What Orange Is Good Orange - On Spessartite
- Thread starter BWise
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The real color (= from your pictures) is great !
The seller's picture is simpy not realistic. I have no idea what might look like that in person - perhaps orange vaseline glass
- not garnet. Some Mexican opal might come close to that glaring color, but it should be a large stone and exceptionally bright to boot. Just in case your quest for something veryorange has not neded yet
The seller's picture is simpy not realistic. I have no idea what might look like that in person - perhaps orange vaseline glass
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Yingh,
Not sure what Ana means about pictures, however, the stones pictured are, if anything, more saturated and completely flawless with excellent crystal.
The stones are Nigerian and sold sometime ago. Occasionally I get a few Mandarin''s (Namibian Spessartite) that are actually even more vivid in hue but, clean ones are rarely larger than half a carat.
Spessartite is number four in brilliance, exceeded only by diamond, zircon and andradite. The one in your photo looks a lot like a Namibian stone. Do I see some visible inclusions, usually in the form of whispy veils in spessartite from that locality.
Not sure what Ana means about pictures, however, the stones pictured are, if anything, more saturated and completely flawless with excellent crystal.
The stones are Nigerian and sold sometime ago. Occasionally I get a few Mandarin''s (Namibian Spessartite) that are actually even more vivid in hue but, clean ones are rarely larger than half a carat.
Spessartite is number four in brilliance, exceeded only by diamond, zircon and andradite. The one in your photo looks a lot like a Namibian stone. Do I see some visible inclusions, usually in the form of whispy veils in spessartite from that locality.
movie zombie
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yingh, your later photos show some really good color! much better to my eyes than the first ones.
if you have any tips re photos, please private e-mail me. i''ve been trying to get pictures of my spess to post and even the best of them do not show how really really orange it is....i keep getting brown [which it does not have] and yellow flashes [which it also does not have]. and at times the pictures show as a dark amber which this spess definitely is not. is it possible that orange tones are harder to capture in a photo than reds, blues, etc.?
peace, movie zombie
if you have any tips re photos, please private e-mail me. i''ve been trying to get pictures of my spess to post and even the best of them do not show how really really orange it is....i keep getting brown [which it does not have] and yellow flashes [which it also does not have]. and at times the pictures show as a dark amber which this spess definitely is not. is it possible that orange tones are harder to capture in a photo than reds, blues, etc.?
peace, movie zombie
BWise
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Richard, by pictures Ana was referring to the seller picture of my spess in question (see my first post in this topic), not yours. I am sure that everyone feels the same as I do - your spess are spectacular - and you got a pair! I really love the pure looking and the warmth in the color.
After seeing so many diffrent shades of orange (SPECIAL THANKS TO MINE!)
movie zombie, I am sending you a PM next - though I don''t think I did that well with pictures but love to share my tips anyway.
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Yingh,
Thanks for the clarification. Here is my best photo of a spessartite taken by Jeff Scovil. However as Movie Zombie points out, there still, even in Jeff's photos brown hue that does not exist in the stone. Problem is; dark orange is brown or brown is dark orange. When you get a little off-axis refraction in the photo you get brown. The stone is drop dead orange with no modifying yellow but, the picture, alas, lies!
Thanks for the clarification. Here is my best photo of a spessartite taken by Jeff Scovil. However as Movie Zombie points out, there still, even in Jeff's photos brown hue that does not exist in the stone. Problem is; dark orange is brown or brown is dark orange. When you get a little off-axis refraction in the photo you get brown. The stone is drop dead orange with no modifying yellow but, the picture, alas, lies!
BWise
Brilliant_Rock
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Richard, that stone is drop dead gorgeous!
Love it! I want one too (as if I can afford one)!
Mmm, maybe a tiny little one.
I was back here to say that I love my new spess more and more and here is a shot in the bright sunlight. Then I saw your picture. Sigh..... Isn''t greed in human nature?
Love it! I want one too (as if I can afford one)!
Mmm, maybe a tiny little one.
I was back here to say that I love my new spess more and more and here is a shot in the bright sunlight. Then I saw your picture. Sigh..... Isn''t greed in human nature?
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All,
This is a 5.51 ct. flawless Nigerian spessartite I just photographed, along with several others. This stone is exceptionally transparent, allowing its brilliance to dazzle, and the color is outstanding. Spessartite presents great difficulty in imaging due to its exceptional brilliance which seems to confuse and overwhelm the exposure meter. Each stone photographs differently and you have to use every trick you can dream up to obtain usable images.
All this spessartite discussion reminds me of a pleasant couple of hours I spent in Tucson this year, learning from the man who first opened the Namibian deposits back in 1991. He''s a geologist as well as gem expert, and since my early training was in geology before I became interested in gems we got on very well.
The Namibian gems were first called Kunene River Spessartite, then Hollandine. When it was learned that Hollandine was already the name of an obscure metal, an Israeli marketer chose the name Mandarin. It stuck and is increasingly appled to spessartite garnet from all sources -- as well as some other orange garnets of lesser quality like hessonite, unfortuntely.
Chances of future spessartite production from Namibia seem pretty good, he said. There are incredible problems ranging from climate extremes, the remoteness of the mines where it takes several days to obtain replacement machine parts even by air; and the antics of the local Ovahimba Tribe, the source of frequent incidents. The tribe ignores the existence of the Namibian government and makes regular demands for beer and other concessions so their gods will allow the miners to continue their government-licensed work.
While Namibian spessartites are nearly pure manganese orange with almost no iron to add red hues, sometimes there can be too much of a good thing. Often manganese forms black inclusions along with the usual actinolite and tremolite, so the challenge now is to mine at greater depth where less manganese is concentrated. Unfortuntely, most of the larger garnets are found on or near the surface so that explains why the cleanest Namibian stones tend to be small.
My interest in spessartites was awakened about 12 years ago when I spied a California Hercules Mine stone winking at me from 30 feet away at a gem show. I walked over to it and experienced unbridled love at first sight. I''ve been buying and studying them ever since. The love affair continues.
Richard M.
This is a 5.51 ct. flawless Nigerian spessartite I just photographed, along with several others. This stone is exceptionally transparent, allowing its brilliance to dazzle, and the color is outstanding. Spessartite presents great difficulty in imaging due to its exceptional brilliance which seems to confuse and overwhelm the exposure meter. Each stone photographs differently and you have to use every trick you can dream up to obtain usable images.
All this spessartite discussion reminds me of a pleasant couple of hours I spent in Tucson this year, learning from the man who first opened the Namibian deposits back in 1991. He''s a geologist as well as gem expert, and since my early training was in geology before I became interested in gems we got on very well.
The Namibian gems were first called Kunene River Spessartite, then Hollandine. When it was learned that Hollandine was already the name of an obscure metal, an Israeli marketer chose the name Mandarin. It stuck and is increasingly appled to spessartite garnet from all sources -- as well as some other orange garnets of lesser quality like hessonite, unfortuntely.
Chances of future spessartite production from Namibia seem pretty good, he said. There are incredible problems ranging from climate extremes, the remoteness of the mines where it takes several days to obtain replacement machine parts even by air; and the antics of the local Ovahimba Tribe, the source of frequent incidents. The tribe ignores the existence of the Namibian government and makes regular demands for beer and other concessions so their gods will allow the miners to continue their government-licensed work.
While Namibian spessartites are nearly pure manganese orange with almost no iron to add red hues, sometimes there can be too much of a good thing. Often manganese forms black inclusions along with the usual actinolite and tremolite, so the challenge now is to mine at greater depth where less manganese is concentrated. Unfortuntely, most of the larger garnets are found on or near the surface so that explains why the cleanest Namibian stones tend to be small.
My interest in spessartites was awakened about 12 years ago when I spied a California Hercules Mine stone winking at me from 30 feet away at a gem show. I walked over to it and experienced unbridled love at first sight. I''ve been buying and studying them ever since. The love affair continues.
Richard M.
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Here''s a 5.75 ct. loupe clean stone with a stronger reddish hue. The orange flashes from deep inside give it a smoldering excitement, like an expiring campfire after dark.
Richard M.
Richard M.
MINE!!
Ideal_Rock
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OH WOW... Richard M.. That are BEAUTIFUL!!! The campfire color really appeals to me... And I can see why these stones caught your eye.. thanks for the information as well.
Richard Wise.. your spess is fantastic. Thank you for the info on the brillance of a spess..
Yingh. It does look awesome. I think that I like my spess the most when it is in the sunlight. I would say that yours just begs to be looked at. I am so glad that you are falling for this stone and I agree with ANA that the color that you have is much better than the seller''s orginal picture.
As for concave.. that is a beautiful gem, I would see no reason to concave, but that of course is persson preferance. I do not think that it would hurt to do so.... you will just have to decided between which kind of beautiful you like for the stone.
Are you gong to use this for a pendant?
Richard Wise.. your spess is fantastic. Thank you for the info on the brillance of a spess..
Yingh. It does look awesome. I think that I like my spess the most when it is in the sunlight. I would say that yours just begs to be looked at. I am so glad that you are falling for this stone and I agree with ANA that the color that you have is much better than the seller''s orginal picture.
As for concave.. that is a beautiful gem, I would see no reason to concave, but that of course is persson preferance. I do not think that it would hurt to do so.... you will just have to decided between which kind of beautiful you like for the stone.
Are you gong to use this for a pendant?
movie zombie
Super_Ideal_Rock
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no, Mine, its now my spess!
the picture richard wise posted is of a spess he sold to someone else about 4 years ago but he used the same picture for the spess i bought when he had the 8.18 for sale at his website. having tried to photograph the stone, i really understand why he didn''t try to reinvent the wheel!
i''ve got a couple of good pictures but i can''t get rid of the yellow and brown. i''ll keep trying but i doubt i''ll do any better than the professional.......
to quote richard w: "The stone is drop dead orange with no modifying yellow but, the picture, alas, lies!"
peace, movie zombie
MINE!!
Ideal_Rock
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MZ.. I am confused... The picture he posted is your spess.. or the one that he posted to sell your spess... You lucky gal..
I can imagine how difficult it is to truely get a good color picture ... My pictures tunned out more red thank it really is. I cannot WAIT TO YOU YOURS!!!
I can imagine how difficult it is to truely get a good color picture ... My pictures tunned out more red thank it really is. I cannot WAIT TO YOU YOURS!!!
BWise
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MINE, as far as color goes, I found myself more attracted to the yellowy orange tone, as the one movie zambie bought from Richard Wise. (a drop dead beauty!!!!) And that was why I fell for the seller''s picture of this spess.
After seeing your spess and the other wonderous Richard Homer gems, I have this desire to own at least one concave gem. I know the ideal candidate is a large, lighter shade stone. Sounds like a good fit.
The other main reason I want to concave it is because of its inclusion. This is not a ''water'' stone as I always preferred, but it is a mandarian Nambian spess at 7.07ct, what can I expect? The current cut is not bad at all (here is a pavilion shot) But it still has a little extinction effect and I certainly want to hide the inclusions better. If at all possible (weight loss wise), I want to turn this into a cushion cut
Does it sounds like a worthy concave project? Or it will be better off to be a traditional cushion? I will send it to Richard H shortly. Let''s hear what he is about to say.
movie zombie
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the one he posted to sell the spess which is now mine. same shape although mine is an 8.18 and that was a 7 something. color for both orange orange orange. no yellow, no brown, no red. but impossible to photograph without getting those colors! so he decided to not reinvent the wheel and went with the existing professional photo for the prior stone as the difference between the two was minimal. i totally understand why.Date: 6/21/2005 11:11:15 PM
Author: MINE!!
MZ.. I am confused... The picture he posted is your spess.. or the one that he posted to sell your spess... You lucky gal..
I can imagine how difficult it is to truely get a good color picture ... My pictures tunned out more red thank it really is. I cannot WAIT TO YOU YOURS!!!
peace, movie zombie
movie zombie
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yingh, i, too, want to try out a concave spess. Mine''s looks simply divine. i''d even try out a ''red'' spess perhaps to get that look richard m described in his 2nd picture he posted.
peace, movie zombie
ps i''ve posted pictures in another thread....finally! they just don''t look orange, though. but i''m not going to give up trying to ''capture'' it!
peace, movie zombie
ps i''ve posted pictures in another thread....finally! they just don''t look orange, though. but i''m not going to give up trying to ''capture'' it!
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All,
Images are difficult but I do like the ones Richrd M. has posted. They provide a very good illustration of bunt orange and reddish orange hues. So, if you take mine and his two you have a pretty good range of hues. I think the reddish stones are under appreciated.
Besides Nigeria and Namibia you can find the occasional reddish stone in Brazil but, the stone is rare in that country and they tend to ask a high price. I am usually able to purchase a few 4mm round Namibian stones from a friend who lives in Windhoek. I make them into ear studs and you can see them across the room.
Movie Zombie, I think a professional photo of your stone is in order. It is, just about the finest spessartite I have ever seen. So, I''ll be glad to do that if you like.
Images are difficult but I do like the ones Richrd M. has posted. They provide a very good illustration of bunt orange and reddish orange hues. So, if you take mine and his two you have a pretty good range of hues. I think the reddish stones are under appreciated.
Besides Nigeria and Namibia you can find the occasional reddish stone in Brazil but, the stone is rare in that country and they tend to ask a high price. I am usually able to purchase a few 4mm round Namibian stones from a friend who lives in Windhoek. I make them into ear studs and you can see them across the room.
Movie Zombie, I think a professional photo of your stone is in order. It is, just about the finest spessartite I have ever seen. So, I''ll be glad to do that if you like.
MINE!!
Ideal_Rock
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I can see what you meana bout why you want the concave cut. It could help civer some of those inclusions... but either way you have a real beauty there.. I think it is scrumptous. I am sure Richard will be able to tell you if it is worth concave cutting. I know that many have said that he is very upfront and honest about whether it is worth it to concave cut or not.
Either way, I am aure that it is going to be absolutely astounding and cannot wait to see the finished product!!
Either way, I am aure that it is going to be absolutely astounding and cannot wait to see the finished product!!
BWise
Brilliant_Rock
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Just dropped it via UPS to Richard Homer. Cannot wait to hear from the master cutter!
MINE, every good words about Richard H is true. He is a very nice guy and communicate in all details one wants to know. He is indeed very upfront and honest. If you remember my sapphire, he told me concave will bring some improvements, but not to expect too dramatic. And when I called him this morning to ask if I should recut it in the traditional way, he told me don''t bother because the enhancement is so minute that it won''t offset the weight loss and labor cost. See, he is that good!
movie zombie, where is your topic with the pictures, send me a link please!
MINE, every good words about Richard H is true. He is a very nice guy and communicate in all details one wants to know. He is indeed very upfront and honest. If you remember my sapphire, he told me concave will bring some improvements, but not to expect too dramatic. And when I called him this morning to ask if I should recut it in the traditional way, he told me don''t bother because the enhancement is so minute that it won''t offset the weight loss and labor cost. See, he is that good!
movie zombie, where is your topic with the pictures, send me a link please!
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That stone is awesome!
I love it.
[/quote]
Thank you! I try not to become emotionally attached to my stones because I know they''ll be gone one day but that one''s my personal fave.
I agree with Richard Wise that the reddish spessartites are greatly under-apprecated in today''s market as I''ve mentioned on P-S several times previously. That''s mainly because sellers haven''t educated customers about their special beauty. In the days before the abundance of purer orange stones from Namibia and Nigeria, the "aurora red" colors, mostly from Brazil, were the market standard and brought very high prices. Another occasional source for fine orange and reddish spessartites, usually marketed under the trade name "Kashmirine," is Pakistan, Trade names tend to annoy me because they often just confuse consumers.
Here''s a 10.12 carat example of fine red-orange from Nigeria. It doesn''t have quite the life of the 5.75 ct. posted previously due to its stronger red tonal overcast but it doesn''t just "sit there" either. I think it would be awesome in a pendant with a halo of diamonds, or...? Any suggestions?
Richard M.
movie zombie
Super_Ideal_Rock
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ok, folks, i gotta tell you that i absolutely love my orange orange spess.....but i now would like to get my hands on a red! i love richard m''s reds.
actually, when i started shopping for spess, i wasn''t locked into pure any color. i just wanted something that wasn''t too light or too dark. but it was love at first sight with the orange spess.
now i''d like to have the same experience with a red spess! good spess has so much life and i like the idea of having another spess.
i''m also toying with the idea of orange spess for earrings. but i don''t think i will spend the $$$ to get the same quality as the orange for that project as i have long hair.
a nice big red spess with lots of sparkle.....no dark mask, just nice firey red/orange or orange/red....yes, please, i''ll have one of those!
peace, movie zombie
actually, when i started shopping for spess, i wasn''t locked into pure any color. i just wanted something that wasn''t too light or too dark. but it was love at first sight with the orange spess.
now i''d like to have the same experience with a red spess! good spess has so much life and i like the idea of having another spess.
i''m also toying with the idea of orange spess for earrings. but i don''t think i will spend the $$$ to get the same quality as the orange for that project as i have long hair.
a nice big red spess with lots of sparkle.....no dark mask, just nice firey red/orange or orange/red....yes, please, i''ll have one of those!
peace, movie zombie
movie zombie
Super_Ideal_Rock
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richarad m,
ok, so i''m over the top re spess, but what about a spess halo in a lighter more orange or yellow color...?
peace, movie zombie
ok, so i''m over the top re spess, but what about a spess halo in a lighter more orange or yellow color...?
peace, movie zombie
BWise
Brilliant_Rock
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So now we are moving on to red spess - what fun topics!
My red spess has been my most favorite from my little collection. It glows from across the room when the light hit it. And the depth of it makes you think its alive. My hubby called it a little evil looking because it reminds him that big eye sits on top of the tower in 'lord of the ring'
Had to admit that when I purchase a gem stone, it was purely because of the stone. I don't envision a setting then set off to buy a stone, maybe that is just me. In fact, I don't have any plans for all my gems except one tourmaline and one pair of citrine. (I will be collecting your advise on them soon.) It is hard to come up with plans with large sizes, so I guess I will just play with them loose.
I have this very nice display case. Like this but larger. On many nights after the kids are asleep and I am done with all my household chores, I take the case out and sit under my recessed kitchen light and play them on my daughter's white burping cloth (because it is very soft). I enjoy those memonts very much.
And it is really cool to take all gems, different color, type, and cuts, out on the cloth and put them next to each other!
My red spess has been my most favorite from my little collection. It glows from across the room when the light hit it. And the depth of it makes you think its alive. My hubby called it a little evil looking because it reminds him that big eye sits on top of the tower in 'lord of the ring'
Had to admit that when I purchase a gem stone, it was purely because of the stone. I don't envision a setting then set off to buy a stone, maybe that is just me. In fact, I don't have any plans for all my gems except one tourmaline and one pair of citrine. (I will be collecting your advise on them soon.) It is hard to come up with plans with large sizes, so I guess I will just play with them loose.
I have this very nice display case. Like this but larger. On many nights after the kids are asleep and I am done with all my household chores, I take the case out and sit under my recessed kitchen light and play them on my daughter's white burping cloth (because it is very soft). I enjoy those memonts very much.
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