to leave both of us at a rest stop on the side of I-95, and he wasn''t joking.

I had seen his temper before, but it had never been directed at me, and I was horrified. He was so angry that I didn''t want to be anywhere near him in case he really snapped. He has promised to work on his temper, and he is doing a much better job at remaining calmer, but if anything remotely similar ever happens again, he''s gone until he gets professional help and HIS therapist tells me he''s ready to come home. Mind you, that is the worst he has ever been, he has never threatened me otherwise or degraded me, but I''m still concerned about it months later. And I can promise you that it''s going to be a long time before I will even discuss having a baby with him, because as much as I love him, he needs to grow up. If we hadn''t been married at the time, I probably would have dumped him. Had he actually threatened to murder me or hit me, I would have called the police...and a divorce lawyer. Because all the wonderful, thoughtful things he has ever done wouldn''t matter any more. At that point, he would only be the man who threatened my life, and no amount of therapy could ever change that.

I think the reason almost everyone is telling you to run is because of that text. When someone threatens to murder you, it doesn''t matter how drunk a man is, or how he is the other 99.9 percent of a time. What matters is that he is capable of saying or thinking that in any way, shape or form. Because you say you don''t know if you can ever really forgive him, I have a feeling that you already know what you *should* do.

I''m about your age--I''m 27 and my husband is a year and a half younger than me at 25. Even if he wasn''t *serious* about the murder threat, it sounds like your BF has a LOT of growing up to do. He''s no longer a college frat boy at age 27, and really shouldn''t be going out and getting that trashed anymore and sending "drunk" texts, no matter what they say. You say it''s never happened before, but all that really means is that it''s never happened with you before.

I wish you the best and will be thinking about you and praying for you. Please come back and let us know how everything works out. If you leave him, so everyone can stop worrying about you and help you through the break up, and if you stay with him, because you''ll still need support.

 

[QueenB29]

And to be honest, the part that really concerns me is that he threatened you via text. It would be bad if he yelled it at you, but people often say things they don''t actually mean when drunk or angry, and you can often tell the difference based on their body language. We all say things we regret--they just fall out of our mouths. Taking the time to send a text message, means that he had to have thought about it when he opened up the screen, as he typed in the letters and probably had to hit some keys multiple times, and when he hit "SEND." The more I think about it--there''s no way that those texts weren''t things that he didn''t want to say. Drunk or not, medicated or not, he had plenty of opportunities to stop himself. I am so sorry.

 

[Jewels305]

I have not seen this post until today and felt the need to chime in.

First on the issue of the therapist. As a therapist myself I had some pretty major concerns reading over what you remembered of your conversation with your therapist. Sometimes what we say and how it is interpreted can be vastly different, and that can happen because we all have a tendency to hear what we want to hear. The way the conversation was initially described with her made it sound as though she was assigning you unnecessary guilt and responsibility for his actions and behavior. I do not personally see how putting time and energy into figuring out what may or may not have caused him to say those things to you is terribly productive because all it does is make excuses when your energy should instead be going into thinking about what you need to do next in your own best interest.
I also am concerned about the blurring of professional boundaries that is happening between you and your therapist. I do not know if she is aware of how close you consider the two of you to be, but it is best to terminate the therpetic relationship if it is moving from a professional into a personal relationship. It appears that you have become very dependent on her, and that is not typically a healthy situation. Becuase of the history that you and the therapist share, I also do not think that it was in anyone''s best interest for her to see you both for couple''s counseling. It might have been better to find another couple''s therapist in addition to your individual work with your current therapist due to the possibility that objectivity could be a problem.

On the issue of his behavior on that night. I think it''s been pretty well covered by many people here. Ultimately the decision is yours and it appears that you are very aware of the weight of your decision. None of this is your fault; you could not control his actions that night, and you cannot control his actions in the future. The thing you have control over is what you do next. I wish you the best of luck.

 

[asscherisme]

Date: 3/30/2009 5:14:53 PM
Author: Jewels305
I have not seen this post until today and felt the need to chime in.

First on the issue of the therapist. As a therapist myself I had some pretty major concerns reading over what you remembered of your conversation with your therapist. Sometimes what we say and how it is interpreted can be vastly different, and that can happen because we all have a tendency to hear what we want to hear. The way the conversation was initially described with her made it sound as though she was assigning you unnecessary guilt and responsibility for his actions and behavior. I do not personally see how putting time and energy into figuring out what may or may not have caused him to say those things to you is terribly productive because all it does is make excuses when your energy should instead be going into thinking about what you need to do next in your own best interest.
I also am concerned about the blurring of professional boundaries that is happening between you and your therapist. I do not know if she is aware of how close you consider the two of you to be, but it is best to terminate the therpetic relationship if it is moving from a professional into a personal relationship. It appears that you have become very dependent on her, and that is not typically a healthy situation. Becuase of the history that you and the therapist share, I also do not think that it was in anyone''s best interest for her to see you both for couple''s counseling. It might have been better to find another couple''s therapist in addition to your individual work with your current therapist due to the possibility that objectivity could be a problem.

On the issue of his behavior on that night. I think it''s been pretty well covered by many people here. Ultimately the decision is yours and it appears that you are very aware of the weight of your decision. None of this is your fault; you could not control his actions that night, and you cannot control his actions in the future. The thing you have control over is what you do next. I wish you the best of luck.

I could not agree more with your post. I''m glad you posted this and hopefully coming from a therapist will hold some weight with her.

 

[swimmer]

Date: 3/26/2009 11:00:16 AM
Author: MaggieB
\

I don''t know if I had one particular aha moment, but this one kind of stands out. My boyfriend came down to my office and proceeded to be a bit of a jerk. He had had a bad day and was being kind of whiny and short with me. I didn''t even see it as anything really. After he left, the ladies in the office turned to me and go, THAT''S your boyfriend? And as I started making excuses for him, they just totally dismissed me, and one of them says, ''Maggie, don''t waste your breath. The guy is a loser, okay, and frankly I''m extremely disappointed that this is what you think you are worth.'' Don''t think that this meant anything to me at the time! I just filed it under, well you just don''t understand how great my boyfriend USUALLY is. But that comment, along with many, many others, just slowly ate away at me for a couple of years until one day I just GOT it.


I want a PARTNER in life, not someone to mother, not someone to babysit, not someone to fix, I want someone who has their stuff together and can love me, support me, and give me a fantastic life (I''m not talking about financially.) Your boyfriend is showing you who he is. He''s someone who is angry, desperate, and cruel. I feel very sorry for him, I hope he gets help, but he is not boyfriend material. Even if he hadn''t said the thing about murdering you, which is by the way instant cause to leave and never look back, he STILL is not partner material. It doesn''t matter that he''s not that bad, it matters that he''s not good enough.


And since I''m old, I can tell you how my fixer-uppers turned out. Joe got married and has been arrested for domestic abuse at least three times that I''m aware of. (I occasionally run into his sister.) Mark graduated from alcohol to cocaine and is now in prison. My cousin''s fixer-upper, Jeff, whom she dated for 8 years before she finally had to move on, died if cirrhosis of the liver at 42.


They give you signs of how things are going to turn out. Pay attention to them.

Such great posts from Maggie and from Jewels. Hoping you are doing OK pip and pretty worried that you are not.