Should I offer unsolicited advice?

[Sabine]

I'm having trouble keeping my big mouth shut. I'm pretty sure I should, but I think I need to be reassured that I'd be sticking my foot in my mouth if I did. Here's the story:

On of my closest friends and bridesmaids called to tell me that she is engaged. I'm totally happy for her, and I think that she deserves all the happiness in the world. However, I think she might need a bit of a reality check. Her story is that she started dating her FI in high school. She went away to college, where they continued in a long distance relationship. They broke up right before summer after freshman year, so when she went home for the summer, she was not with him and didn't really see/speak to him. After coming back to school Sophomore year, they got back together and continued long distance all while fighting and being stressed over barely seeing each other. They were together that summer and actually saw each other, but then Junior year when it was long distance again there was a cheating incident, and they broke up again. They got back together at the end of the following summer and were together all of senior year. After graduation, she moved even further away. Now she lives in the South, and he is in New York. They are both about to graduate from further education. HOWEVER, she got a job in the DC area, and he has an intership for a year far away. They do plan on living in the same area after they are married, but their plan is to get married, then move to the same area. So essentially, although they have been together for a number of years, the amount of time they actually spent living in the same area is very minimal, and their track record is not great.

From my own experience...my FI and I had lived together for a summer before officially moving in together. We've lived together for almost 3 years and now are about to get married. We thought we knew everything about each other before we moved in, and that it would be a simple transition. Looking back now, I realize just how much we struggled. I'm so tempted to at least advise my friend that getting married without even living in the same town as her FI for the past 5 years is going to be rough, but I don't think she wants to hear it. I'm just worried that if she doesn't hear how hard it really is to live with someone, she will get married and be blown away by how hard it is. This isn't my place to tell her, is it?

 

[robbie3982]

Don''t do it! I think unless she asks for your advice, you have to just keep quiet and be there for her if/when it''s hard. I think if you give her unsolicited advice it''s not going to go well. Plus, no matter how right you are, she''s probably not going to listen until she learns for herself. I know I wouldn''t have

.

 

[TravelingGal]

Well, if you were in her shoes, would YOU listen? As Robbie says, most likely not. Not too many people are good at accepting, internalizing and reflecting on criticism.

It doesn''t sound like she''s making the best move, and I know how it is to want to stage some sort of intervention. But in my experience people want to choose their own roads and often will walk defiantly down them by themselves if they have to. As a friend, just be there for her, especially if she indeed finds out she made a mistake.

That being said, if you really want to throw your two cents in a subtle "I am so happy for you...are you excited about all of this as well?" in the hopes of maybe seeing if there is an "opening" is probably going to be more well received than a "STOP! You''re making a mistake! I know, I''m wise, I''ve lived through this and can tell you from experience!" I''m not saying that the latter may not give her something to chew on, but usually it''s met with so much resistance.

That''s not to say I''m not guilty of smacking people upside the head. My brother was one of them. It caused a bit of tension between us but he ended up breaking his engagement (thank god). He did say later that he appreciated the wake up call. The problem was, I kinda gave him too many of them, which culminated in one last one that actually got him crying in frustration at a sushi buffet (it was a really tough time in his life). And then there we were...both crying over our tuna. But that''s another story.

 

[iheartscience]

Usually, the answer to your title question would be a big fat "no!" However, in situations like this, I think it really depends on how close you are to the person in question. If she''s a very, very close friend or relative, I would say something. If not, I''d keep my mouth shut and let her hopefully come to her senses herself. It''s a tough situation...hopefully if you do say something, your friendship will withstand it. Good luck!

 

[sumbride]

Well, if it''s a mistake, it''s her mistake to make. Here''s the thing... you can tell her that living together is hard. It is. Of course it is. But is what you''re REALLY trying to tell her that you don''t think she and her FI are right for each other? Or that they shouldn''t get married? Because those are completely different things, and while they may very well be true, most people 1) don''t want to hear it and 2) won''t listen. Unless you can provide concrete reasons why she shouldn''t marry him like "HE''S CHEATING ON YOU!!! RIGHT NOW!!!" then you may just want to try and bring up how difficult it was to transition to living together, and how you''re glad you had time to work on it because it wasn''t easy, etc... etc... and see how she responds.

One of my college friends married the wrong person. We tried to tell her but she got angry and didn''t listen. They got divorced 4 years later, but honestly, she had to go through it to be the person she is now. True, I wish I could have saved her the pain, but she just couldn''t be told and we didn''t have anything specific to say other than "You just don''t seem like you''re really in love..."

Are they at least planning on a long engagement? Sometimes these things have a way of sorting themselves out.

 

[scarleta]

Sabine: you should not say a thing..I have "been there, done that" It just won''t work.

 

[Haven]

This is a very tough situation, Sabine, and I think you''ve gotten some great advice.

My initial reaction to your question was "NO WAY! Keep your mouth shut! Smile and nod when she tells you all about the wedding plans!" But then I started thinking about my own experience in a similar situation and remembered how my very best friend was the only person to tell me something that I desperately needed to hear during a very difficult time in my life.

I dated my ex for over four years, we were engaged after two (he was ALL about getting married, I was all about waiting, but I was young and said "yes" anyway.) We were an outstanding couple in college, but then we graduated and we quickly realized just how different we were. Regardless, we stuck it out for nearly two years after college and I was constantly dealing with the inner turmoil of questioning my decision to be with this man. It wasn''t until my best friend confronted me and told me that she disliked him and thought I was making a huge mistake that I was able to actually admit my concerns about him. I hadn''t mentioned a word of my concerns to her, I was far too ashamed to have made such a mistake. Well, my heart-to-heart with my best friend gave me the courage I was looking for to do the right thing and leave him shortly thereafter.

Now, I don''t know the details of your friendship, nor do I know the details of your friend''s relationship with her FI. You listed several facts about their proximity and the length of time they''ve been in the same place, but I''m not sure that really warrants a warning. It sounds like you know more about the nature of this relationship, and you can perhaps see that she''s making a poor decision.

All that being said, when I look back at my own situation I realize that the fact that my friend confronted me about my ex is what makes her such a good friend. She was looking out for me because she genuinely loves me and doesn''t want to see me live anything but the best life possible. After the ex and I broke up I heard "oh good, I never liked him" or "that''s so great, he is not he right guy for you" from several friends who never said anything. I wish they would have said something, too.

Would you risk losing a friend? Yes. This is one of those times when you need to figure out if confronting her is being a good friend, and I imagine the answer is only yes if you are absolutely sure that she is making a potentially harmful decision by accepting this marriage proposal.

Good luck, Sabine, I can tell that you''re a wonderful friend for being concerned about her. I know this is a tough decision, but I''d weigh the options carefully. I can''t express how grateful I am to my best friend for doing what she did. I know it was one of the most difficult things for her to do, and it actually makes me tear up a little when I think about it even now, she''s such a good friend to me. (We''ve been friends since age 6, though, so we are more like sisters than anything, which must have made it easier for her to muster up the courage.)

 

[Sparkalicious]

Sabine,

Based on my experiences/mistakes, my opinion would be "no".

She didn''t ask for advice, therefore, she is even more likely to disregard anything you or anyone else has to share than she would be if she actually asked for your advice. Many people tend to have a bad habit of needing to learn the hard way or forging a path for themself even if it is in the wrong direction. She needs to learn from her choices so that she can, hopefully, make wiser choices, on her own, in the future.

I had a friend who was getting married, was clearly unhappy and decided to drown her sorrows with a male companion, not her FI! They would do everything together and when she was with him (never telling her FI), she was happy. When she was with her FI (incredible guy, by the way), she was miserable, irritable and unpleasant. This lack of desire to actually marry her FI was evident in many, many ways.

Since she was unemployed and not contributing yet demanding a wedding to rival that of the most celebrated Hollywood celebrities, I decided enough is enough. Someone had to stop the madness and since we were really close, long time friends, I thought it could be me. I voiced my concern and had a really good conversation with her. She was receptive and listened and added her own thoughts, however, her bottom line was that it was "too late" ... Guests had already made plans to come to the wedding from all over the world so she just had to go through with it. I told her that it was not too late until she actually said "I do" at the alter.

Anyways, long story short, she had her mind set despite what actually made sense. This caused friction b/c I didn''t want to stand up for her at the wedding as a bridesmaid if she wasn''t actually in love and had no intention of following through on her vows. She somehow convinced me that everything was all good, or at least this is what I wanted to believe and the wedding day came and went.

Fast forward about a year and a half. We had left msgs saying "hi" for each other but due to some friction had not actually talked since the wedding. My friend calls me and lets me know that she is divorced and has a baby. She got pregnant by another man (the "friend" she was hanging out with before the wedding), within a week after she married her "husband" ...

This is the way she wanted to play it. No matter what I said or did would have changed her path. It is what she would have chosen regardless. The point of my long, drawn out story is you can''t save her. She is the only one who can save herself, if she hasn''t reached out, there''s no need to put yourself in that position. I agree with what TGal said about asking her open-ended questions that allow her to elaborate on how she is feeling, thus possibly creating an opening for you to share your thoughts, but other than that ... nope.

I hope that your friend is really making the right decision for her and I wish you luck. I know that dealing with this type of situation when it is someone you care about can be really emotionally taxing.

 

[mimzy]

is there any way that you can get your two cents in there in the form of maybe asking some tough questions? meaning, asking her about all the struggles that they are going to face, etc. there is a nasty way to do this (in a ''well you know it''s going to be hard, haughty sort of way) and in a gentle, genuinely interested sort of way that suggests you expect that she has thought it through. if you do it the later she might not be defensive and it might open up some doors to a discussion that probably needs to happen. don''t assume you know what it''s like to be in her situation, but let her know what a struggle it was for you and your FI, and that you don''t want her to go through any unnecessary angst that could be avoided by waiting (if the talk does happen

)

 

[decodelighted]

Right when someone announces they''re engaged is NEVER (imo) the time to confess any doubts. An engagement is a stress-filled, bumpy ride for many people --- PEEELENTY of time for kinks to arise and, if she confides in you about any difficulties, to THEN address your concerns.

 

[somethingshiny]

There''s lots of advice on here, but I thought I''d just put in my "story".

DH and I were young when we met (17), and young when we got married (19). I lived with my parents (I was in high school) and was only allowed to see him twice a week. He lived in another town, so it''s not like I''d run into him at the store or school or whatever. Then, I moved out of my parents house right after high school and moved in with a friend. With DH''s schedule and mine, we only saw each other once or twice a week. So, we didn''t "spend much time together" until we were married. I rented an apartment a month before the wedding and then we moved in together. We''ve been married for eight and a half years now. Was it easy? No. Would I do it again? Yes.

 

[musey]

Somethingshiny's story kinda proves what I initially thought after reading your post: no one knows what goes on behind closed doors. Girlfriends usually only hear the "bad" stuff about the relationship, too--you're getting the vent sessions, the what-should-I-do's... we don't talk to our girlfriends about all the good things because we don't want to be obnoxious or seem like we're "bragging." So you're likely getting all of the bad and none of the good, know what I mean?

Anyway, it sounds like your friend is in for a rocky road, but no outside source can judge or predict just how rocky it will be.


As a side note: the moving-in transition is different for everyone. I thought that we'd go through a stressful adjustment period, that we'd learn a lot more about each other, etc... but after 1.5 years together, I can honestly say that it's been a breeze... virtually no conflict at all. It's not hard for everyone. Not to say that it won't be for her, but no one can know that until they go through it themselves.


Okay, I'm done

 

[Deelight]

I would advise not to say anything out right, but if your really concerned next time you see her just ask a few (not to many) subtle questions about future plans if you really feel the need to advise otherwise let sleeping dogs lie. Like Musey said you don''t know what happens behind closed doors and most of the time BFF''s hear all the bad things.

Everyone is differnet and not one formula will work for all they have lasted this long with all the seperations which is hard so being together will hopefully be better for them.


It is really sweet about caring for your friend but unless she comes for advice I''d just lay back and be excited for her.

 

[steph72276]

My advice would be to keep out of it. Be a good friend and be there for her if anything goes wrong, but this is her life and what she wants to do and thinks is right. I think it would create a rift in your relationship and she would probably tell the guy what you said so it would be pretty uncomfortable to be around him later if you tried to stop their marriage.

 

[WTNLVR]

I wouldn''t say a thing. I find it odd though that when they come to making decisions on where to go to school and where to work, they pick places that ensure they can''t be together. Not knowing the details it''s a bit hard to fathom. I would do everything in my power to be near my significant other no matter what. I know sometimes it''s not possible, but sounds like this has been their pattern for several years.

 

[isaku5]

I wouldn''t say a thing either because I know I wouldn''t have listened if my friends had offered their opinion. I try very hard not to give unsolicited advice (except on PS ) to anyone. Usually, it just comes back to slap you. Besides, you don''t want to ruin a friendship.

 

[lumpkin]

Date: 1/10/2008 11:24:43 PM
Author: decodelighted
Right when someone announces they''re engaged is NEVER (imo) the time to confess any doubts. An engagement is a stress-filled, bumpy ride for many people --- PEEELENTY of time for kinks to arise and, if she confides in you about any difficulties, to THEN address your concerns.

ITA. Have they set a date? Unless they are getting married really soon I wouldn''t say a thing. They may decided not to get married during the course of the engagement.

 

[cara]

I think all you can do, that is productive, is ask her questions about her decisions and be there for her. You need to be non-judgemental, but if she is a friend maybe you can ask her about if she is worried about the transition to living together, if she is excited to finally be planning to live in the same town, etc. You can mention how useful/difficult it was to transition to living together in your case, but each couple will be different and many times people have to walk it themselves before they understand.

It seems like they are looking at marriage as a way to force the issue of getting themselves in the same place. Not ideal, IMO, but marriage as a tool of commitment-creation has a long history.

The other relevant issue is how well have they been doing the long-distance thing? My husband and I were long distance for many years, and it is hard as well. At the same time, we saw each other regularly, had to work out our own scheduling/personal space issues during that time, and were clearly more committed and stable than a lot of other couples we saw. Is the bigger issue that you don''t see that level of commitment and stability from your friend and her FI?

 

[Sabine]

Thanks everyone, I appreciate all of the advice. I agree with most of you that there''s a good chance she wouldn''t listen to me even if I did try to talk to her. The engagement will be about a year, and during that year she will be graduation from one program and relocating/starting a new program. I think if their relationship can handle yet another long distance transition all during the wedding process, then that will be a good sign that their relationship is stronger than I fear.

However, Haven''s story is really sticking with me. I think the next time we are doing some really deep girl sharing, I might at least try to bring up my own experiences, ask her some questions about their plans, and feel her out to see if she is even interested in hearing my opinions on how relationships change when moving in. I don''t have any serious concerns about the guy himself, my concerns are only based on how much time they spent apart and how much they seemed to struggle with transitioning from not seeing each other to being around each other.

 

[phoenixgirl]

This is definitely a tough one.

My roommate in college and I started dating our college boyfriends (mine is my husband) at about the same time freshman year. Mine was local, hers was someone she knew in high school so it was long distance. He wasn't a terrible person, but he really didn't seem to be good enough for her. He was unmotivated, did drugs (she didn't even drink), wasn't considerate or reliable, etc. She really thought they'd get married. Their relationship lasted a couple of years after college. After about a year of him loafing around rent-free in his parents' house (still long distance), she finally broke up with him. Then he finally moved down here and got a job. It seemed all was solved and the next step was engagement. No, then he cheated on her. She finally cut him loose. I still see him around town sometimes.

Her best friend was always very vocal about how he wasn't good enough for her. I never said anything until the first break-up. I was one of the "Yeah, you guys were no good together" friends after the fact. So it was kind of embarrassing when they got back together, but of course the general consensus was right in the long run. She remained friends with her best friend despite her comments, so it seems like they can only have helped.

I'm having a hard time telling if you think the problem is their long-distance or not moving in together. I think the former is more of a problem than the latter. Almost everyone has an adjustment period to living together, but that doesn't mean everyone needs to live together before marriage. But I do think not living in the same place leaves some questions unanswered. So if the issue is that this guy is a loser or a jerk, I think I'd say something. If it's just that they've never lived together in the same place, I don't think they'd listen to your advice anyway, and it's not a fatal flaw, just a concern.