Scotland and Ireland...

[Mara]

We're looking at going to London, Scotland and Ireland in late fall and wondered if anyone who had been to Scotland and Ireland on here had any suggestions on where to stay or recommendations on MUST SEE's. We have friends in London so we will probably stay with them and do some fun touristy things with them, but after that we are on our own.

We are just starting to do research on the trip so is there a must-have book to buy? Or just do all research online? I was able to find some options for places to stay online so far (www.booking.com), but wonder if there are any sites that are a must-checkout?

We like to see and visit historical areas and buildings etc, but do not want to overbook our days...and we are total foodies so suggestions on places that we HAVE to try are appreciated.

Anyway, any help/suggestions etc are appreciated, I'm a total novice when it comes to Europe as I have never been and I will probably be doing all the planning and scheduling for the trip.

Thanks!!

 

[Matata]

Mara,

Check out ricksteves.com We''ve used his guidebooks in England, Italy, Netherlands, Spain and will use one for Budapest this fall. We''ve found his recommendations are excellent for what to see and what not to see. We love his restaurant recommendations as they are usually far from the touristy places so you get great food and an opportunity to meet the locals. His room and board needs are more basic than ours so I usually check out his recommendations on line if they list a web site. If you choose the pricier places he recommends, you''ll be much happier.

 

[Odilia]

I know very little about Scotland or England, but will try to think about places in Ireland that are worthwhile. The whole country is beautiful. One that I particularly liked is Glendalough (pardon any spelling errors) which is not too far from Dublin. It''s a beautiful place with history attached. The Cliffs of Moher are beautiful but on the west coast, likewise the Dingle Peninsula. Oh boy I''m drawing a blank. I will look through my Ireland photo album and try to come up with some suggestions.

"Glendalough, with its famous round tower is one of the most enduring images of County Wicklow. You can see the tower in the picture above with the lakes behind. A truly beautiful location which is steeped history...The English name Glendalough comes from the Irish Gleann Dá Locha which translates to ''The valley of the two lakes''. "
"Glendalough is only 18 miles (30km) south of Dublin and is a popular destination for day-trippers. The Gaelic name translates to ‘valley of the two lakes’ and there are some breathtaking walks around the ruined monastery and along the clear-as-glass lakes."

 

[Odilia]

Cliffs of Moher

 

[Odilia]

I am not having much luck finding photos that do it justice either but here''s another at Glendalough.

 

[Odilia]

ok one more since I realized they referred to this picture in the text I copied above:

 

[ladykemma]

tara, kilkenny, waterford, cashel, newgrange, mongolian barbecue in temple bar, dublin, book of kells in dublin, pub food everywhere.

watch out for "bank holiday" and sundays, make sure you have a place to stay because everything shuts down in rural ireland. not even a place to eat. (ask me how I know). train is cheap easy way to get around, along with a rented bicycle.

 

[ephemery1]

Ugh, I am so JEALOUS!!! But um, enjoy your trip, I guess.

I lived in London for a semester during college and had the most amazing time ever (much to my BF''s dismay, who wasn''t around then and resents my referring to that as unequivocally the best time of my life.)

As for restaurants/good eats... we were starving students but one of our absolute favs was Wagamama''s... basically a Japanese noodle-house chain around the city. SOOOOO good and fairly inexpensive... I think they have a website if you wanted to do some preliminary restaurant stalking (one of my personal favorite past-times). I''ll try and remember some more...

 

[Sundial]

Oh you are going to have a wonderful time! We loved England and Ireland, but haven''t been to Scotland yet. I HIGHLY recommend a stay at Dromoland Castle in County Clare in Ireland if it fits in your plans. It is an old ancestral home that has been beautifully maintained and staying there is a really special experience. The surrounding area is lovely.

 

[movie zombie]

add in a bit of wales since you''re in the area: king edwards castles are not to be missed. besides, its a very small country.......

scotland: if you have a car and are getting out into the countryside, the Orkney Islands are wonderful. there was a membership i bought to a group before i left and it got me into most things...castles, gardens, etc. at a reduced rate. can''t remember the name but it may surface in awhile. also, some ferry lines have a discount day [monday?] which is very very reasonable for taking a car across to islands.

ireland: anything on the west coast. there is a perfumery out in the burren. i can probably find the name and contact info for a very nice couple who have a b&b on the west coast near the burren and who grow their own produce. the coast of county mayo is lonely and goregous. she''s an ex-nurse who went to africa and he''s a bus driver who calls in sick when the surf is up...sounds like santa cruz.

dublin: stay out of the core city with a car. i did it and spent $4.00 US per hour for parking and that was back in 1999. stay in a b&b outside of the city core and take the train in. i did that also.

except for the big cities, scotland, england, wales, and ireland are very very easy with a rental car.

have an itinerary and be prepared to break it as you will find things as you go along that you don''t want to miss.

lots depends on when you plan to go. personally, i don''t enjoy traveling at peak season and prefer the ''shoulder'' seasons.

if you decide you''re into ancient sites, i can recommend some books.

movie zombie

ps and i don''t care what anyone says, stonehenge is worth it. go early first thing in the morning. beat the bus loads of tourists and enjoy the space.

 

[Sundial]

Durty Nelly''s Pub and Bunratty Castle are fun and interesting places to visit near Dromoland Castle in County Clare.

 

[glaucomflecken]

All I know is that I will be following this thread very closely because DH and I are planning to go there too in fall! We wanted to for our honeymoon last year but with the move never made it. Mara when are you guys planning on going? Ive never been to Europe either!

 

[ChargerGrrl]

Mara:
It''s been forever since I''ve been to London, and have never been to Ireland or Scotland.
So the info/advice I''m giving is for travel planning in general.

My favorite travel guides hands-down are DK Eyewitness. They''ve never steered me wrong! They do have comprehensive country & city books, but what I did for my last European vacation was just do extensive research online, and then traveled with their TOP 10 books for the cities I visited. You''ll find them in any bookstore, but here''s their site: http://us.dk.com/static/cs/us/11/travel/intro.html

Tripadvisor.com is invaluable for checking out lodging. I ended up booking a couple of great places in Amsterdam and Prague last fall. The member reviews are very helpful, but the forums lag: http://www.tripadvisor.com/

Last but not least, here''s a great site for all the little travel "thingies" you''ll need. The WC kits have saved my butt in many countries! http://www.magellans.com/.

HAPPY PLANNING!
CG

 

[Mara]

thanks everyone!

so much information! i can plan a hot weather resort trip with my hands tied behind my back but this is a whole other ballgame!

my coworker is actually english and her husband is from scotland so she was giving me some tips and ideas too and said he had some books at home that i could borrow on scotland. she also sent me the links for the inter-country island-hopping airplane information and said that the flights between the various areas are really cheap which is good to know. or we can drive which she said to alot of people is alot of driving, but for us californians it isn't much at all, aka it's 6 hours from one place to another and that is like LA to N. CA basically. so we'll have to see what we think we'll want to do.

i want to be in the cities just for the experience but i'd also like to get out and view some countryside and some less crowded places too. we love going to places where locals will go, especially to EAT so we'll have to check out rick steves information ala matata. i'm a little worried that i won't like the food all that much because you always hear that English food is a little bland but i figure if nothing else i can eat fish and chips for 2 weeks straight, i love that! but hopefully we can find some varieties on fare around there. greg loves English food and he loves beer too so i'm sure he will be happy!

punchie and mz, we were thinking of going at end of october. i really wanted to go in early sept but we have a busy month already so october seems like the next open area to go, and my birthday is that month too so that'd be kind of fun...to be in europe on a birthday. my coworker was saying it will be pretty cold in scotland and ireland in particular around that time which is kind of a bummer since it's always easier to pack for warm weather, things like shorts and flip flops only take up a tiny bit of room whereas sweaters and pants take up more ... BAH. was hoping to just take a small rolly-carry-on for luggage as we will be moving around a fair amount and it's not like we are going to just one place for 2 weeks. so we'll have to see. but we can't go this summer, so unless we don't go in fall (california fall anyway) then we won't be able to go til next summer and we are already planning on going to hawaii and tahiti for our third anniversary in may of 2007, so i dont know if we want to do 2 big trips like that for 2007. we're kind of trying to do one big thing a year.

anyway...thanks so far for all the great information!! i have to sort through it all and get a book or two !! there is also a fare sale right now and virgin and british airways are having great fares, 750 per person nonstop inclusive of all fees and taxes, a few months ago i was looking and it was more like 1150! so i'd love to take advantage of the savings.

 

[Selkie]

My brother and SIL went to Ireland for their honeymoon last year. They loved every place they saw, and I''ll ask for a few recommendations on places to stay. I believe they had heard great things about the city of Kinsale on the SW coast for cuisine, although they didn''t have the forethought to make reservations before going there, and found it difficult to find a restaurant with seats!

 

[movie zombie]

end of october will be cold and rainy, especially in scotland and ireland, and particularly on their west coasts. some castles and gardens will be closed. you will definitely need rain gear if you intend to get out into the country side.

movie zombie

ps yes, people were amazed that i would drive distances to see things and not stay the night at the other location. however, its not just being californian....gas prices there have always been the equivalent of $4/gallon here when i''ve traveled there and most people just won''t use that kind of $$$ for traveling even though they do have smaller cars. btw, i really do suggest driving as it does allow you more flexibility in seeing the country side.

tell greg that the closer you get to ireland the better guiness tastes! and seafood chowder with a pint of guiness makes sitting out a rain storm not bad at all.

 

[Lorelei]

Mara if you rent a car it will probably be a stick shift, automatics are unusual in the British Isles. I drive one all the time, but they can take a little getting used to. Yes gas is terribly expensive and many stores will be closed on Sundays, some might stick to the old tradition of early closing on Wednesday. In the fall it will be dark around 4 - 4.30 pm and probably quite rainy too so bring some cold and wet weather clothes! While you are here you need to try an English Sunday Roast dinner with roast beef, Yorkshire pudding, roast potatoes etc - this is an essential!

 

[glitterkitty]

Hi Mara,

Ok - its cold, wet and windy in the UK at the end of October, particularly if you are travelling to Scotland and the west coast of Ireland, so bring lots of warm clothes and waterproofs!

Best places to visit? London, obviously - but also the Lake District is stunning, as are the Yorkshire Dales, particularly when the heather is out.

Edinburgh is a wonderful city - we visited there last year for the first time, and went back three months later because we loved it so much. You can also drive up into the mountains in Scotland from there and see all the lochs etc.

Many of the tourist attractions such as the huge country houses tend to close from late September/October so I would do a search of what will be open - The National Trust and English Heritage give lots of useful info on opening times etc. I can''t remember the name of the organisation that looks after historic buildings in Scotland, but you should be able to find it online ok.

There are no Bank Holidays (public holidays) during Oct and November so you don''t need to worry about that. November 5th is the day there are huge firework displays across the country, and people gather round bonfires.

If you''re considering flying between destinations, check that the cheap airlines fly into them. It is very rare for us Brits to fly between cities - we tend to drive as we have such a small country!

As an idea of how long it will take to drive beween places - if you look at a map of the UK, I live just over half way down the eastern side. It takes approx 3hrs to get to London and about 41/2 hrs to get to Edinburgh. The motorway network is pretty extensive between major cities, but there can be a lot of congestion.

sorry to go on so long, but I do hope you will come over here and see us all!

 

[Madam Bijoux]

When I spent a summer touring England, Scotland and Wales, I stayed at bed-and-breakfast places. Some of them were farm houses and some were wonderful old mansions. You get to meet some fascinating people that way.

 

[Gemklctr]

London: the usual sites in town (especially the Crown Jewels in the Tower), plus day trips to Stratford-on-Avon and Stonehenge.

Sterling Castle (maybe the best castle in England/Scotland)

Edinburgh: the Castle, Hollyrude House, Arthur''s Seat and the Royal Mile.

Inverness: Loch Ness

Dublin: the Guiness Brewery tour.

 

[mrssalvo]

Mara, i will be following this thread and info on your trip. I would love to go to Ireland someday. It will still be a few years off for us with other vacations coming first in line but I mentioned to hubby about going for our 10th annivesary. I can''t wait to hear what you decide.

 

[Mara]

you guys are the best with the info!!

we were talking last nite and thought maybe we'd like to take the train from london to scotland (i think it's scotland that has the train) and then maybe drive to ireland or something rather than fly. we don't mind driving or doing alternate methods...so we'll have to see how we can work it all out.

the thing that really bums me out is the cold weather part. i am a total california girl....and i don't own real weather gear or raingear...and the thought of it being all rainy and cold is soooooo not appealing. but i guess regardless of when you go that is the possibility right? it's just even more so around that time of year. i wish we could go in early september, maybe we can see if we can move some things around. i wonder if that would be a little better in terms of the cold and rain??

mrs salvo and punchie, hope my thread could be of some help to you guys in planning your future trip!! PS is the best for this type of research, not just about diamonds!

 

[TravelingGal]

Mara, this should be a great trip...and you don't go to any of these places for the weather, because it WILL rain to some degree. However, having said that, I went to Ireland the first two weeks of October, 2002. Sunny and nice almost every day, and no rain once. They had just come off the driest September in decades, and it held off until the middle of Oct. Then rain rain rain every single day, is what I heard. But you never know...so plan when you can go. It is not uncommon for terrible weather in September. The only real obvious benefit I can see is that the days will be just a bit longer.

Here are my Ireland photos, if you'd like to see them. Just picked a few that I liked the best. It's on Kodak Gallery and you have to sign in. If you don't have an account, just create a fake one...I don't think you even need to give them a real email address, as long as it's unique.

http://www.kodakgallery.com/I.jsp?c=11mrb34j.10tcveer&x=1&y=m73k7b

If you'd like to read my trip report on fodors, you can go to: http://fodors.com/forums/threadselect.jsp?screen_name=crazymina.

I LOVED Ireland, as well as London. I really have to get back to do Scotland. For Ireland, even though it's a bit intimidating at first, I would highly recommend renting a car. Part of the fun are those beautiful (and sometimes SCARY, i.e. conors pass) drives.

I started in Galway to get a bigger city (but not as big as dublin). Then spend one night in Doolin and go to Gus O'Connors pub. Pretty touristy, but fun, and it's a cool pub. Cliffs of Moher were nice, but also tons of tourists. I met some guys who were throwing their hats and sweaters off a certain spot on the cliffs...but they come back to you (if you throw them up in the air, and not straight down!). Dingle peninsula is gorgeous, and I think Slea Head drive is nice. Coming from the north, you can do Conors pass into Dingle...scary as it's windy and narrow (and a cliff drop down without side rails) but fantastic views. Lots of people do the Ring of Kerry (I did not) but keep in mind the tour buses are allowed on the ring. You will not find them on Slea Head drive, from what I remember because the roads are not wide enough. Lots of tourists love Killarney and other ring cities. I drove through them, and they are probably worth a look.

B&Bs are still the way to go. Dromoland castle, as someone recommended, is pricey but I hear it worth it, especially since you are not traveling alone like I did. In Dingle, Heaton House and Greenmount House get consistently the best reviews. I stayed at Greenmount and the breakfast was definitely the best.

From there I did a stop in Kinsale (nice) and Adare (not that impressed). I have heard the Waterford tour is worth it, as well as the Jameson's tour. I am a Guinness fan, but heard that you don't get to see the brewery...it's just a museum tour, so keep that in mind if you plan on doing it.

If you do drive, get the Michelin Road map of Ireland..a spiral bound map. Invaluable to me.

Speaking of driving, you need to double check about driving from UK to Ireland. Obviously you will have to take the ferry. However, I have heard that you can't take a car rental from UK to Ireland. This may not be the case anymore. The reason why is renting a car in Ireland has its issues. GET the insurance from the rental company in Ireland. The two countries that most platinum credit card's collison coverage will NOT cover is Ireland and Italy...if that tells you anything! I lost a mirror in Ireland...the roads are so narrow, it's easy to lose parts of the car. Also, lots of potholes which can lead to flat tires. I rented from Dan Dooley and at the time, tires were covered under their insurance. You may have to turn in your car in the UK and rent on the other side.

Also, if you are really only going for two weeks, you may want to reconsider dropping something. You can easily spend a week in London. I spent two weeks in Ireland and only did the west and southwest. In Ireland, don't let the mileage fool you...you're driving at 30 miles an hour if you are lucky, and I've been stuck behind a tractor plenty of times. What you estimate should take you 2 hours will take 6. Unless you are driving on the main road in Ireland, the roads are two laners...and narrow...two cars barely fit and sometimes you have to turn off.)

I'm a foodie too. In London, I am sure you will find plenty. Do Indian if you like it. In Ireland, I pretty much ate pub grub. Guiness Stew and mussels...they do them well. Some may disagree but the Irish aren't exactly known for gourmet cuisine. However, you can definitely find good food. I love soda bread...great with stew. I'm trying to think what else was yummy in Ireland, but I may need to come back and think about it. You can definitely have lots of potatoes though...lol. Anyway, breakfast is what I enjoyed in Ireland!

I'm happy to help if I can. Just let me know. There are tons of great threads on the fodors message boards. I LOVED Ireland...people were totally kind to a solo traveling Korean gal. They were so curious! I'll write more on London later...

 

[TravelingGal]

I thought I'd post an excerpt from my fodors trip report here. As for the stinky skanky clothes part...Ireland has banned smoking indoors (amazing!) I believe...so the issue may not be as bad as it was when I was there!!!

USEFUL THINGS I BELIEVE YOU SHOULD KNOW.

IRISH LINGO:
If someone says to you "How's the craic?"or "What's the craic?" (pronounced "crack"), do not be alarmed. They are not asking you if you have excellent quality drugs you can sell them. Instead, they want to know how the fun is going. You'll hear this often if you're in a pub and an Irish person walks in; they want to know if people are having a good time and if it's worth sticking around. Likewise, if you had a blast the night before, you can say "Ahhh…that was some good craic." Guinness is always better laced with craic.

The second word you must know is "Slainte!" Pronounced "schlancha", it is the Irish word for "cheers", and as pubs are a normal part of life around there, should you visit Ireland, you will find yourself saying it to every man, woman, child, and granny. When I first arrived in Ireland, I was very relieved that an old man raised his glass to me and said "slainte" because I learned the correct pronunciation early in my stay. This saved me the embarrassment of accepting a pint from a stranger, raising my glass and shouting "Slanty!" At which point, I would imagine he would lean in, peer at my eyes for some time and admit a bit reluctantly, "Well, they are a bit slanty, yeah."

DRIVING:
It’s not that bad. Really. However, get the most super duper deluxe insurance you can get. In fact, if they have an option where you can bet you will return the car missing something, take it…you will make money! I paid extra for the zero deductible. It made hearing the continuous “GA-DONK!” as I landed in potholes or hit a hedge much easier to bear. I came out way ahead of the game since at one point while driving I looked at my passenger side mirror and noticed it was skewed. I tried to straighten it with the controls, and it became unhinged from its frame and just teetered there for awhile. I could only watch in helpless dismay when it blew off with the next gust of wind.

At least I didn’t run over any sheep (and there were plenty of them around.)

Also, get a good map. I really like the Michelin spiral bound for Great Britain and Ireland. Bring a highlighter…it makes seeing where you’re going a lot easier. Signs are decent for main roads. The problem for me was finding my B&B once I GOT into town. If you have set destinations, do ask the proprietors directions before you leave for Ireland.

STINKY, SKANKY, MORNING AFTER CLOTHES:
I packed light…only brought three pairs of pants for 15 days (I know…disgusting!) The smoke in the pubs wasn’t as bad as I thought, but I did reek. So bring Febreze! It will save you! Towards the end of my trip, whenever I tried to pull on my jeans, they shrieked and dashed around the room trying to escape me. They clung to the bedpost and begged for me not to put them on. Only the Febreze was able to coax them. Travel sizes are available for a couple of dollars at your local store.

A NOTE ON PUBS:
Pubs filled with tourists can be fun. But see if you can find one that has some locals in it. Part of the fun is hearing them sing along with the music (they seem to know the words to everything). I was very fortunate being alone that a lot of the Irish approached me (interestingly enough, I didn’t speak to any Americans while I was there). Closing down a pub with just a small group of locals is a priceless experience, and it only happened to me once…all because I spoke Spanish. Don’t ask…it’s another story altogether.

THE MOST USELESS THING I BROUGHT:
Definitely the umbrella. Correction…“portable” umbrella. I was extremely fortunate that it only rained on me 2 mornings out of 15 days. A miracle. But when it does rain, those dinky umbrellas are useless, because the rain is often accompanied by a hearty wind. Then you’re left looking like Mary Poppins on crack. Either bring a good one, or just enjoy the rain.

FOR THE SOLO TRAVELER – TRUST YOUR GUT INSTINCT.
Traveling alone is especially rewarding because of the people you meet. While it is of the utmost importance to be cautious, do allow yourself the flexibility to hang out with “strangers”. One of my most amusing experiences was in Kinsale, hanging out with a group of about 4 lads from Ireland Insurance. They asked me to join their party after the pub closed. It turned out to be a private party of 80 people associated with Ireland Insurance…ALL MEN. I was the ONLY woman in the room…I didn’t know whether to sing praises to the Lord, or run for my life! The night only got better as they sang and had a merry time…culminating in half the group dropping their trousers (again, don’t ask). I couldn’t click my camera fast enough. Another priceless experience that money can’t buy.

 

[TravelingGal]

One last thing...you definitely can get an automatic in Ireland, but you must request it and pay extra for it. Standard rental cars are manual. But it was no problem finding a place that had automatic rental. Definitely do yourself a favor and get the automatic...you don''t need the extra stress of a stick shift in Ireland.

 

[glitterkitty]

If you could make it early sept, you''ll stand a much better chance with the weather. I was in Edinbugh that time last year, and it was glorious. Not as good as California, but you know!

Taking the train from London to Edinburgh is a good idea - if you travel along the East Coast main line you see some great scenery on the coast. If you can go cross country, you can see the start of the Lake District and the West coast.

You may well have problems taking a hire car from the UK to Ireland - its prob best to get to Ireland first and then sort it out there.

Teh Irish republic and Scotland have now introduced a smoking ban in bars - so maybe you won''t need too much Febreeze with you!

 

[mrssalvo]

Date: 5/16/2006 12:19:43 PM
Author: Mara
\


mrs salvo and punchie, hope my thread could be of some help to you guys in planning your future trip!! PS is the best for this type of research, not just about diamonds!

I agree. I figure the type people who research silly things like diamonds must really know the scoop on travel destinations

 

[TravelingGal]

Date: 5/16/2006 1:44:24 PM
Author: mrssalvo

Date: 5/16/2006 12:19:43 PM
Author: Mara



mrs salvo and punchie, hope my thread could be of some help to you guys in planning your future trip!! PS is the best for this type of research, not just about diamonds!

I agree. I figure the type people who research silly things like diamonds must really know the scoop on travel destinations

LOL, you aren''t kidding...message boards are the best way to research anything. I have been on the fodors.com messageboards for years...never led me astray. Go to the europe board and do a search on whatever you are looking for. I read through threads until my eyes scream when I am researching for a trip.

 

[lisaC]

Mara have you looked at follow the reader on SFGate.com?
Yep they''re kinda old but it''s a start. Are you going to Dublin? I went when I was 21- it fell on Easter weekend and lots were closed. But it was fabulous just walking around taking in the sights. Trinity college, the pubs, the bridges over the Liffey.

Where in Scotland- Edinburgh? It''s fun getting on the open air double deckers for the tour of the city. All the stuff gemcollector mentioned. Princes st., Wonder if they still fire the cannon? Stirling where Stirling Castle is not far outta Edinburgh. Stirling is a tiny little town- loads of pubs though- I was there for 2 years.

And London- Harrod you just gotta go and you cannot miss the food hall!
I suppose you won''t be there when the Edinburgh Tattoo is scheduled or else it''s probably sold out already.
Hope you have a glorious time. Gosh I miss it...

 

[Mara]

wow thanks for the additional info!!! there is so much to sift through. i haven''t even read it all yet TG but i love the bits of info you included!

we can extend the trip to 3 weeks possibly if there is that much to see...we just figured 2 weeks would be enough to get a taste of everything without too much of an overdose. we tend to get homesick after ~2.5 weeks also..hehee.

as for the manual vs automatic, it doesn''t matter because we both drive manuals and pretty much prefer it, and we''re used to driving long distances here anyway with it. but good to know regardless.