Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure me!?

[zebra]

When would you start to be concerned about not hearing back from a vendor?

I purchased a stone & paid by bank wire transfer. When I received the stone, it was nothing like what was pictured & I immediately wanted to return it. Unfortuantely, it had to be shipped from the USA back to Portugal. I shipped it by a method approved by the seller, and the tracking information shows it was delivered 1st thing Monday morning.

I asked the seller to contact me when the package arrived, so I could stop worrying about it being in transit. I have yet to hear back from him, after emails & phone calls. The phone number is now coming up as “Unavailable” when I try calling.

When I explained the situation to my family, they immediately became concerned, even if this seller is a known/respected vendor on Pricescope.

This is a large amount of money -- over 7K. The discount given for a wire transfer is now seeming like a bad choice; at least with a credit card or PayPal I would feel like I had a little more protection. Secondly, the seller requested the money be sent to a bank in Germany, the stone shipped from Portugal, and the “Main Office” is listed as in Japan.

As I write this out, I’m starting to feel like I have been had. That sounds horrible, as many of you reccommend this vendor, but I’m going to feel absolutely sick until that money is refunded to me.

As soon as I posted on Facebook about ordering the stone, I received an email from the vendor, saying he “hope none of those undercover psychopaths on Pricescope talks bad about my stone.” This immediately turned me dead cold -- it seemed like a paranoid, and perhaps childish thing to say. I came to Pricescope looking for advice & instead, I’m getting stalked by the seller himself (I had not given him my Pricescope username). It just seemed like such an unprofessional comment, I was a bit shocked. But the money had been sent. If the stone arrived & was fantastic, I would choose to ignore such a comment.

When I emailed the seller to let him know I would be returning the stone, as it appeared completely brown & not lively at all, at least in my eyes, he wrote back explaining that “many cheaper rubies are like that.” I suppose my perspective may be different than some, but a 1.34 carat ruby at over 7K is NOT cheap. I realize I do not know a lot about gemstones (I have never pretended to) -- and yet I was a bit insulted to be told that the reason I didn’t like the stone was that I had chosen something “cheap.” When I was interested in ordering the stone, he had nothing but praise for it. Again, it just seemed so spiteful, and again, far from professional.

Lastly, when I mentioned on Pricescope that I was interested in rubies from another vendor, I got an email asking if I had seen them in person. I didn’t really think a seller should be asking about your interactions with other vendors, but maybe I’m wrong here. It just seemed again like he was insecure about the stone I had ordered, and didn’t want me talking to anyone else.

So please, could someone assure me that I’m not losing my mind? I realize that it hasn’t been that long since the stone was delivered, but having received no confirmation that it has arrived, I’m starting to freak out. The multiple countries involved, the suddenly “Unavailable” phone number, and the snide/paranoid comments about Pricescope, my “cheap” choice in rubies & sudden disappearance are not reassuring me.

I apologize if this is inappropriate, but I really am not sure what else to do. I have tried the 2 methods of contact I have (email & phone) & have heard nothing. So perhaps he’s checking Pricescope. If so, please, please, please email or call me back to let me know you received the stone & will be issuing my refund.

Thank you.

ETA: When I asked if there was a Pricescope discount (couldn't hurt to ask, could it?), he replied "no, since everyone is on Pricescope." Well, here's a reminder to you... Supposedly everyone is on Pricescope. Which means unprofessional comments, and less than ideal return etiquette will be read by "everyone" too.

 

[chrono]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

Zebra,
I am very sorry to hear of your troubles. I have strong suspicions who the vendor is and know that he probably thinks I'm one of those psychopath Pricescope posters. As far as I know, he is legit as other have purchased from him before. I have voiced my concern about his photography methods numerous times but have tired of that battle long ago so I rarely comment on his inventory these days. There is a time difference, time needed to have the package delivered/picked up and etc. I'd give it a little more time before panicking.

 

[zebra]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

Thanks for the reply psychopath

I know there's a time difference, but it's been 48 hours... I just want a quick "Yes it's here." email -- not expecting the refund that quickly.

I just have gotten such a horrible taste in my mouth that I will not feel right until I have my money back. I realize this is letting my emotional side get the better of me, but I expect, as a customer, to be treated with respect, and for a seller to be confident enough in their product that they don't feel the need to call those who may comment on it as "psychopaths." Feels a little too much like 3rd grade again.

Chrono, you have no idea how much your reply is helping -- my family thought I was absolutely INSANE when I told them. They thought the money was surely gone. Now I feel bad for having posted this, but if nothing else (refund aside), I feel like others have a right to hear about others' experiences -- I know I would have liked to hear from others before I made my decision.

 

[RedSpinel]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

I dont know what to say about that. Well, actually I do know what to say, but I dont want to be wrong with my opinion, because that might just make things worse. But I dont know who the seller is, so I dont know if they are reputable or not. Was this seller really given high praise or at least good recommendations here on PS?

I can tell you that a 1.34ct ruby for $7,000 isnt cheap! If I was to pay $7,000 for a 1.34ct ruby, it better be AMAZING! But to be honest, I just cant see paying 7K for a 1.34ct ruby, period, no matter how nice. It shouldnt cost that much unless its being bought straight out of a high end N.Y. jeweler. But if its being bought from Portugal from an online dealer, who hasnt spent the millions of dollars setting up a posh, uptown jewelry store, then it shouldnt be that expensive IMO.

But mostly, it shouldnt be ugly for $7,000!!! It shouldnt be brown for $7,000!!! I can get you a red, translucent ruby online for under $700. In fact, you dont need me to do it, YOU can find red, translucent rubies all day long online for $300-$700.

But if you are going to spend THAT much money on any gem, DO NOT do it online from some guy with 3 different addresses, who demands a cash transfer...... Thats a huge red flag IMO. ONLY spend that kind of money in person, with a reputable dealer at a store, and only use your credit card or debit, so you have SOME protection.

Who knows whats going to happen with this deal^, but it sounds all kinds of shady!

Hope I'm wrong, cause that a lot of money to lose.

 

[VapidLapid]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

Firstly, I think you will get your refund.

I can't even believe he called us "undercover psychopaths", we are not undercover, we are conspicuous!! And collectively we have super psychopathetic powers.

And if this seller is recommended here and fails to refund you promptly it will be discussed ad nauseum here with all the search terms that any prospective client of theirs would use prominently placed so that this incident would be better known than their own logo.

Do you have a vendor photo of the stone? Did you take any of your own to compare?

I dont think you've been scammed, as you have returned the stone. The scam would have been if you had kept it. Now you just have to get your money back.

Hold off on naming him here. Im sure many of us will guess him correctly. It's not like this is the first time some weasel gemstone dealer called us names. This guy needs to get his head out of his culet.

 

[Jereni]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

I'm so sorry to hear about this! Give it another day. I know sometimes when I get busy, I don't get things to the post office or pick things up in a timely manner...maybe this vendor just had a hectic few days. I will keep my fingers crossed for you!

 

[zebra]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

Spinel, It's a vendor on the "recommended" list. If you read my earlier thread, it won't be hard to figure out.

As to the 3 different countries... I thought everything was in Germany when I was sent the banking information. I had no idea Portugal was involved until the package arrived & it had a return address in Portugal. Now that I've read the website for the 7th time, I'm seeing that the "Main" office is in Japan. I have no idea what country the actual seller is in. I know. Beyond sketchy.

The ruby was unheated/untreated -- it seemed somewhat comparable in price to other, similarly sized rubies that were also unheated/untreated, but yes, I realize that is a BOAT load of money for a rock. I thought it would show up & absolutely amaze me. But when I opened the box, there was not even a single fiber of my body that wanted to keep it, or even look at it long enough to photograph it. I regret that now, as I would love to have pictures to share. When you receive a package like that, you get super excited, and yet when I opened it, I literally almost cried. All that money, all that expectation, and completely disappointed. If it had made me smile, would it still have been too much money? Perhaps, but who knows.

 

[chrono]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

Red Spinel,
The vendor seems to have happy customers who are regular CS posters. A 1.34 ct untreated ruby of good quality CAN cost his much, and sometimes more. I agree with you though that a brownish or lower quality ruby should not be sold at that price. When it comes to international sales, sometimes a wire transfer is the only way to make the payment. I think there is a limit on CC purchases or something like that. It took a good leap of faith for me to wire thousands of dollars to Swala even though I know he is reputable. He's in Tanzania but his bank is in a different country. I understand the use of different locations due to the political and financial conditions in Africa.

 

[zebra]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

VapidLapid (the conspicuous psychopath)...

I suppose "scammed" is not the proper word... I worry he'll deny that the stone was returned, and thus, not refund my money.

He shipped by UPS 2nd day(?). When I said I wanted to return it, he told me to return it UPS "under his account" so it would be covered by his insurance. When I tried to do that at the UPS office, they said that was not possible, unless he sent me a return label himself -- they couldn't send it under his account otherwise. I explained this to him, requested a return label (which I was happy to pay for), and he said no, it didn't work that way. He said his insurance wasn't through UPS, so it was okay to use USPS Express International. This was a much easier option for me, as the closest UPS office is pretty far away, and they wanted nearly triple the fee to send at the same speed as USPS.

So I'm concerned he'll try to say it never got there (despite the Express tracking info showing it did arrive), as it was sent back by a different shipping method than he used originally, or that it's not covered by insurance if lost. I made sure he said it was 100% insured/acceptable to send it that way. And now I regret that too.

Just too many elements that are making me uncomfortable at this point

There was a 10% discount for the wire transfer, and given the recommendations on here, I thought it would be ok.

And OOPS, it was 1.55 carats, not 1.34... brain is fried.

 

[VapidLapid]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

I think it will be ok.
He should have given you 15% discount since you get 5% as a first time member just for buying a stone from him.
Anyway, it has probably only been received by his agent at customs. I would give it at least another day for him to get word of its safe arrival and to initiate the refund.

 

[RedSpinel]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

Spinel, It's a vendor on the "recommended" list. If you read my earlier thread, it won't be hard to figure out.

As to the 3 different countries... I thought everything was in Germany when I was sent the banking information. I had no idea Portugal was involved until the package arrived & it had a return address in Portugal. Now that I've read the website for the 7th time, I'm seeing that the "Main" office is in Japan. I have no idea what country the actual seller is in. I know. Beyond sketchy.

The ruby was unheated/untreated -- it seemed somewhat comparable in price to other, similarly sized rubies that were also unheated/untreated, but yes, I realize that is a BOAT load of money for a rock. I thought it would show up & absolutely amaze me. But when I opened the box, there was not even a single fiber of my body that wanted to keep it, or even look at it long enough to photograph it. I regret that now, as I would love to have pictures to share. When you receive a package like that, you get super excited, and yet when I opened it, I literally almost cried. All that money, all that expectation, and completely disappointed. If it had made me smile, would it still have been too much money? Perhaps, but who knows.

I know that feeling of excited anticipation, followed by the sometimes inevitable intense disappointment when you realize something isnt as nice as you'd hoped. But you can always get something nicer later, which can more than make up for the low feeling you are experiencing now. It doent just apply to gem buying either, as I just recently bought a really nice, high end LED flashlight for over $100, and I expected it to be super cool, but when I started to take a close look at it, it was garbage! So I had to ship it back, and pick out another one of the same price from a different manufacturer, and when I got it in, I was more happy with it than I assumed I would be if the other one had been as nice as it was supposed to be. Granted it was only $115, but it the same feeling.

I've felt that more often with gems though.


Chrono: I agree that technically speaking, rubies CAN cost more than 7K for a 1.34ct stone, but I've seen nice rubies that were nicely transparent for sale for around $1,000 - $1,200 per carat for 1.5 - 3ct stones. I think the really high priced rubies can only be justifiably sold at Tiffany's or a jeweler of similar quality. But I could be wrong, it wouldnt be the first time.

 

[chrono]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

When I have an international return for an expensive stone or use an express shipping method, sometimes the vendor takes care of the insurance. They are either self insured or have a third party insurance for shipping. UPS does not insure loose gemstones. USPS is more cost effective but very slow.

 

[zebra]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

there was a 5% 1st time buyer discount -- I wasn't trying to with-hold that -- just was referring to the reason I used wire transfer instead of credit card.

the delivery confirmation indicates "delivered" -- it cleared customs 3 days before that... still not sure how many people are involved in this, given the different countries.

but thank you all for the reassurance -- again, I apologize if I over reacted here. I should have waited longer before freaking out, but my father (a lawyer) pretty much told me he thought I was screwed. Um yeah, he never says things like that!

Allright, I'll try to relax. Promise.

Then again, thought you all should know what he thinks of you

 

[chrono]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

Red Spinel,
Were those $1K/ct rubies untreated, eye clean-ish and of good colouration? I question the quality and lack of treatment for the very low price, even from a non-name branded store.

Zebra,
I appreciate your sharing what the vendor thinks of the PS posters.

Sincerely,
An undercover psychopath.

 

[bluebirrrd]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

Zebra, I understand why you'd be concerned about such a large purchase. I think I know the vendor and the stone and I feel confident you'll get your refund.

When working with a new vendor, I like to tell them how I was referred, which is through PS. I don't always know how they'll really feel about that. I hope they'll think - Nice! An educated customer who cares about gemstones, will have some good questions, and can potentially increase my business through their positive reviews! I know that's a bit optimistic, but if your quote is true, how surprising and disappointing that our business isn't actually welcome and appreciated.

 

[zebra]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

Bluebird, those are direct quotes -- happy to forward the email to anyone who wants to see what kind of "professional" opinions are out there if Pricescopers.

 

[chrono]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

Bluebird, those are direct quotes -- happy to forward the email to anyone who wants to see what kind of "professional" opinions are out there if Pricescopers.

Best not to post that here. I think cutting and pasting email content verbatim is against PS policy. The same goes for posting email addresses.

 

[Kitten35]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

I know which vendor you are speaking of.

I personally had a good experience with him this past year with a stone I bought, and often admire his inventory. I found him to be forthcoming/frank with his opinions, but also very honest and helpful about the transaction. I do not think you have anything to worry about; It is probably just taking time for the transaction to go through.

Of course correct me if I am wrong (I am fairly new to gems!) but I do not think 7K for a ruby that is unheated, of that size, is too high. I thought, actually, when I read it, that it was rather low, and I would think it would be difficult to find a truly good quality gem in that size for a lower price. I could be wrong about that, however.

 

[minousbijoux]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

I can't even believe he called us "undercover psychopaths", we are not undercover, we are conspicuous!! And collectively we have super psychopathetic powers.

I have so many things to say.

1. He will refund you, I'm sure of it.

2. I'm sorry that this has happened. How disappointing to invest that amount and find that it is not at all what you expected.

3. RedSpinel, I don't know of any place you can buy multiple carat, fine quality untreated, clear red rubies for the amount of $1,000/ct. We may have different expectations for stones.

4. VL cracks me up and he's right - who says we're undercover? We wear our psychopathology proudly. I'm sorry we cause this vendor so much trouble.

5. It would cause me great discomfort and concern too if a vendor said those things to me. I would not want to do business with them again.

Again, I am really sorry you even have to go through this.

 

[Arkteia]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

- Zebra, I am sorry that it has happened. Since this vendor is known for beautiful photography, your ruby must have looked gorgeous on the photo. And IRL it appeared brownish, which was disappointing. $ 7K is quite an investment, and the return is up in the air. Let us hope for the better, because this vendor is on PS trusted vendors' list, and so far no one here complained of this person holding onto clients' money. I have been buying expensive items abroad, and so far, returns have been smooth, but lengthy.

- on a personal level, I feel sad. I enjoyed reading vendor's postings, written well and with humor. Perhaps what the vendor said was just a vitriolic phrase on a bad day, but still so very unpleasant...

Chrono and other undercover psychopaths here , from a psychiatrist's perspective, the diagnosis is unprofessional. "Psychopath" is an old name for "antisocial personality disorder". It is, mostly, reserved for men, who are glib and smooth talkers.

 

[LD]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

I'm another who is convinced you will be refunded. I would be incredibly surprised If Swala didn't.

Unfortunately their photography is highly glamorised and not representational / true to life which is very disappointing. They have some great stones and some that are less so but a $7k ruby is not an insubstantial purchase and for that amount you shouldn't be seeing a muddy gemstone so you were right to return.

Eric posts on PS so I guess he's including himself amongst the happy band of psychos?

 

[pinkjewel]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

I"m pretty sure I know who the vendor is,too. I purchased a stone from him last year and also had to return it to Portugal. Like you, I felt his descriptions did not quite match the stone I received. However, he always returned both my calls and emails promptly, and issued a refund the day after the stone arrived in Portugal. Perhaps he is traveling and in some remote area. Seems I remember he lived somewhere where they had problems with internet service,too.
I've always enjoyed reading his posts on this forum- it is a shame that he feels we are "psychopaths". Maybe he was having a bad day...

 

[Lovinggems]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

I thought Swala posts from Tanzania, I don't think it's them...

 

[LD]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

Oooops think I've got the wrong vendor. Apologies to Swala.

However now knowing the right vendor I am still convinced of you getting your money back. I'm surprised at the vendors attitude as he also posts quite prolifically for a vendor on PS.

 

[cookies]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

If the vendor is who I think is, then you will get your refund back. I bought from him before. My transaction was very smooth, and his responses were always prompt, although I didn't need to return anything. I am guessing that he is out mining, buying rough/stones, or something like that, and cannot check his email/ voicemail/ missed calls at the moment.

 

[minousbijoux]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

If the vendor is who I think is, then you will get your refund back. I bought from him before. My transaction was very smooth, and his responses were always prompt, although I didn't need to return anything. I am guessing that he is out mining, buying rough/stones, or something like that, and cannot check his email/ voicemail/ missed calls at the moment.

This exactly. He cares too much about his reputation to let you down, Zebra.

 

[chrono]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

Of course correct me if I am wrong (I am fairly new to gems!) but I do not think 7K for a ruby that is unheated, of that size, is too high. I thought, actually, when I read it, that it was rather low, and I would think it would be difficult to find a truly good quality gem in that size for a lower price. I could be wrong about that, however.

It is all about quality. I've seen 2 carat unheated rubies selling for mere hundreds of dollars due to crappy colour. I've seen 2 carat unheated rubies selling for tens of thousands of dollars due to spectacular colour. As a price comparison, Gemfix has a potentially attractive 2.41 carat African ruby that is advertised for $8K.

 

[rosetta]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

Aw man I can't work out who the vendor is.

I iz stoopid

 

[minousbijoux]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

Hi all:

At the risk of jeopardizing things for Zebra, I think we should stop hinting at who the vendor is and let her sort it out with the vendor. I'm just trying to be proactive so as to protect the vendor and the OP...

 

[RedSpinel]

Re: Scared To Death That I've Been Scammed-Please reassure m

I can't even believe he called us "undercover psychopaths", we are not undercover, we are conspicuous!! And collectively we have super psychopathetic powers.

I have so many things to say.

1. He will refund you, I'm sure of it.

2. I'm sorry that this has happened. How disappointing to invest that amount and find that it is not at all what you expected.

3. RedSpinel, I don't know of any place you can buy multiple carat, fine quality untreated, clear red rubies for the amount of $1,000/ct. We may have different expectations for stones.

4. VL cracks me up and he's right - who says we're undercover? We wear our psychopathology proudly. I'm sorry we cause this vendor so much trouble.

5. It would cause me great discomfort and concern too if a vendor said those things to me. I would not want to do business with them again.

Again, I am really sorry you even have to go through this.

Well, I can assure you that I have pretty good taste in gems, and wouldnt consider a crappy ruby to be nice! When I mentioned nice rubies for $1000- $1200 per ct, it was on GSN being sold by a private dealer. Dont remember his name, but he was on there every weekend back in the day, some times with his son. He was a white guy, and traveled to Chantaburi to buy most of his stones regularly. He was selling Burmese rubies, which were 90% transparent, but like ALL rubies, had some slight internal inclusions. I have honestly never seen a ruby of 1.5cts or more that was completely flawless, without any noticeable inclusions, just like Emeralds. But these were nice. I'd give them a solid B+ or A-. He had a parcel of about 5-7 of them, all under about 3cts, but over about 1.5cts. Maybe he was doing one of his customer appreciation deals or something. I dont know. They were red, not brown either.


To the OP: I do want to say that it is completely understandable that you feel worried about this, as its a lot of money. Anyone, lawyer's daughter or not, would probably be worried at least a little. I would. But hopefully it will all work out. I've been worried over gems I've bought over the internet that seemed to be lost in the mail or something, but then they showed up at the last minute. I've done returns where I could see the tracking number, and I knew it had gotten back to the seller, but didnt hear anything from him/her. But then, they eventually contacted me, told me they were out of town for a while, and just got back. Then I got my refund. So thats probably similar to whats happened here.