Thoughts on spinel sourced from Las Vegas show

[dori2002]

I had a vendor look for a 3+ carat spinel while at the Las Veges show last week. These are the pictures he sent me. They said is was from Burma, and will cert if I like it. Probably will take a look at in person next week. The vender said it is an excellent stone, They want 3000.00 per carat.

 

[dori2002]

one more picture of girdle.

 

[tourma-guy]

Very pretty. I'm no expert on spinel pricing, but sounds kind of expensive.

 

[T L]

Not the most saturated red spinel, more of a wine color. Does it fluor, how does it look in sunlight, fluorescent light, other lighting?

 

[Acinom]

Beautiful stone with a very nice colour. I find it very expensive though...but I have very limited experience in colored stones.

 

[chrono]

Very expensive for the colour I see on my monitor.

 

[minousbijoux]

What color are you looking for? If you are looking for a red red, this is not it and I would pass. Looks on the darker side with saturation that could be higher.

 

[Lisa Loves Shiny]

I think the cut is a bit wonky too. For that price I am hoping you can do much better.

I was wondering if some of the members on PS might point out a good spinel for you Dori that is within this price range. They tend to find the best gems.

 

[Arcadian]

Like everyone else, its pretty, but I see purple in this stone. (nothing wrong with it if thats your thing) I wonder if the price hike is for being burmese... I know that there's embargo on rubies and jade, but isn't everything else ok to import (anyone? Bueller?)

If the local is of great interest to you, make sure you get the right report for it to support what the vendor is telling you.

 

[dori2002]

The vendor said wait until I see it in person before making a judgment, but of course I am open to suggestions. This is the problem with photos. The only true way is by actually seeing the stone in person.

 

[GliderPoss]

Looks beautiful to me! (I am more partial to darker red coloured spinels not hot pink)

Definitely best to see in person in a variety of lighting as that seems a high price to pay...

 

[Marlow]

Very expensive for the colour I see on my monitor.

Overpriced - 3K pct would be high but ok for a stoplight red or vivid pink but not for a color like this. I believe you could get this for 500-700 pct.

I think it is not important whether a similar colored spinel is from Tanzania, Sri Lanka or Burma - the quality of the color is important now. Burma is only a premium in fine red or pink ( Namya - "Jedi-Spinel" )

Look at Gemwow - I purchased a Chrysoberyl - a very good customer service - they offer many burmese spinel ( some mahenge too)

Multicolorgems offers an oval 3,64ct bright vivid pink Mahenge for 4004 $.....

 

[distracts]

It looks to me like kind of a pyrope garnet color... so either the pictures are really off or the price is really off.

 

[LD]

Mmmmmm I wonder if it will black out in natural daylight? It's very dark and will probably darken a bit more in a setting. It's also priced on the high side.

 

[arkieb1]

I agree with the others are you after fire engine red or port wine tinted red? This seems to be more of the latter...

 

[Acinom]

Any updates Dori? Have you come to a conclusion?

 

[dori2002]

I just received the spinel. In certain light it looks good, when there is not much light it looks dark. Ispoke with a very highly regarded gem cutter, He said China is paying crazy amounts for rough, especially red rough, so it is very difficult and exspensive to get. The vender came down to 2750 per carat. I am not sure what to do, soon they be out of range for me. I will wait the weekend and then make up my mind. The reality is these prices might be here to stay. I just don't know.

 

[T L]

I just received the spinel. In certain light it looks good, when there is not much light it looks dark. Ispoke with a very highly regarded gem cutter, He said China is paying crazy amounts for rough, especially red rough, so it is very difficult and exspensive to get. The vender came down to 2750 per carat. I am not sure what to do, soon they be out of range for me. I will wait the weekend and then make up my mind. The reality is these prices might be here to stay. I just don't know.

If you're now wowed with it, then don't waste your money. Gemstones shouldn't be bought for an investment or just because someone says the prices are getting out of reach. You should buy what you love, and if this doesn't do it for you, then send it back. It doesn't sound like you are enthralled with it, are you?

 

[Marlow]

Again and again...

A high ( here extremely high) price is not a sign for a high quality.

And the chinese "story" is a fairytale.

There is a higher demand on spinel course the people noticed it is a valuable and beautiful gem and new sources like Mahenge or Luc Yen produce beautiful new colors. Spinel was underated.

But 2750 pct for a stone like this is to much. And def. no investment!

 

[Arcadian]

Dori, it comes down to if you really love how this stone looks. This is a very expensive stone per ct, so I think you have to decide if you personally feel its worth it. Some people like darker stones and would be fine with it. Some would not. Sometimes a stone can change for better or for worse when set, and thats something you don't always know until after its set!

Some spinels don't hold up well in every lighting unfortunately be it cut or other things, and in particular its bad if it doesn't hold up in YOUR lighting. If thats important to you should keep looking.

If I had to base my opinion off the images posted, I would say send it back. But remember, its you looking at it and not us. An image helps but doesn't always tell the entire story. I feel like everyone is in agreement that no one wants you to buy something you can't be in love with (especially at that kind of price!)

 

[tourma-guy]

There are much better deals out there for spinel. Its unlikely the prices will skyrocket anytime soon, so don't settle on a stone that doesn't wow you.

 

[Marlow]

There are much better deals out there for spinel. Its unlikely the prices will skyrocket anytime soon, so don't settle on a stone that doesn't wow you.

1+

It is a nice stone. But if a spinel ( pink-orang-red color range) looks similar to a garnet ( almandine, pyrope, umbalite, malaya, rhodolite) it is of course a beautiful stone but not a premium quality - fine neon pink, top stoplight red you will never see in a garnet.

Better you send it back - with a budget of 8-9K you will find much better stones....

http://gemcal.com/burgundy-color-red-spinel-2-58-cts-2456

http://gemcal.com/majestic-burgundy-color-red-spinel-2-61-cts-1400

 

[minousbijoux]

So does it help your decision making at all to know that it appears that no one here thinks that the stone is any kind of deal? I haven't heard one PSer say they would consider buying it, fwiw.

 

[PrecisionGem]

Marlow, the Chinese story is not a fairytale. The US market has not caught up with what is being paid in China. People in the US are suffering from sticker shock.

There is a substantial price difference from 3 cts and up vs 1 to 2.99 ct. For example, for the same quality stone, the wholesale price guide for 1 to 2.99 red spinel is $1850 per ct, where as 3 to 4.9 ct is $3000.

You need to compare similar size stones are you are comparing per ct prices.

 

[dori2002]

A few pictures from cell phone. looks a little different.

 

[Marlow]

Marlow, the Chinese story is not a fairytale. The US market has not caught up with what is being paid in China. People in the US are suffering from sticker shock.

There is a substantial price difference from 3 cts and up vs 1 to 2.99 ct. For example, for the same quality stone, the wholesale price guide for 1 to 2.99 red spinel is $1850 per ct, where as 3 to 4.9 ct is $3000.

You need to compare similar size stones are you are comparing per ct prices.

Of course you have to compare similar sizes!

That is why I post these Gemcal stones - a 2,80 ct red spinel ( 1850pct as you say - btw. wholesale, really??) would be 5180$
A 3,20 ct would be ( 3000 pct ) would be 9600$ So a tiny little difference of 0,40 ct is 4420$ - 11050 pct....

I would avoid the 3,20ct stone and go for a 2,40-2,90 ct stone. I avoid for example a 1,05 ct Benitoite or russian Demantoid and would go for a 0,85 ct. Many here know these price steps from buying diamonds.

 

[minousbijoux]

I always found the The Guide to be on the high side for prices compared to what we are able to find online or via some vendors at gem shows.

 

[PrecisionGem]

I think the OP stone was over 3 ct. so you were quoting stones that were under 3 cts, and there is a substantial price difference above the 2.99 ct mark.

One of the dangers of comparing stones, especially from images, is that subtile differences in stones can mean a lot in price, and that's one of the reasons that "The Guide" is for people in the trade.

For example, the same size stone, depending on quality ranges from $40 per ct to $4000, with divisions of pricing. Looking at pictures from different vendors, taken with different camera's with different lighting, and maybe different levels of enhancements, do you think you are really able to decide where on this scale the stone falls?

I think The Guide is high on some stones and low on others. The prices offered in it, are considered wholesale. With the internet, not the division between wholesale and retail has gotten rather gray an unclear.

The bottom line when buying any stone, is DO YOU LIKE it. Who cares what other people like, unless your intent is to buy it an resell it.

I bought a blue band for my Apple Watch. My wife hates it, thinks it looks stupid. I love it. And I'm keeping it.

 

[Marlow]

Gene, I know that there is a pricedifference - but again I wanted to show the OP that there are better deals.

A round .99ct Benitoite for 1000 pct is 999$

A round 1.01 ct Benni is 2000 pct so 2020$ - is it a good idea to spend 1021 $ for 0,02 ct difference you will not see course there is a 1ct mark in benitoite!!! I know they are extremely rare about 1 ct!

In my opinion this spinel is nice but not 2750 pct...

 

[PrecisionGem]

I agree about the price, but then I thinking buying stones is silly anyway. I personally don't own any stones, my wife has one stone that I cut. I could never bring my self to spend even a few hundred dollars on a stone. Thank the gods that everyone doesn't feel the same way I do. I'm sure many think it's silly to buy an Apple Watch or Z4 too, so we all different priorities.

The unfortunate reality is, the price of stones has gotten crazy lately. I don't the full effect of the prices people are getting for rough is being felt yet, as many of the stones people are buying today are from inventory that has been around.

A friend of mine just got back from Vietnam, and spent some time in the gem street markets. He sent me this picture of two nice pieces of spinel rough. Together the stones were just under 8 cts. So cut, would be maybe 3 cts total, but more likely 2.5 cts. Guess what they were asking in the market in Vietnam for these two stones?