marital status bias

[mary poppins]

Thoughts on marital status bias?

Do you think you have experienced it either to your detriment or benefit? Have you observed it in your work place?
Do you remove, or have you ever removed, your e-ring and /or wedding ring for an interview or job based on perceived marital status bias?

For context, here's a U.K. article, a U.S. article and a study which serves as the basis of the U.S. article.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/womens-life/10385246/Third-of-women-remove-wedding-rings-to-enhance-career-prospects.html

http://www.ilr.cornell.edu/news/GenderCounts_121012.html

http://www-psych.stanford.edu/~ajordan/papers/Jordan%20&%20Zitek%20-%20Marital%20Status%20Bias%20in%20Perceptions%20of%20Employees.pdf

 

[CharmyPoo]

My work looks for diversity and values family. I don't see a married women being put in a disadvantage here.

However, I can see some employers (smaller organizations) worried that they will go on mat leave / less flexible due to kids at home.

 

[missy]

It's sort of the opposite where I work. Bonuses are partly dependent on if you have children because then your need is more and you get a larger bonus. Absolutely true. The clinic administrator said that was how he determined bonuses for the employees. I'm an independent consultant at the clinic and we don't get bonuses but the younger employees without children and the single employees were not happy.

 

[Gypsy]

Well.

When I was engaged I was concerned about the fact that I would be getting married just a couple months after I was interviewing. But I knew I'd have to ask for the time off anyway, regardless, so I didn't hide anything.

Since then, I've had a very 'take it or leave it' attitude toward places I interview. I'm me. Hire me or not, but I'm not going to hide key parts of myself or my life for a job. Frankly though, my skills and background make me a pretty attractive candidate for most people hiring for what I do. So... they'd be stupid to care. And I can't say I'd work for someone that stupid anyway. And I am a strong believer in work life balance, married or not, so I state that quite plainly upfront in interviews anyway.

In my opinion, if I am a professional and manage my workload so that it doesn't impact anyone negatively, and I consistently meet or exceed goals then I am doing a good job. And that should be the main thing that matters, not anything else.

As for my current job, which I am very happy at. I can't say that I see any different treatment for single versus married. Or with kids or without. My boss is very much a person that looks at people as individuals. And the company has no issues with maternity leave. A TON of my co-workers have young kids or are pregnant. One my my peers has a bunch of kids, including a little one just over a year so she needs some flexibility there. And while I have no kids, I have health issues that require flexibility. And my boss treats us very similarly, as individuals with individual needs. There are single people on the team too, and they get flexibility for whatever it is that they need. One of the single ladies hates mornings, so she comes in at 10 and she rungs marathons and things so she needs time off for events. None of it is an issue as long as we are responsible and get our work done.

And I would say 90% of my teammates are married. And when I am interviewing people (which I do often) for positions in our team I couldn't care LESS if they were married or single.

 

[sonnyjane]

It's sort of the opposite where I work. Bonuses are partly dependent on if you have children because then your need is more and you get a larger bonus. Absolutely true. The clinic administrator said that was how he determined bonuses for the employees. I'm an independent consultant at the clinic and we don't get bonuses but the younger employees without children and the single employees were not happy.

Holy crap! Yeah, as a childless-by-choice person that wouldn't fly with me!

My field doesn't have any type of bias toward one or the other. I once had an interview when they asked me what my husband did for a living (they aren't allowed to ask that) but I wasn't really sure what to say so I just said he "works for the government" (he's in the military). If I would have said military they would have asked what he did, how long we'll be stationed here, etc. etc. - all things they aren't allowed to ask.

 

[jess719]

Well.

When I was engaged I was concerned about the fact that I would be getting married just a couple months after I was interviewing. But I knew I'd have to ask for the time off anyway, regardless, so I didn't hide anything.

Since then, I've had a very 'take it or leave it' attitude toward places I interview. I'm me. Hire me or not, but I'm not going to hide key parts of myself or my life for a job. Frankly though, my skills and background make me a pretty attractive candidate for most people hiring for what I do. So... they'd be stupid to care. And I can't say I'd work for someone that stupid anyway. And I am a strong believer in work life balance, married or not, so I state that quite plainly upfront in interviews anyway.

In my opinion, if I am a professional and manage my workload so that it doesn't impact anyone negatively, and I consistently meet or exceed goals then I am doing a good job. And that should be the main thing that matters, not anything else.

As for my current job, which I am very happy at. I can't say that I see any different treatment for single versus married. Or with kids or without. My boss is very much a person that looks at people as individuals. And the company has no issues with maternity leave. A TON of my co-workers have young kids or are pregnant. One my my peers has a bunch of kids, including a little one just over a year so she needs some flexibility there. And while I have no kids, I have health issues that require flexibility. And my boss treats us very similarly, as individuals with individual needs. There are single people on the team too, and they get flexibility for whatever it is that they need. One of the single ladies hates mornings, so she comes in at 10 and she rungs marathons and things so she needs time off for events. None of it is an issue as long as we are responsible and get our work done.

And I would say 90% of my teammates are married. And when I am interviewing people (which I do often) for positions in our team I couldn't care LESS if they were married or single.

Your workplace sounds amazing!!

 

[Harpertoo]

I definitely remember the sense that some individuals were reluctant to mentor a married woman who might go out on leave as opposed to a young male trader more likely to fit the mold of 'work comes first'.
I also know there was a perception that some women ' didn't have to work' -- and that created a sense they may be less ambitious and hungry.
This was obviously not part of the promotional material when HR went recruiting... a lot of mission statements with happy talk of diversity and family friendly values.

 

[missy]

It's sort of the opposite where I work. Bonuses are partly dependent on if you have children because then your need is more and you get a larger bonus. Absolutely true. The clinic administrator said that was how he determined bonuses for the employees. I'm an independent consultant at the clinic and we don't get bonuses but the younger employees without children and the single employees were not happy.

Holy crap! Yeah, as a childless-by-choice person that wouldn't fly with me!

My field doesn't have any type of bias toward one or the other. I once had an interview when they asked me what my husband did for a living (they aren't allowed to ask that) but I wasn't really sure what to say so I just said he "works for the government" (he's in the military). If I would have said military they would have asked what he did, how long we'll be stationed here, etc. etc. - all things they aren't allowed to ask.

Yeah, I don't think it is a fair way to determine bonuses. It should be based on merit and of course so should hiring. One of my close girlfriends quit as soon as she found another job after the clinic administrator explained the bonus system (among other reasons because as you might imagine he's a joy to work with).

 

[manderz]

I remove all rings for interviews. When I interviewed for my first position with the agency I'm working at, both interviews, the HR person asked what my relationship status was. Then, when I signed background check papers after I accepted an offer, I forgot to take my ring off, and she had a comment about it, and my inferred relationship status. I don't know if it would have changed things at all, but after that experience, I'll not be wearing rings to another interview.

 

[mary poppins]

It's sort of the opposite where I work. Bonuses are partly dependent on if you have children because then your need is more and you get a larger bonus. Absolutely true. The clinic administrator said that was how he determined bonuses for the employees. I'm an independent consultant at the clinic and we don't get bonuses but the younger employees without children and the single employees were not happy.

Holy crap! Yeah, as a childless-by-choice person that wouldn't fly with me!

My field doesn't have any type of bias toward one or the other. I once had an interview when they asked me what my husband did for a living (they aren't allowed to ask that) but I wasn't really sure what to say so I just said he "works for the government" (he's in the military). If I would have said military they would have asked what he did, how long we'll be stationed here, etc. etc. - all things they aren't allowed to ask.

Yeah, I don't think it is a fair way to determine bonuses. It should be based on merit and of course so should hiring. One of my close girlfriends quit as soon as she found another job after the clinic administrator explained the bonus system (among other reasons because as you might imagine he's a joy to work with).

When I saw your first post, I thought whoa, way to disincentivize everyone and reduce productivity. Then saw your second post and though whaaaaat?! The administrator actually disclosed that bonus system?! Wow, wow, wow!

 

[Gypsy]

Well.

When I was engaged I was concerned about the fact that I would be getting married just a couple months after I was interviewing. But I knew I'd have to ask for the time off anyway, regardless, so I didn't hide anything.

Since then, I've had a very 'take it or leave it' attitude toward places I interview. I'm me. Hire me or not, but I'm not going to hide key parts of myself or my life for a job. Frankly though, my skills and background make me a pretty attractive candidate for most people hiring for what I do. So... they'd be stupid to care. And I can't say I'd work for someone that stupid anyway. And I am a strong believer in work life balance, married or not, so I state that quite plainly upfront in interviews anyway.

In my opinion, if I am a professional and manage my workload so that it doesn't impact anyone negatively, and I consistently meet or exceed goals then I am doing a good job. And that should be the main thing that matters, not anything else.

As for my current job, which I am very happy at. I can't say that I see any different treatment for single versus married. Or with kids or without. My boss is very much a person that looks at people as individuals. And the company has no issues with maternity leave. A TON of my co-workers have young kids or are pregnant. One my my peers has a bunch of kids, including a little one just over a year so she needs some flexibility there. And while I have no kids, I have health issues that require flexibility. And my boss treats us very similarly, as individuals with individual needs. There are single people on the team too, and they get flexibility for whatever it is that they need. One of the single ladies hates mornings, so she comes in at 10 and she rungs marathons and things so she needs time off for events. None of it is an issue as long as we are responsible and get our work done.

And I would say 90% of my teammates are married. And when I am interviewing people (which I do often) for positions in our team I couldn't care LESS if they were married or single.

Your workplace sounds amazing!!

I am very lucky. I had a LOT of crappy employers before this job. Just one after another bad, then better, then worse, worse still, worst ever, then this...

So I got a lot of experience in screening employers for issues. Plus I started temping at temp to perm positions which helped me figure out if a place was really good, or just knew the right things to say during interviews.

I do work for a national company that is often hiring though. So if you can figure out how to contact me offline I can let you know the company name

 

[Gypsy]

I remove all rings for interviews. When I interviewed for my first position with the agency I'm working at, both interviews, the HR person asked what my relationship status was. Then, when I signed background check papers after I accepted an offer, I forgot to take my ring off, and she had a comment about it, and my inferred relationship status. I don't know if it would have changed things at all, but after that experience, I'll not be wearing rings to another interview.

That's illegal. And personally it would be a flag for me. Remember interviews are two ways. You are interviewing them as much as they are you. I would have eliminated them as a possible employer right there.

 

[Gypsy]

It's sort of the opposite where I work. Bonuses are partly dependent on if you have children because then your need is more and you get a larger bonus. Absolutely true. The clinic administrator said that was how he determined bonuses for the employees. I'm an independent consultant at the clinic and we don't get bonuses but the younger employees without children and the single employees were not happy.

Holy crap! Yeah, as a childless-by-choice person that wouldn't fly with me!

My field doesn't have any type of bias toward one or the other. I once had an interview when they asked me what my husband did for a living (they aren't allowed to ask that) but I wasn't really sure what to say so I just said he "works for the government" (he's in the military). If I would have said military they would have asked what he did, how long we'll be stationed here, etc. etc. - all things they aren't allowed to ask.

Yeah, I don't think it is a fair way to determine bonuses. It should be based on merit and of course so should hiring. One of my close girlfriends quit as soon as she found another job after the clinic administrator explained the bonus system (among other reasons because as you might imagine he's a joy to work with).

When I saw your first post, I thought whoa, way to disincentivize everyone and reduce productivity. Then saw your second post and though whaaaaat?! The administrator actually disclosed that bonus system?! Wow, wow, wow!

Yeah, I'm sorry. I'm a liberal but... this is a job not welfare. What does having kids have to do with a performance based evaluation of your merit as an employee. That wouldn't fly with me either.

 

[texaskj]

I remove all rings for interviews. When I interviewed for my first position with the agency I'm working at, both interviews, the HR person asked what my relationship status was. Then, when I signed background check papers after I accepted an offer, I forgot to take my ring off, and she had a comment about it, and my inferred relationship status. I don't know if it would have changed things at all, but after that experience, I'll not be wearing rings to another interview.

That's illegal. And personally it would be a flag for me. Remember interviews are two ways. You are interviewing them as much as they are you. I would have eliminated them as a possible employer right there.

+100 Gypsy, I couldn't agree more. So many people don't ever realize this and with the lovely economy we've had the last six years, can't put it into practice. I have ended interviews for less egregious mistakes made by the interviewer.
I've never experienced any discrimination because of marital status, but oh boy, don't get me started about the children thing.

 

[zoebartlett]

I've never experienced it, and it would never cross my mind to remove my rings for a job interview. I work in a very family-friendly field though.

Wow, Missy, that seems really unfair.

 

[Ally T]

I am in the UK & have never personally experienced it, possibly because I became engaged quickly into my relationship, married quickly after that followed by getting pregnant 6 months after that. I was in the same company for that time, leaving for good when I gave birth.

But, my sister in law has experienced it. As a Manager for a medical company, she attended a meeting one day where her director outlined some more responsibilities he was handing over. She works flat out & travels constantly. She had an upcoming holiday & the boss asked if she was going anywhere nice. She responded that she was off to Hawaii with my brother & they were getting married there (they weren't even engaged at this time & had planned to just elope). Apparently his face dropped & you could cut the atmosphere with a knife. She asked rather awkwardly if there was a problem, to which he replied along the lines of "Possibly. Are you planning on having children after you're married?" She was horrified. Consequently she took only 6 months maternity leave with both children instead of the usual 9-12 months here, and struggles like hell with childcare if my brother is also working away. Her boss fully expects those children to be in care from 7am before school (its called breakfast club) and care at the end of the day until 6.30pm. He has no regard for the fact that those children hardly see their parents & no sympathy for her trips away. Whilst I understand this is the nature of her job & always has been, it was not his nature to be so callous until she mentioned her upcoming wedding. She says since then he has been super hard on her, often unfairly so.

 

[dk168]

I have always been open and honest about my marital status, and have never encountered any bias or issue. However, I am child-free with no dependants.

I have always worn a ring on my ring finger, regardless whether I was/am in a relationship or not. It only gets removed when I have to because of my line of work, being in the pharma/food industry working in controlled environments.

DK

 

[missy]

It's sort of the opposite where I work. Bonuses are partly dependent on if you have children because then your need is more and you get a larger bonus. Absolutely true. The clinic administrator said that was how he determined bonuses for the employees. I'm an independent consultant at the clinic and we don't get bonuses but the younger employees without children and the single employees were not happy.

Holy crap! Yeah, as a childless-by-choice person that wouldn't fly with me!

My field doesn't have any type of bias toward one or the other. I once had an interview when they asked me what my husband did for a living (they aren't allowed to ask that) but I wasn't really sure what to say so I just said he "works for the government" (he's in the military). If I would have said military they would have asked what he did, how long we'll be stationed here, etc. etc. - all things they aren't allowed to ask.

Yeah, I don't think it is a fair way to determine bonuses. It should be based on merit and of course so should hiring. One of my close girlfriends quit as soon as she found another job after the clinic administrator explained the bonus system (among other reasons because as you might imagine he's a joy to work with).

When I saw your first post, I thought whoa, way to disincentivize everyone and reduce productivity. Then saw your second post and though whaaaaat?! The administrator actually disclosed that bonus system?! Wow, wow, wow!

Yeah, I'm sorry. I'm a liberal but... this is a job not welfare. What does having kids have to do with a performance based evaluation of your merit as an employee. That wouldn't fly with me either.

Yeah, definitely not something I agree with either. The only reason I am still there is because I make a difference to my patients and that is the only reason. If that ever stops being the case I would leave. I cannot believe it is legal to discriminate for any reason but there you go.

 

[yssie]

It's sort of the opposite where I work. Bonuses are partly dependent on if you have children because then your need is more and you get a larger bonus. Absolutely true. The clinic administrator said that was how he determined bonuses for the employees. I'm an independent consultant at the clinic and we don't get bonuses but the younger employees without children and the single employees were not happy.

Holy crap! Yeah, as a childless-by-choice person that wouldn't fly with me!

My field doesn't have any type of bias toward one or the other. I once had an interview when they asked me what my husband did for a living (they aren't allowed to ask that) but I wasn't really sure what to say so I just said he "works for the government" (he's in the military). If I would have said military they would have asked what he did, how long we'll be stationed here, etc. etc. - all things they aren't allowed to ask.

Yeah, I don't think it is a fair way to determine bonuses. It should be based on merit and of course so should hiring. One of my close girlfriends quit as soon as she found another job after the clinic administrator explained the bonus system (among other reasons because as you might imagine he's a joy to work with).

When I saw your first post, I thought whoa, way to disincentivize everyone and reduce productivity. Then saw your second post and though whaaaaat?! The administrator actually disclosed that bonus system?! Wow, wow, wow!

Yeah, I'm sorry. I'm a liberal but... this is a job not welfare. What does having kids have to do with a performance based evaluation of your merit as an employee. That wouldn't fly with me either.

 

[Laila619]

I remove all rings for interviews. When I interviewed for my first position with the agency I'm working at, both interviews, the HR person asked what my relationship status was. Then, when I signed background check papers after I accepted an offer, I forgot to take my ring off, and she had a comment about it, and my inferred relationship status. I don't know if it would have changed things at all, but after that experience, I'll not be wearing rings to another interview.

That's illegal. And personally it would be a flag for me. Remember interviews are two ways. You are interviewing them as much as they are you. I would have eliminated them as a possible employer right there.

Yeah, I'm really surprised that an HR person would ask that. They know better.

 

[jaysonsmom]

I have never removed all of my rings, but I do remove my "e-ring" with the center diamond. I do not want the interviewer to have pre-concieved notions based on the diamond size....such as: a big rock MAY mean that her husband is a great provider, so 1) she does not really need to work, hence would not be a hard worker 2) Their finances are secure, don't need to offer top dollar 3) Materialistic or flashy and not a humble person.....

 

[manderz]

I remove all rings for interviews. When I interviewed for my first position with the agency I'm working at, both interviews, the HR person asked what my relationship status was. Then, when I signed background check papers after I accepted an offer, I forgot to take my ring off, and she had a comment about it, and my inferred relationship status. I don't know if it would have changed things at all, but after that experience, I'll not be wearing rings to another interview.

That's illegal. And personally it would be a flag for me. Remember interviews are two ways. You are interviewing them as much as they are you. I would have eliminated them as a possible employer right there.

Yeah, I'm really surprised that an HR person would ask that. They know better.

I know. I let it slide because I was desperate, and because she was not indicative of the culture of the whole agency. Jobs "in my field" are hard to come by, least of all well paying ones (my first position was not, but the one I'm in now is decent enough. It'll pay the bills). Touching my hair after she's been asked not to is also probably not smiled upon either.

 

[Gypsy]

I remove all rings for interviews. When I interviewed for my first position with the agency I'm working at, both interviews, the HR person asked what my relationship status was. Then, when I signed background check papers after I accepted an offer, I forgot to take my ring off, and she had a comment about it, and my inferred relationship status. I don't know if it would have changed things at all, but after that experience, I'll not be wearing rings to another interview.

That's illegal. And personally it would be a flag for me. Remember interviews are two ways. You are interviewing them as much as they are you. I would have eliminated them as a possible employer right there.

Yeah, I'm really surprised that an HR person would ask that. They know better.

Not all of them. I've had some DOOZY HR, recruiters and even managers that I've screened out for off color comments. And frankly, even if they do know better some of them just don't care.


She touched your hair? Ewwww. That would have skeeved me out (I have very firm physical boundaries at work).

 

[manderz]

Oh, it totally creeped me out, too. Though, it was more like playing with it, 3 different times.

It's really only her, the rest of the place isn't so bad. Sure, there are the usual office politics, but I've never worked somewhere that didn't have that.

 

[LLJsmom]

I've always been completely open about marital status, children, family, etc. in any interview. never thought about jewelry so whatever I'm wearing is it. Companies that I've interviewed with have flexible schedules and know they have to accommodate employee's schedules to retain them. I would think there is a bias towards married people with children. They know you need a job.

 

[jess719]

Well.

When I was engaged I was concerned about the fact that I would be getting married just a couple months after I was interviewing. But I knew I'd have to ask for the time off anyway, regardless, so I didn't hide anything.

Since then, I've had a very 'take it or leave it' attitude toward places I interview. I'm me. Hire me or not, but I'm not going to hide key parts of myself or my life for a job. Frankly though, my skills and background make me a pretty attractive candidate for most people hiring for what I do. So... they'd be stupid to care. And I can't say I'd work for someone that stupid anyway. And I am a strong believer in work life balance, married or not, so I state that quite plainly upfront in interviews anyway.

In my opinion, if I am a professional and manage my workload so that it doesn't impact anyone negatively, and I consistently meet or exceed goals then I am doing a good job. And that should be the main thing that matters, not anything else.

As for my current job, which I am very happy at. I can't say that I see any different treatment for single versus married. Or with kids or without. My boss is very much a person that looks at people as individuals. And the company has no issues with maternity leave. A TON of my co-workers have young kids or are pregnant. One my my peers has a bunch of kids, including a little one just over a year so she needs some flexibility there. And while I have no kids, I have health issues that require flexibility. And my boss treats us very similarly, as individuals with individual needs. There are single people on the team too, and they get flexibility for whatever it is that they need. One of the single ladies hates mornings, so she comes in at 10 and she rungs marathons and things so she needs time off for events. None of it is an issue as long as we are responsible and get our work done.

And I would say 90% of my teammates are married. And when I am interviewing people (which I do often) for positions in our team I couldn't care LESS if they were married or single.

Your workplace sounds amazing!!

I am very lucky. I had a LOT of crappy employers before this job. Just one after another bad, then better, then worse, worse still, worst ever, then this...

So I got a lot of experience in screening employers for issues. Plus I started temping at temp to perm positions which helped me figure out if a place was really good, or just knew the right things to say during interviews.

I do work for a national company that is often hiring though. So if you can figure out how to contact me offline I can let you know the company name

That would be amazing! Right now I'm staying at home with my kids, but I plan on going back! I had issues before I left though. It was not so much with marital bias, but more with the fact that I was young and look even younger. I was by far the youngest in the district in my position, so I had a huge problem with my administration (to the point of them telling me I needed to wear clothes that made me look older). I was in no way unprofessional, but they wanted me dressed differently than the other employees.

I have an e-mail that I use just for stuff like this. **edited by moderator, please do not post personal contact information of any kind on the forum per our policies**