shape
carat
color
clarity

question on recutting spinel

Status
Not open for further replies. Please create a new topic or request for this thread to be opened.

mufiin_top

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 8, 2009
Messages
133
Hi you guys,

I can''t seem to find an affordable round red spinel in the 7.5-8mm range. I know rounds are unusual for spinel, and the red I ordered turned out to be pink. So, my idea is to get an ebay spinel that seems true red but is cheaper and have it recut into a round.

Do any have an opinion on which is the best candidate for recutting, etc from the 3 options below? This would be set into a bezel setting and needs to be perfectly round, and I''d prefer it to be totally eye clean, not too dark and not pinkish or brown. I am wondering if these stones are actually much darker in regular light and/or if anyone else can recommend a good spinel for under 2k. I am debating just going ahead and getting a diamond center instead of spinel.

option 1
http://cgi.ebay.com/4-07CT-Shimmering-AAA-Red-Natural-Spinel-Sri-Lanka_W0QQitemZ350295908369QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item518f436011


option 2
http://cgi.ebay.com/4-31CT-Shimmering-Red-Natural-Spinel-Sri-Lanka_W0QQitemZ390134085735QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item5ad5cdb867



option 3
http://cgi.ebay.com/6-56CT-Shimmering-Red-Natural-Spinel-Sri-Lanka-Big_W0QQitemZ390135479650QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item5ad5e2fd62

To me it looks like option 3 has the best overall color and saturation as a candidate for recutting ...but are there any cutters with an opinion on this?

I have checked every single recommended website on PS by the way and saw very little round red.
Please feel free to contact me if you know somebody willing to cut a spinel or who has a larger red spinel.
 

Lady_Disdain

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 25, 2008
Messages
3,988
Considering the price point (arund $50 per carat), I would think that either these stones are synthetics or very, very dark.

Have you emailed vendors, asking about a round spinel? A lot of their inventory isn''t on the websites and, if no one has anything ready, they can watch for appropriate rough to cut a round for you.
 

chrono

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 22, 2004
Messages
38,227
All 3 options look awfully shallow (but may not be an issue for a recut), very dark (a problem since you want to bezel it) and also quite brown. Even not knowing any cutting issues off the bat without being able to study the stones, a recut might get you a lighter tone, but the saturation level will go down, making the stone even more brownish.
 

LD

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 29, 2008
Messages
10,224
Totally agree with the others - too brown/too dark and I suspect not good candidates for a re-cut.

I''m not sure I would be buying a stone to be recut for a whole host of reasons, not least of all, you''re very specific in what your end product would be like. That''s always dangerous.

Why don''t you contact some of the lapidarists who post on this forum and see if they have any rough of a red stone that would give you what you want? That''s far safer.
 

Michael_E

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Nov 19, 2003
Messages
1,290
Date: 12/29/2009 12:21:50 AM
Author:mufiin_top

This would be set into a bezel setting and needs to be perfectly round, and I''d prefer it to be totally eye clean, not too dark and not pinkish or brown.

Well, you''d be able to get the first two requirements from these stones. After a re-cut they would be round and in at least one case probably eye clean, (one or more of them is listed as SI, which means that they''ve got inclusions that you can see, when buying from this source). As for too dark, well I don''t think that you''d be able to get a very bright stone out of any of these. The reason is that the pictures that you''re seeing have been manipulated in two ways to make these stones more attractive. The most obvious of the manipulations is that the contrast and brightness of the pictures has been enhanced and the second manipulation is that those stones are sitting on a background which is reflective and has a scratch pattern which diffuses the light. This causes the stones to appear brighter since they are getting significant light through the pavilion causing areas which would look dark if the stone was sitting on your hand, to appear bright. Although I think a re-cut to a round would improve the stones dramatically, I doubt if they would be an acceptable comparison to what you are envisioning.

If you do decide to try this you should make sure that the stone you pick has a depth which is at least 65% to 70% of the width of your target stone size. As for judging the color of a stone, after it''s been re-cut, from a picture. I would suggest forgetting that. It''s hard enough to get an idea about final color when you''ve got the stone in your hand. Since pictures are always manipulated to some extent, you just can''t get a good idea of final color from them. I have also not had very good experience with having stones on E-Bay matching their claimed clarity either, so make sure to go over anything you get with a loupe and be prepared to send it back if it doesn''t suit you.
 

Arcadian

Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Sep 17, 2008
Messages
8,630
Like everyone has said, those stones are really quite dark. Personally I never buy a stone that I specifically to recut. For me personally thats more hassle than its worth most of the time, and its not really a money saver. I''d rather go ahead and spend what I''m going to spend and get the stone I want. (within reason of course!)


You may want to speak with a few vendors on the list at the top of the forum to see what they have available.


-A
 

PrecisionGem

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Jul 27, 2004
Messages
1,906
From a cutting standpoint, you could get the best weight return with the second stone, assuming you want to cut a round. The third stone, all pictures being equal, looks to be the best color. With a proper cut, you could brighten the stones up a bit, not sure why Chrono would think the saturation would degrade, and the stone turn more brown.

If they were really nice stones, they wouldn''t sell for $50 per ct even in the rough however, so I smell a rat here. A 4 ct. red spinel of good color should be over $1000 per ct wholesale, not $50.
 

elmo

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Jun 18, 2003
Messages
1,160
Here is a killer red round spinel, about 8.5mm. Sortof what Gene said, a really nice red spinel isn''t going to be cheap.

pala-14315.jpg
 

mufiin_top

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 8, 2009
Messages
133
Lady Disdain,

I have asked around and there isn''t much. AJS has one only, but it''s a little pinker than I''d ideally like. I will post a pic of it in another thread and get some opinions.
 

mufiin_top

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 8, 2009
Messages
133
Hi, I would be happy to contact some of the lapidarists who''d cut from rough for me, but am starting to suspect rough in the red I''m looking for is in short supply. In any case who are they and I''ll contact them? :)
 

mufiin_top

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 8, 2009
Messages
133
Michael, thanks for the input. I bought a red spinel off ebay about 7 or 8 years ago that looked to be red and it''s really much darker, so I see your point. I just figured if it was too dark I could return it to the seller since they accept returns...but the more I think about it the more I realize a bezel setting really requires something lighter.
 

mufiin_top

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 8, 2009
Messages
133
Gene,

I would go with a reputable vendor, but few of them have round red spinel. I know it would be a hassle for me, but it''s for an important piece of jewelry.
 

mufiin_top

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 8, 2009
Messages
133
Chrono,

You think the stones would be brownish if cut? They don''t appear to be very brownish to me...but I am asking you guys because I''m no expert. This same ebay seller has much cheaper spinel of the same weight that does appear to be brownish red tho. No chance I found a good deal huh?
 

mufiin_top

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 8, 2009
Messages
133
Thanks elmo but unfortunately that stone is both larger than I need and not perfectly round...and it''s a little more excrensive than I would prefer:)
 

LD

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 29, 2008
Messages
10,224
Muffin - Gene and Michael are both lapidarists so you''ve had some wonderful advice already. If you want to contact them, look at the list of vendors and you''ll find their details. In addition, in no particular order, you could try Dan Stair at Customgems, Dana at Mastercutgems, John at Gemrite and Jeff White at Whitesgems. If you like concave cuts then you could also try Richard at Concavegems.

The problem is that true red gems seem to always command a premium which is why the search you''ve set yourself isn''t the easiest!
 
Status
Not open for further replies. Please create a new topic or request for this thread to be opened.
Be a part of the community Get 3 HCA Results
Top