Buying Opinions From A Jeweler

[wonka27]

I''m going to copy and paste the first part of Scott''s response here to start a new thread, as the
original has flung way out of control.

Scott''s (yowahking)said:

"OK Wonka and KKeen, here goes a teaser. Let''s just put away comments that ruffle some for now. First decide what it is that you want. Do you want quality, price, flash, original design, quick, rare,? (many others but you get it) Let''s say that you want price, that is what is #1 for men. My first advise is not to be too focused on price that you get played, like the NY find the pea game. No matter whether it is local or internet, the more you know the better. So let''s say that you want to spend $5000. If you want to be really cheap, you could get a diamond that is clarity enhanced, there are new players in that field and prices have come down. Not my thing, but one of my friends does the new treatment in Isreal and can''t sell them fast enough. Next option if you don''t like doctored up stones is how many combinations are in your price range. You can print off price lists like Rap that you can see 15 different combinations of grades and sizes that puts you around $5000. If you don''t know how to use Rap, 5 min you will get it. What most consumers fail to grasp is how to use price sheets and how to add or subtract for cutting quality of each size and grade. Maybe 15min and someone could explain that to you. Now you need to see a few. You are armed with some basic knowledge that a 1ct whatever costs the same as a 1,25 ct whatever. Now time to see how they look to you. There are no shortage of diamonds in this country. If the list price is $5000 and a store is telling you $4000, $25% under Rap is on the low side, that is either good, or maybe the stone is not graded right or cut poorly. Make notes on anything you can. Now if the store tells you $8000, also make notes but unless it gently massages your finger while wearing it, problably not worth the extra $3000. Now look on line, again no shortage of sites. If confused, try to find an independent appraiser to ask a question to, they may also have a suggestion as to where to buy. Listen to everyone, someone is right. There are some sights that sound similar that offer advise. Findmyjeweler.com is pretty good at selecting a jeweler in each city that combines price, quality, service etc. Findajeweler.net (or maybe org)any jeweler can call up an list himself, No checking done. If you think that you have found a good deal, give all the specs to someone else, see if they can match it. Ask if they own the stone, some jewelers just borrow from dealers, some internet sites just post lists from dealers. If they own the stone, it will most likely be there again the next day. If it is borrowed, or on a shared list, things get moved around a lot. Once you find the one, pay the appraiser that you have now used for advise and have it appraised. Do not accept an appraisal from the seller. Do not accept an appraisal from someone who has no degrees next to the signature. A good appraiser will have several. A G.G. only learns about gems, not how to value them. Every state has good appraisers.
If you like any of this, I will give you more. If not, we will move on."

 

[wonka27]

Ok, Scott. I like the way things are presented here, so let's keep talking. If there is more you wish to share on this idea, please continue

Let me direct you to the link with my .79 H SI1 so you can see where I am at as we talk.

I do have a couple of comments/questions though, which hopefully you can address:

1. I pretty much have done what you said. I surfed the net...particularly pricescope vendors (GOG, Whiteflash, Dirt Cheap Diamonds, Nice Ice, etc.) and have gone out to jewelers in the area. My major concern has been a lack of quality goods at area jewelers compared to these fine vendors. A majority of the pricescope community is obsessed with finding the most spectacular diamonds we can. Therefore, our goal seems to be finding "ideal" cuts. Color, clarity, carat weight all vary here from person to person, but I think it is safe to say that cut is the "C" we in large part agree on. I have found it very difficult to find "ideal" cuts at local jewelers, and those I have were at least $500-$1000 more than what I purchased (without certification). I know I paid a small premium for what I purchased, because GOG does take the time to give you a ton of information about the diamonds they list on their site. As a consumer, that assured me I was in fact getting a fantastic diamond without seeing it. And frankly, while many say you need to see the diamond...I think this information would have still been helpful had I the chance to see it before purchasing. I'm not a diamond expert, so my eyes don't necessarily know what to look for in a good diamond.

2. You mention using and learning about RAP. That would be wonderful and probably helpful if properly used. However, this seems to be a document not readily available to consumers. Can you offer a place to find such resources?

3. I think your comments about the purchasing process are very good. You seem to want the consumer well-informed/educated. That is a key in this process. While out at a jeweler about two months ago, I was in a store and a gentleman came in with his friend. He looked at settings and diamonds like I was. Funny thing was, he bought the whole set in approximately 15 minutes. He was out of that store before I was, and spent several thousand while there. That was dumb. I would not be the least bit suprised if that was his first and only trip to a jeweler for that project, and clearly did no research. Without question, he paid way to much for his purchase. So what do you think about the education the pricescope tutorial offers?

This is getting long, so I will stop here. Hopefully I will have the opportunity to say and ask more after your reply.

 

[yowahking]

Thank you for the private message, and the opportunity to discuss this further. It looks like you have proved to many who won't buy an SI1 that they can be very nice. While I applaud the internet for being ahead of most jewelers with the new toys on the market, I am dissapointed that you could not find a jeweler to show you a similar stone. Proves that jewelers need to have better inventories on nice stones and tell the public about themselves if they truly compete with price. I am one who is critical of GIA's lack of cutting information on diamonds where Ideal is often given to a stone only because EX EX on the cert and table and depth are good. This stone looks like it is truly Ideal or very near based on all you have given. The range from just my small sample of 5 jewelers that I sampled for you, was from $2700 to $3999 given your specs. So you are paying the right price range. Like I have said many times, you MAY be able to do better if the store or internet site actually owns the stone. The may be more greedy even if they own it, but at least they have the option. If either the store or internet site is just taking a cut on the deal, then they are limited to what the "memo" cost of it is. Not knowing much about who you got it from, it seems like you did well.
Access to Rap..........I let customers see it. Some of my friends don't like that. Most dealers refer to being % under or over Rap, and much of that information is available on line. PRoblem with Rap is not the sheet itself, it is learning what it does and what it does not say. It is often misused. For instance, pear shape list price is lower than rounds, yet some dealers say it is % under rap and when I check, they are quoting off round list which is not really the same %, therfore not such a good deal afterall.
Keep this going.
Scott

 

[wonka27]

Cool deal, Scott.

Thanks for your replies to my PMs and thanks for responding to this thread. I look forward to gaining more knowledge through your posts, as I'm sure I will be a life long jewelery purchaser