Should I call CPS and try for an Amber Alert?

[NonieMarie]

Well, they never showed at my house and they keep sending me to vm. I've checked on getting some sort of alert sent out to the highway patrol but was told no. There isn't enough proof that the kids are in eminent danger. We think that they are in a hotel somewhere in the bay area. I hope that if they are getting sleep, the manic behavior may lessen.
I know there has been talk of the religious aspect. They were never religious before so this is all a surprise. I'm just going to wait it out and hope that they contact me again.

 

[kenny]

Well, they never showed at my house and they keep sending me to vm.

Who is the second they and what is vm?

 

[distracts]

Voicemail

 

[iLander]

I'd certainly call CPS, but I would not hold my breath that anyone can do anything.
You mentioned they said, "God will provide".
Since religions are protected to teach whatever they want, even that a virgin had a baby, that aspect of this disaster is going nowhere fast.
And parents get to do nearly whatever they want with and to their own kids.

Where CPS draws the line, I don't know but I'd definitely report what you know.
Those poor poor kids.

I'm sincerely so very sorry this is happening in your family.
Much worse happened in mine, so I understand the irony and tragedy of how society and the law protect the "sacred" institutions of religion and family, and the unspeakable horrors that result from that so-called 'protection'.

Yes, but Kenny, religious people vary too . . .

 

[kenny]

I'd certainly call CPS, but I would not hold my breath that anyone can do anything.
You mentioned they said, "God will provide".
Since religions are protected to teach whatever they want, even that a virgin had a baby, that aspect of this disaster is going nowhere fast.
And parents get to do nearly whatever they want with and to their own kids.

Where CPS draws the line, I don't know but I'd definitely report what you know.
Those poor poor kids.

I'm sincerely so very sorry this is happening in your family.
Much worse happened in mine, so I understand the irony and tragedy of how society and the law protect the "sacred" institutions of religion and family, and the unspeakable horrors that result from that so-called 'protection'.

Yes, but Kenny, religious people vary too . . .

Yes, totally, absolutely, which I acknowledged when I wrote in a post above, "I'm infinitely more respectful of religious people than I was 10 years ago precisely because I've met so many wonderful religious people via the Internet."

A couple years ago I made a cross-country trip and many people whom I met on the internet (in other fora) voluntarily welcomed me to spend a night in their homes. I didn't even ask.
Almost all were straight Christians with kids.
That help me, and them, see the light so to speak about how people being very different does not mean they can't be wonderful.
People vary, but I've learned what we have in common is much more important than our differences.

 

[iLander]

I'd certainly call CPS, but I would not hold my breath that anyone can do anything.
You mentioned they said, "God will provide".
Since religions are protected to teach whatever they want, even that a virgin had a baby, that aspect of this disaster is going nowhere fast.
And parents get to do nearly whatever they want with and to their own kids.

Where CPS draws the line, I don't know but I'd definitely report what you know.
Those poor poor kids.

I'm sincerely so very sorry this is happening in your family.
Much worse happened in mine, so I understand the irony and tragedy of how society and the law protect the "sacred" institutions of religion and family, and the unspeakable horrors that result from that so-called 'protection'.

Yes, but Kenny, religious people vary too . . .

Yes, totally, absolutely, which I acknowledged when I wrote in a post above, "I'm infinitely more respectful of religious people than I was 10 years ago precisely because I've met so many wonderful religious people via the Internet."

I did see that, so wondering why you're still poking fun at the Virgin birth thing . . . ? Were all the religious people you met Buddhists?

 

[Tacori E-ring]

Please look into a "three party petition." If you your husband, and one more person can prove to a judge they are mentally ill, they will be taken on an involuntary protective hold. Do you have dates? Medications? Doctors? You do need evidence. Voicemails? Emails? Anything? Also, please visit this website http://www.scoe.net/families/crisis_services.html if has the crisis information for your county. Now they cannot evaluate anyone out of their county, but can lead you in the right direction.

Religious delusions are fairly common. Unfortunately you cannot "talk" anyone out of any delusions so don't even try. The important thing is they are safe, their children are safe, and everyone else is safe. Mania is the most dangerous stage of bipolar. Do not underestimate that. They need medication and a safe (locked) place to be for a few weeks.

 

[kenny]

I'd certainly call CPS, but I would not hold my breath that anyone can do anything.
You mentioned they said, "God will provide".
Since religions are protected to teach whatever they want, even that a virgin had a baby, that aspect of this disaster is going nowhere fast.
And parents get to do nearly whatever they want with and to their own kids.

Where CPS draws the line, I don't know but I'd definitely report what you know.
Those poor poor kids.

I'm sincerely so very sorry this is happening in your family.
Much worse happened in mine, so I understand the irony and tragedy of how society and the law protect the "sacred" institutions of religion and family, and the unspeakable horrors that result from that so-called 'protection'.

Yes, but Kenny, religious people vary too . . .

Yes, totally, absolutely, which I acknowledged when I wrote in a post above, "I'm infinitely more respectful of religious people than I was 10 years ago precisely because I've met so many wonderful religious people via the Internet."

I did see that, so wondering why you're still poking fun at the Virgin birth thing . . . ? Were all the religious people you met Buddhists?

Poking fun?
Huh?

A virgin giving birth is not reasonable.
Reason is adequate for me, but clearly not for everyone … which is fine, but being insulted by reason while being allowed to post forum-policy breaking-religious-posts on PS like, "I'll pray for you." is, Uhm, up side down IMO.

 

[kenny]

Voicemail

Thanks, distracts.

 

[JaneSmith]

NonieMarie, my heart goes out to you, I'd be worried about those wee ones too.

You are in a tough spot, the children haven't been abducted, and you have no solid proof of safety issues for the children. Even if they did get stopped for having a child in the front seat, they'd probably play it cool with the cops and seem quite normal. Maybe they will screw up somehow (act very manic in public and a cop sees, smell of booze if pulled over, etc) without hurting the kids. I really hope that CPS or someone else with authority can eventually help you out.

I can only hope that they are still providing the necessities of life for the kids.
Unfortunately there are 37 states that exempt parents from blame if the child is harmed by withholding of medical care because of religious belief.
Religious Exemptions to Child Neglect, National District Attourneys Association.
http://www.ndaa.org/pdf/Religious%20Exemptions%20to%20Child%20Neglect%202013.pdf

Their new religious beliefs may be part of a mental health crisis or a genuine faith. It may be the one thing that keeps them out of legal trouble.





As to the other discussion going on here, the idea of blind respect for others beliefs is anathema to me. If someone is making truth claims about the world, the burden of proof is on them; and I can not only disagree, I can tell them why their views are absurd.
I respect your right to believe whatever you want. I do not have to respect the beliefs themselves.

 

[NonieMarie]

After no contact since Sat, I was able to file 6 missing person's reports. My son's ex-wife talked to them for an hour on Sat and the conversation was even more bizarre. I have to wait to see what the police officer's sgt says about publishing their photo in the media. I decided that it was better to be proactive than to keep waiting for something to happen. I only told my brother-in-law that I contacted the police. If the photo is released, they will know that it was me but I can live with that.

 

[yennyfire]

I'm so sorry NM. I can't imagine the stress you're feeling. I will keep them in my prayers and hope that everyone gets the help they need.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Same here, NM. Praying for a good, safe ending. You did the right thing to try and protect those babies.

 

[dragonfly411]

This sounds so scary. I am praying (yes praying) for your family. The fact that they were never religious before tells me that something very serious is happening to the two of them. I find it concerning that it is happening to both of them at the same time. It almost sounds like some other kind of drug, or someone has convinced them of an apocalyptic event. ::Hugs:: Keep us updated.

 

[SB621]

I'm praying for those little children. Nothing makes me angry then ppl who have children and then treat them like this. I understand there is something mentally wrrong with your step son and his wife. Why the heck didn't anyone step in when they were popping out babies left and right?!?!?! Sorry NM my rant wasnt' directed at you just the situation. I truly hope they get the help they need and the children are fan safe and happy shortly.

 

[dragonfly411]

I'm praying for those little children. Nothing makes me angry then ppl who have children and then treat them like this. I understand there is something mentally wrrong with your step son and his wife. Why the heck didn't anyone step in when they were popping out babies left and right?!?!?! Sorry NM my rant wasnt' directed at you just the situation. I truly hope they get the help they need and the children are fan safe and happy shortly.

SB - If I'm gathering correctly, they had much more mild symptoms in the past that were controlled/aided by medication, but the new religious references/being told by God etc are all newer and much more rash and severe problems. It almost seems like some sort of mental breakdown.

 

[Tacori E-ring]

I'm praying for those little children. Nothing makes me angry then ppl who have children and then treat them like this. I understand there is something mentally wrrong with your step son and his wife. Why the heck didn't anyone step in when they were popping out babies left and right?!?!?! Sorry NM my rant wasnt' directed at you just the situation. I truly hope they get the help they need and the children are fan safe and happy shortly.

SERIOUSLY? What do you suggest? Sterilization? These parents are mentally ill and need treatment. That does not mean they aren't capable of being good parents. Lack of compassion is why states cut mental health funding.

NM, I am glad you are being proactive. Hopefully authorities will find them and get them proper treatment soon.

 

[Cluless]

Any up dates Nonie? I've been praying and yes this is scary. Hope those kids are safe. With the comment they made "God will provide" is it possible that they've joined some kind of religious cult? Can someone close to them that they trust get a hold of them and maybe pretend that they're tired of their life and tell them that they think what they're doing is fabulous and would like to join them in their adventure of God providing for them? Just grasping at straws here but you never know. Hugs to you xo

 

[NonieMarie]

When the police imputed the missing persons reports, they got a hit in WY. At 12pm yesterday there was a disturbance on a Grey Hound bus and they were asked to get off in Rock Springs. They told the officer that they would wait and take the next bus going east. At 3am I received a call from a Cheyenne police officer. He was waiting for that bus and was going to do a welfare check. He called me back 30mins later and said that they were not on the bus. They either took another bus to a different location or they decided to get a room. The Rock Springs police are keeping an eye out. They do have a photo.
What happened to their vehicle and the dog is unknown. They may have left them in Oakland and caught a bus going east on 80. I am going to start calling motels in Rock Springs.

 

[junebug17]

Oh no - this situation has deteriorated - thank you for the update Noniemarie, I really hope the police can locate them soon. Please keep us posted when you can.

 

[minousbijoux]

NM: I'm so sorry you're having to go through this. So as not to offend anyone, I will say that I'm sending you thoughts, dust and positive outcome prayers to any higher power that may or may not exist...

 

[SB621]

I'm praying for those little children. Nothing makes me angry then ppl who have children and then treat them like this. I understand there is something mentally wrrong with your step son and his wife. Why the heck didn't anyone step in when they were popping out babies left and right?!?!?! Sorry NM my rant wasnt' directed at you just the situation. I truly hope they get the help they need and the children are fan safe and happy shortly.

SERIOUSLY? What do you suggest? Sterilization? These parents are mentally ill and need treatment. That does not mean they aren't capable of being good parents. Lack of compassion is why states cut mental health funding.

NM, I am glad you are being proactive. Hopefully authorities will find them and get them proper treatment soon.

Yes TE seriously If you can't mentally take care of yourself why are you having children. I do understand it seems this was a very recent downslide here, but my rant was more to the point of ppl being irresponsible when it comes to their kids safety, not that mentally handicapped shouldn't have children. Please don't put words in my mouth as you don't know me or my story. Seriously lack of compassion....

 

[NonieMarie]

Sitting waiting for a call back.....They were just pulled over in Iowa driving a new Tahoe that they purchased in WY. They must have paid cash! I don't know why they were stopped but his ID was flagged and my police dept was called.. Somehow, in the last 24hrs, her father hooked up with them. He lives in AZ. We are waiting for a supervisor to get to their location and do an evaluation. They did tell the police they were going to Chicago to preach the word.
Well, they have been released and are on their way to Chicago. Both officers said that they were talking crazy but the kids did not look bad so there was no way to hold them. They have now been removed from the missing persons data base.
My head is pounding

 

[LaraOnline]

Oh my goodness!
Sending you good wishes Nonimarie!
Isn't it illegal to take your kids out of school open-endedly?
Where are the kids enrolled?

 

[lulu]

Sitting waiting for a call back.....They were just pulled over in Iowa driving a new Tahoe that they purchased in WY. They must have paid cash! I don't know why they were stopped but his ID was flagged and my police dept was called.. Somehow, in the last 24hrs, her father hooked up with them. He lives in AZ. We are waiting for a supervisor to get to their location and do an evaluation. They did tell the police they were going to Chicago to preach the word.
Well, they have been released and are on their way to Chicago. Both officers said that they were talking crazy but the kids did not look bad so there was no way to hold them. They have now been removed from the missing persons data base.
My head is pounding

I can't believe the Police let them go. If the parents are talking crazy that's enough for clear and present danger and they should have put them on a 72 hour hold. Do you have the vehicle info and license number? How certain are you they're heading to Chicago? People like this can kill their kids. ( I'm so sorry to say this, but I've seen too much as an attorney.

You must get aggressive. I would call the Center for Missing and Exploited Children, Illinois CPS,and Chicago PD in no particular order. Be as assertive as you can and if they're not listening tell them you are afraid they will harm the kids. If they are still not listening tell them you are calling the local press and you are getting an attorney.Don't be afraid to be a bitch.

 

[TooPatient]

Oh, NM!

I'm sorry! I can't imagine what you're going through right now! Big hugs to you. Hoping there is something able to be done soon to get the kids and the dog to safety.

Lara -- Good question! Around here you get in big trouble if your kids miss a certain amount of school. Is there any way to get the kids to safety using that as reason?

What about the dog? If they just left him in a car maybe they could be picked up for animal cruelty?

 

[Tacori E-ring]

I'm praying for those little children. Nothing makes me angry then ppl who have children and then treat them like this. I understand there is something mentally wrrong with your step son and his wife. Why the heck didn't anyone step in when they were popping out babies left and right?!?!?! Sorry NM my rant wasnt' directed at you just the situation. I truly hope they get the help they need and the children are fan safe and happy shortly.

SERIOUSLY? What do you suggest? Sterilization? These parents are mentally ill and need treatment. That does not mean they aren't capable of being good parents. Lack of compassion is why states cut mental health funding.

NM, I am glad you are being proactive. Hopefully authorities will find them and get them proper treatment soon.

Yes TE seriously If you can't mentally take care of yourself why are you having children. I do understand it seems this was a very recent downslide here, but my rant was more to the point of ppl being irresponsible when it comes to their kids safety, not that mentally handicapped shouldn't have children. Please don't put words in my mouth as you don't know me or my story. Seriously lack of compassion....

It sounds like they do not have the insight to know they are endangering their children. Don't see how I put words in your mouth

NM, not sure if you saw my previous comments but there is something called a 3 party petition (at least in my state). This will get them placed in a mental health unit and help get them proper treatment. Manic patients almost never come willingly.

 

[lulu]

The kids are all under the age of 4 so school is not an issue.

If they call you or other relatives you might want to try some subterfuge like playing along with them ie you have people that need their religious guidance. Then, frankly, I'd snatch the kids. Have you been recording these calls?

 

[Skippy123]

Oh my gosh, that is horrible NM that the police couldn't stop them; I am so sorry to hear this. I am praying for these kids.

 

[NonieMarie]

I'm praying for those little children. Nothing makes me angry then ppl who have children and then treat them like this. I understand there is something mentally wrrong with your step son and his wife. Why the heck didn't anyone step in when they were popping out babies left and right?!?!?! Sorry NM my rant wasnt' directed at you just the situation. I truly hope they get the help they need and the children are fan safe and happy shortly.

SERIOUSLY? What do you suggest? Sterilization? These parents are mentally ill and need treatment. That does not mean they aren't capable of being good parents. Lack of compassion is why states cut mental health funding.

NM, I am glad you are being proactive. Hopefully authorities will find them and get them proper treatment soon.

Yes TE seriously If you can't mentally take care of yourself why are you having children. I do understand it seems this was a very recent downslide here, but my rant was more to the point of ppl being irresponsible when it comes to their kids safety, not that mentally handicapped shouldn't have children. Please don't put words in my mouth as you don't know me or my story. Seriously lack of compassion....

It sounds like they do not have the insight to know they are endangering their children. Don't see how I put words in your mouth

NM, not sure if you saw my previous comments but there is something called a 3 party petition (at least in my state). This will get them placed in a mental health unit and help get them proper treatment. Manic patients almost never come willingly.

My daughter is talking to an attorney friend and he will be doing research in regards to the 3 party petition. We may have a problem because he is in LA and we are in CA, AZ and UT.
I just talked to my daughter-in-law's father and he says he is in AZ and has not spoken to them in a week. Now we do not know who else is in the car.