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What is it with people buying rough these days?

Pandora II

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Given that it is hard enough buying a faceted stone and judging the myriad of factors that are involved in that, I am genuinely suprised at the number of queries in the last month or so.

Is is:

a) they see the difference in the price of some rough and the price of a finished stone and think it's a way to save $$$
b) they want to have a go at faceting themselves (this I can understand more)
c) they think it's a fun way to buy a stone

or something else?

Or am I just someone who is overcautious? I find the idea of dropping $$ on rough frightening even with the gemmological knowledge I have - because I am not a faceter and I don't have the knowledge to know what questions to ask yet.

Has anyone (not in the trade) actually bought their own rough and come out with a cut stone that hasn't ultimately cost more than it's worth?
 

anythingorange

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I get the sense that some people may view it as a way to make money. They buy the rough cheap, have it cut, and sell the stones at a healthy price. With the economy being what it is, people are trying different things to generate additional income. I'm sure there are all other sorts of reasons too, like the ones you mentioned.

Now me, I wouldn't buy rough for anything...I simply don't have the knowledge.
 

bobsiv

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I hope they're not trying to make money, it's almost impossible. You can't compete with the people who buy in bulk and actually know what they're doing, and you can't compete with overseas cutting rates. I cut my own stones so I pay no cutting fees and I still lose money overall, not even counting the time I put in. A good way to look at it is that there are no rough dealers who don't know someone who could cut the stones for them extremely cheaply. If the cut stone was worth more than they're charging for the rough, they would have it cut and sell it themselves. Also they likely know avenues to sell the finished stones for reasonable prices, if you have to go to Ebay as an unknown seller you will only get a fraction of what the finished stone is worth. Gems are a commodity and people aren't stupid.

On the other hand, rough stones are great collector's items for gem lovers and a lot of places have faceter's clubs that will teach you how to cut on their equipment.
 

NKOTB

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I bought a piece recently, because I really loved the colour. It was a piece of Winza sapphire - hot pink. It was inexpensive, and I thought if I could find someone to cut it, great, if not, well, I would have myself a piece of rough. I asked a few people, most said no. One cutter was willing, but was hugely backed up. Another said he would do it. He ended up hugely frustrated and spent quite a bit of time for a very small stone. I thought it turned out lovely, and had only hoped for a tiny stone, but felt really bad. I don't plan to do this again. I'm glad I tried it once, and came out of it with a good lesson. I would never have done it with an expensive piece of rough. I guess, at the beginning, I did it because I couldn't find a lot of finished stones in that material, I thought it *might* be a way to save money, and I thought it might be a fun way to be a part of the process from an earlier stage.
 

anythingorange

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bobsiv|1333054161|3159372 said:
I hope they're not trying to make money, it's almost impossible. You can't compete with the people who buy in bulk and actually know what they're doing, and you can't compete with overseas cutting rates. I cut my own stones so I pay no cutting fees and I still lose money overall, not even counting the time I put in. A good way to look at it is that there are no rough dealers who don't know someone who could cut the stones for them extremely cheaply. If the cut stone was worth more than they're charging for the rough, they would have it cut and sell it themselves. Also they likely know avenues to sell the finished stones for reasonable prices, if you have to go to Ebay as an unknown seller you will only get a fraction of what the finished stone is worth. Gems are a commodity and people aren't stupid.

On the other hand, rough stones are great collector's items for gem lovers and a lot of places have faceter's clubs that will teach you how to cut on their equipment.

From what I've read, I know that it's foolish to believe that it is a way to make money, especially if someone doesn't know what they're doing. It seems as though many of the people who have been posting questions about rough in recent months are new to Pricescope and, well, new to gemstones in general. I don't think they have any idea what they're getting themselves into. (Of course, this doesn't apply to everyone.)
 

mastercutgems

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or D; maybe they are just crazy like the rest of us cutters :roll: and thought they could make money and/or it would be fun watching the wheel go round and round :loopy: kind of like watching paint dry :o

It is so funny some of the rough looks much better in the rough state than after it is cut ... Too much to learn and absorb now; even after 20+ years of buying, cutting, testing, it is still something that is a total gamble much of the time...

All I can say; is be careful and do not spend you last dollar on facet and/or cabochon rough.... It is a hard business to make a living at; even if you did buy 18 years ago when it was cheaper and less treatments... But if you have excess cash and it is burning a hole in your pocket; just do your homework and be careful...

Most respectfully;

Dana
 

Pandora II

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I have come across quite a few people recently who have decided to take up gem dealing with zero knowledge at all (less than someone who has spent a few hours on this forum would have) - I know because they are asking me to ID their stones for them for free - and to value them (which I am not qualified to do).

I have ID'd a few stones for someone who was a friend - but after the 10th stone I did explain that if she took the stones to someone in the trade she would be paying £25+ per stone for the work I was doing as a freebie. Every single stone she showed me was either synthetic or a simulant... a 15ct neon pink topaz was a great example. :rolleyes:

She gave me the names of some of the places she planned to try and sell them - dealers that I know in London and I warned her that she would be laughed out of the door.

Others have been people bringing 'rubies' back from Afghanistan.

It's got to the point that I wince when anyone tells me that they've got a stone they'd like me to look at. Not only have they been ripped off, but the values they are assigning to what they have are above retail!

I am just waiting to be presented with a bag of dodgy rough...

The thing that makes me most sad is that all these people are not in a position to be spending the money on these stones that they are.
 

Pandora II

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Since some of the cutters are responding here, I do have a question...

I'm interested in learning to facet - partly because I would enjoy watching the wheel go round and I have infinite patience, but also because I do have some stones that could do with a teeny bit of a repolish - not enough that I would bother taking them to someone else, but something that I would do if I could do it myself.

Is repolishing very risky in terms of a lot of stones turning to dust on the lap - or only certain species... I would mainly be interested in repolishing garnets, perhaps the odd bit of corundum? Is it relatively easy to learn to do this part?

Also, how noisy is faceting and how much space would one need (husband not keen).
 

anythingorange

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Pandora|1333055779|3159391 said:
I have come across quite a few people recently who have decided to take up gem dealing with zero knowledge at all (less than someone who has spent a few hours on this forum would have) - I know because they are asking me to ID their stones for them for free - and to value them (which I am not qualified to do).

I have ID'd a few stones for someone who was a friend - but after the 10th stone I did explain that if she took the stones to someone in the trade she would be paying £25+ per stone for the work I was doing as a freebie. Every single stone she showed me was either synthetic or a simulant... a 15ct neon pink topaz was a great example. :rolleyes:

She gave me the names of some of the places she planned to try and sell them - dealers that I know in London and I warned her that she would be laughed out of the door.

Others have been people bringing 'rubies' back from Afghanistan.

It's got to the point that I wince when anyone tells me that they've got a stone they'd like me to look at. Not only have they been ripped off, but the values they are assigning to what they have are above retail!

I am just waiting to be presented with a bag of dodgy rough...

The thing that makes me most sad is that all these people are not in a position to be spending the money on these stones that they are.

This sounds familiar. When I was in high school, I had a friend whose father decided that he was going to get into the gemstone business to try to earn a few extra dollars. He was buying both rough and cut stones. I'll spare you the unpleasant details, but it basically ended in disaster. He lost *a lot* of money, and not to mention, his ego was a bit bruised. Sad, because he was a good man just trying anything to take care of his family.
 

PrecisionGem

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Pandora|1333056060|3159397 said:
Since some of the cutters are responding here, I do have a question...

I'm interested in learning to facet - partly because I would enjoy watching the wheel go round and I have infinite patience, but also because I do have some stones that could do with a teeny bit of a repolish - not enough that I would bother taking them to someone else, but something that I would do if I could do it myself.

Is repolishing very risky in terms of a lot of stones turning to dust on the lap - or only certain species... I would mainly be interested in repolishing garnets, perhaps the odd bit of corundum? Is it relatively easy to learn to do this part?

Also, how noisy is faceting and how much space would one need (husband not keen).

Pandora, when you say "pre polish" what exactly do you mean? Are you talking about fixing up some scratched already faceted stones?
If so, repairing existing cuts is much harder than cutting a stone from scratch in my opinion. You spend a lot of time hunting around for the correct angle of each facet, and the orientations. I used to do this kind of work for my jeweler customers, and hated it. Drove me nuts.

You don't need a lot of room, a normal sized office desk would be fine. Cutting does make noise and will drive others in the house crazy too.

About buying rough.... there is no such thing is buying good rough cheap. You can buy cheap rough cheap, and end up with cheap stone. Good rough is expensive and takes contacts and work to obtain. The stones you see being sold as facet rough on eBay are not good rough, and will not cut good stones. Like anything else in life, you get what you pay for, and everyone in the rough business knows the value of their material and will never sell quality stones cheap. Don't think as a total amateur you will somehow go out and cherry pick a $1000 for $20, it's not going to happen EVER.
 

Quantz Studios

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I'm small time and even I have noticed more and more people contacting me to cut stones for them! Not gem people, but normal people who don't know anything about stones. I have to turn most of them away because... I dont have the time, or I just refuse to cut poor rough- especially for people who dont have the understanding of risks and such involved in cutting stones and dont know how to purchase good rough- There are just too many risks involved for me. I never hear from some a second time after I give them a price quote. Many people have no idea that having a stone cut here in the US to precise standards isn't going to cost them $3.

I've also noticed that prices for nice cabochon rough and slabs have been going through the roof. Things I could have bought for $20 six months ago are now going near 50-60$. I've talked with some of my friends in the trade and none of us can seem to pinpoint the exact reason. I just hope people aren't hoarding as a form of investment. More likely, people are thinking along the lines of cutting their own stones and/or thinking of getting into it to make money. I wonder if, in the next year, we will see the market for used lapidary equipment see a flood of things for sale from people who found it difficult or found it's not the kind of hobby/career for them.
 

Pandora II

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By repolish I mean taking a stone that maybe has a teeny scratch on a facet or micro-chip on a facet edge and just repairing it. Not taking a stone with a less than great cut and trying to recut it. Does that make sense?

Okay, I will need to wait for a house with a garden shed before I try faceting! And all the bargain lapidary equipment that stonebender is predicting!

Stonebender - I wonder if people are seeing the HUGE quantities of 99p gemstones on eBay and then the cost of a gemstone in the B&M store down the road and reckoning that there is money to be made, without considering that a lapidary in the US is going to charge a great deal more to cut one stone than someone working in a cutting factory in Thailand makes in a week.

Personally it kind of appalls me that any decent sized cut gemstone can be sold for 99p - some poor sod had to dig it up, cut it, probably treat it - possibly multiple times, take photos of it and upload it to a website... surely that has to be worth more.
 

PrecisionGem

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Pandora|1333065687|3159512 said:
By repolish I mean taking a stone that maybe has a teeny scratch on a facet or micro-chip on a facet edge and just repairing it. Not taking a stone with a less than great cut and trying to recut it. Does that make sense?

Okay, I will need to wait for a house with a garden shed before I try faceting! And all the bargain lapidary equipment that stonebender is predicting!

Stonebender - I wonder if people are seeing the HUGE quantities of 99p gemstones on eBay and then the cost of a gemstone in the B&M store down the road and reckoning that there is money to be made, without considering that a lapidary in the US is going to charge a great deal more to cut one stone than someone working in a cutting factory in Thailand makes in a week.

Personally it kind of appalls me that any decent sized cut gemstone can be sold for 99p - some poor sod had to dig it up, cut it, probably treat it - possibly multiple times, take photos of it and upload it to a website... surely that has to be worth more.

The repair work you are talking about is not for beginners. It's harder than cutting a complete stone, and can end up taking more time as you don't know what the facet index is or the angle. Also, when you dop up a cut stone, you will never get it perfectly lined up in the dop, so even once you find the angle of one facet, when you index to another facet on the same tier, it most likely won't line up and you will need to make adjustments. Touching up a few facets on a crown can end up taking a long time.
 

PrecisionGem

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Pandora|1333065687|3159512 said:
By repolish I mean taking a stone that maybe has a teeny scratch on a facet or micro-chip on a facet edge and just repairing it. Not taking a stone with a less than great cut and trying to recut it. Does that make sense?

Okay, I will need to wait for a house with a garden shed before I try faceting! And all the bargain lapidary equipment that stonebender is predicting!

Stonebender - I wonder if people are seeing the HUGE quantities of 99p gemstones on eBay and then the cost of a gemstone in the B&M store down the road and reckoning that there is money to be made, without considering that a lapidary in the US is going to charge a great deal more to cut one stone than someone working in a cutting factory in Thailand makes in a week.

Personally it kind of appalls me that any decent sized cut gemstone can be sold for 99p - some poor sod had to dig it up, cut it, probably treat it - possibly multiple times, take photos of it and upload it to a website... surely that has to be worth more.

The repair work you are talking about is not for beginners. It's harder than cutting a complete stone, and can end up taking more time as you don't know what the facet index is or the angle. Also, when you dop up a cut stone, you will never get it perfectly lined up in the dop, so even once you find the angle of one facet, when you index to another facet on the same tier, it most likely won't line up and you will need to make adjustments. Touching up a few facets on a crown can end up taking a long time.
 

minousbijoux

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Stonebender|1333063106|3159477 said:
Not gem people, but normal people who don't know anything about stones. I have to turn most of them away because... I dont have the time, or I just refuse to cut poor rough- especially for people who dont have the understanding of risks and such involved in cutting stones and dont know how to purchase good rough- There are just too many risks involved for me. I never hear from some a second time after I give them a price quote. Many people have no idea that having a stone cut here in the US to precise standards isn't going to cost them $3.

This makes me laugh - you mean you charge more than $3 to cut a stone?!! :lol:
 

iLander

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I have been wanting to buy a piece of rough for years. I like the transformative aspect of it. I'd like to hold on the rough for a while, get to know it, live with it, enjoy it, imagine the gem within. Then send it off and have it cut--- transformed!

Every time I come across a likely piece of rough, I send Jerry at Gemart the pics, and we discuss it. Pros, cons, etc. Usually it comes down to me being an idiot and not knowing anything about rough! :bigsmile: So we decide to pass on that piece, and I start the search again.

I know eventually I'll find something that he thinks will work, and then I'll finally get to see "my stone" be transformed. That will be really wonderful.

But part of me knows I will regret it. The stone, made wholly by nature, will be gone. In it's place will be something completely different, but vaguely the same.

The ultimate would be to have both the rough and the gem at the same time. I'd like to hold up an unlikely looking rock and say "See this funky rock?" then hold up a gem and say, "Look what came out of it!" . But that's impossible. 8)

ETA: You know what it is? It's like magic. People just want to be part of that magic. At least that's what I want to do . . .

The cutters might complain sometimes, but I think that's part of what motivates them.
 

minousbijoux

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Pandora: Thank You! Lately Its been like a full moon for wannabe gem tycoons. I totally agree that they are all over the place, on every forum I frequent. What surprises me is their open, ignorant and simple introductory statement, typically something like "I know nothing about gemstones, but I bought this to cut and sell." And then they go on to ask a series of questions that are unabashedly unashamed that they have come to whatever forum it is to completely rely on the expertise of others in their quest to make a "whole lotta money." They ask questions like "is this good quality? What should I pay?, and What should I sell it for?" Some of them have even become a bit confrontational when given responses they don't like. I have seen some argue that yes, the quality of the rough is really really good even though it doesn't look that way. Or, in one case, after the experts opined that what the OP had was crap, he replied with "oh, you're just green with envy." :snore: :snore:

There is another kind that comes along and announces "I just moved to [fill in the exotic gem producing country of your choice]. Since I'm here, I've decided to buy gems and make a lot of money when I sell them back home [fill in the home country of Australia/U.S./Canada/Europe]. I have my savings all ready to invest, but can you tell me what I should buy?" Huh? Really?

You see the disaster unfolding and what can you do? They really believe that "the guy" they met who tells them about a new discovery/vein/type of stone is bona fide and there is nothing you can say or do that will make them believe that this happens all the time and the locals have spent their life around these stones and are more sophisticated/know more than they will know for a long time to come...these make me sad and I worry for them.

On the flip side, I love those who want to learn about the stones, who want to learn about cutting and are generally curious about minerals. I envy those who jump in and want to facet, as at least at this point, I am too intimidated to even think about trying. Pandora, I know you will start faceting; I feel it in my bones and you will be really good and I will buy from you, if I haven't invested all my money in rough, so I can go out and make "a whole lotta money." :Up_to_something:
 

minousbijoux

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iLander|1333078633|3159654 said:
I have been wanting to buy a piece of rough for years. I like the transformative aspect of it. I'd like to hold on the rough for a while, get to know it, live with it, enjoy it, imagine the gem within. Then send it off and have it cut--- transformed!

Every time I come across a likely piece of rough, I send Jerry at Gemart the pics, and we discuss it. Pros, cons, etc. Usually it comes down to me being an idiot and not knowing anything about rough! :bigsmile: So we decide to pass on that piece, and I start the search again.

I know eventually I'll find something that he thinks will work, and then I'll finally get to see "my stone" be transformed. That will be really wonderful.

But part of me knows I will regret it. The stone, made wholly by nature, will be gone. In it's place will be something completely different, but vaguely the same.

The ultimate would be to have both the rough and the gem at the same time. I'd like to hold up an unlikely looking rock and say "See this funky rock?" then hold up a gem and say, "Look what came out of it!" . But that's impossible. 8)

ETA: You know what it is? It's like magic. People just want to be part of that magic. At least that's what I want to do . . .

The cutters might complain sometimes, but I think that's part of what motivates them.

My feelings are almost exactly like iLander's, but with a slight twist. To me, buying rough is almost like buying a lottery ticket; it allows me to dream about what will emerge and how I will hit the jackpot with the beautiful stone. But the dream ends with the cut rough, just as it does when I hear which numbers won the lottery, so I prolong it, as iLander does by keeping the stone in its rough form just to appreciate it. I also don't spend my life savings on rough, and only buy if I like the way the rough looks just as rough...sigh.
 

Arkteia

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I bought rough only once, because I wanted a certain stone and thought that the price offered by a cutter who had the rough was too high. I found some rough on a website. I sent it to Jerry Newman, who said that the yield would be much less than usual, 20%, because what I bought was a "flat", not a "plump" piece. He asked me if I wanted a precision cut small stone, about 1-ct, or a larger stone with less-than-perfect cut. I chose the latter. Jerry managed to cut a stone twice as large as planned, but predictably, the cut was unusual. Consider it a happy-end, because Jerry cut out a nice stone, but iLander, I wish I had your wisdom to contact Jerry first, before I bought the rough! The stone is very likable, but since that time, I bought several much larger stones of such type. The prices on them have skyrocketed as of recently.
 

Pandora II

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I've seen the same posts that you have on other forums. It amazes me. I also I've had one person tell me that as I am a gemmologist I'm entirely untrustworthy as I am colluding with all the other in the jewellery industry who want to keep it all a big mystery to prevent outsiders making lots of money.... that fact that despite this I'm not vastly wealthy, nor retiring to Barbados on the proceeds of all the lolly I've made reselling the stuff those silly old natives sold me for 99p, doesn't appear to be a consideration to them nor the fact that I'm not a jeweller or even employed as a gemmologist!

Gene - that is exactly what I needed to know... in which case I shall leave such things to the experts and focus my future cutting dreams on a vaguely symmetrical cabochon!

Minoux - you are very kind. Unfortunately small London flat is unlikely to be quite right for a cutting bench, so it may be some time before I get to have a go. Plus my almost 3 year-old (where does the time go) is very keen on gemstones and would undoubtedly 'want a go'!
 

JewelFreak

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There are always people who think they have an angle on how to make a ton of money easily & in the current world economy, more of them. For some it's buy & sell "antiques," when they know nothing about them; some it's breed their dog & make a zillion selling puppies when they get a rude awakening on the amount of time & effort & vet bills & feeding & housing ones that don't find homes quickly; during the real estate boom around here, half the population decided to become developers & most of them lost their shirts due to ignorance of the business. You'd think a tiny bit of internet research would show anyone that you don't turn a crappy (or fabulous) piece of rough into a gemstone with a few swipes on the wheel. We see questions from the terminally ignorant -- the others do their research & don't need to ask. Like Minou, I can't help a sneer at those who become all hostile when they don't get the opinion they want. Weird.

Quite a few vendors seem to be sellling more rough rather than cut stones -- Doug Menadue comes to mind, but others too. Why would that be?

--- Laurie
 

mastercutgems

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I will have to agree with Gene on this as being a cutter for about 22 years and cutting for the trade on repairs for about 8 years; repairing and trying to make the gem look like it had never been repaired is one of the hardest things I have done in faceting; next to concave cutting which to me takes forever...

If one was to want to learn how to facet; it is not hard; just some basic hard rules of science like speed, abrasive type, polishing media or type corresponding to the hardness etc. I know when i got my first machine it was an ultra-tec and it was new and the man handed me a book the third edition of " Faceting for Amateurs" by Glenn and Martha Vargas... I was sold all the laps, dop wax (yuck), polishing media, and a few pieces of quartz. The man would not show me a thing; and just said read the book...

Thank goodness I had 9 years as a tool and die maker and machinist so it went " hand-in-hand" so it was not hard. The noise of the ultra-tec was less or may I say is less than either of my Fac-Ette machines. As for space Gene is right aside from a 8 inch trim saw a 2 foot by 4 foot table will work fine; just make sure it is very heavy and will not shake or vibrate when the machine is at a higher speed. A 5 gallon plastic bucket with a lid and hole in the top for the drain will work fine.

It is not hard to facet; to me it is like painting by numbers :) I know I make up cuts off the top of my head due to the shape of the rough etc. but I had to learn to do that when I did all the repairs for the trade as when someone sends you a 40 carat tanzanite that is beyond fine and it has an abraded crown and they want you to rework the entire damaged area and not change the shape or diameter so it can go back in the mount; well it will make you sit there and think for awhile; but it teaches you angles and degrees and what they will and will not do when combined with other index settings. But even though a little difficult at first; it will become second nature to you and never give up... I think that is something about cutters that stay in this over 5 years; they learn to adapt to situations and find ways around things; it is good for your determination factor :)


I am sure there are many cutters on here like myself that will be willing to help anyone that really wants to learn..

Most respectfully and just one cutters opinion :)

Dana
 

Pandora II

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Love the article!

Just out of interest, what was the insurance position when you were repairing fine stones? Sounds horribly nervewracking.

Fascinating to know how hard repairs are - just shows how little one knows...
 

mastercutgems

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Hi Pandora :wavey:
Yes it can be a little nerve racking; and with all the treatments??? that is why I do not do it any longer :) I have too much of my own to cut; but you will do many things when starting up and want the business of selling the colored gems; offer a service and that way you will get your foot in the door.

You can carry some insurance like Jewelers Mutual and many others and take a policy of 100k and you are pretty much covered. thankfully I never had to collect on any; but things can happen; gems will come off the dop, etc. and that is really why I only use 5 minute epoxy; it is a cold set for temperature sensitive gems; it takes a good amount of heat for it to soften enough to let go when polishing chrysoberyl and sapphire which can generate some heat on the ceramic lap. It is clean and gives you just enough time to make adjustments to the dop; also when you want it to let go; just a little heat on the dop from a alcohol lamp and it will let go without heat risk or shock risk on super glue or that type adhesive or even dop wax...

Many cutters have different approaches; not to say any is totally right or wrong; just my choice... Do not let it overwhelm you on the repair thingy; you just have to sit there and think it out; as with most good machines you have a cheater and you can always see where you are cutting or polishing; the main thing and that is even when starting; go slow and watch what the lap is doing; when they talk of floating in facets it is just watching the cutting advance into the point or location you want it to end up. That is all; just watching and following what it is doing and getting it to follow the path you want it to take.

I used to teach faceting to older people and children and they both learn very easily. The main thing is buy a good solid machine that has good repeatability; does not drift, is accurate; hey they all sound the same :lol: It must be important ... LOL it really is; being in the tool and die making field for many years you learn that is critical in quality work and it also cuts down on your frustration... I have cut with about every machine made even the jamb peg machines and I even own a jamb peg mast; but nothing beats a good accurate stable machine; so like with good facet rough; if you are going to take this serious; buy quality...

Just my opinion :)

Most respectfully';

Dana
 

ChrisA222

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I like this topic!

I have considered buying rough, but so far, have not, again because I don't know the difference between a good piece, and a not-so good piece. But the reason that I've considered it...Lets face it...many of us on here like our gems precision-cut. Many times the good gem cutters we like to deal with, do not have for sale the gems we are looking for. By buying rough (I was considering some really awesome copper-shiller red Oregon Sunstone) I can pick out the stone type that I want, and send it to my guy who does the cutting, and, as long as the rough is a good piece, I will have that precision cut stone that was not available.

What I do do..often...is go to Ebay and buy a large, native cut stone specifically with a precision-recutting in mind. This is better for me because I have a better idea of what I am buying. For example, recently I was able to aquire a Morganite almost 8 cts on Ebay for an amazing price. It had outstanding clarity, and I liked the color. It was cut horribly of course...but the money I saved by buying it from a Thai seller for cheap, I was able to put into the recut and now I have a precison cut Morganite with excellent clarity and a color I like, which ended up around 5cts and I guarantee if any precision cutter had this piece for sale, it would be quite a bit more than my initial investment and the recutting. I've done this with a 4.5ct Sphene, a green zircon, a mandarin spessartite, etc. I just bought a 5.5ct neon green sphene and a nearly 7ct cuprian tourmaline (HORRIBLE CUT!!!). In the long run, I am sure I am coming out ahead by buying large clean but poorly cut stones and then having them recut. Same can be done with rough if you learn enough about buying it, have trusted vendors, and a willing cutter.
 

minousbijoux

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Chrisa222|1333120031|3159879 said:
In the long run, I am sure I am coming out ahead by buying large clean but poorly cut stones and then having them recut. Same can be done with rough if you learn enough about buying it, have trusted vendors, and a willing cutter.

Other than to say that it is thinking like this that gets most into trouble, I will leave your post for those in the trade to respond to.

In the meantime, Chris, I would take the Trade Member tag off, as you are not a member of the trade, unless I'm mistaken.
 

kenny

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I haven't bought any rough yet but have come very close to buying a rough diamond or two, and some day I may.

Even though I'm sure any rough offered to me was rejected by pros as being not worth cutting and I'm sure I'd be overpaying, still there is just the cool factor of having a diamond exactly as it came out of the ground, especially one with green skin.

I've seen some very cool rings with rough diamonds.

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kenny

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31,763


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Lady_Disdain

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I am one of the people who bought rough and had it precision cut. I did it twice (thrice if you count a slab of marra mamba for cabbing, but that is a whole different story). One was my spinel, the other a Loliondo Spess. In both cases, I got the rough from trusted vendors. The spinel was in response to an inquiry I set out and the spess was offered by a cutter who had excess rough (he was also very straight forward about inclusions and possible cuts for it). Both were cut by people I trust. Neither were a bargain.

Why did I do it? First, in the case of the spinel, was the fact that the rough had fantastic colour and had a lot of silk, which is what I wanted. I couldn't find anything that met my needs and that rough did. I admit I was scared to death. In the case of the spess, the rough was a nice colour and a very good price. I knew the seller and trusted him when he told me I could get the cut I wanted from it (his girlfriend was the cutter so all in the family). It is a Graham design with a lovely, small table.

Would I do it again? Only if the stars line up right again: a cutter I know selling excess rough, a stone I am looking for, etc. But not as a way to make money, but only to get a stone I love.
 
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