| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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Thank you for taking the time to write this all out - so many of a newcomers questions will be answered if they read this. I assume it will become a pinned thread. Thank you so much!
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| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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Fantastic wealth of information all wrapped up neatly in a perfect package! Thank you LD!
![]() (hopefully the mods will see this and make it a pinned thread on CS) |
| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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Well done LD!
This is an invaluable "in a nutshell" for newcomers and I truly think it should be required reading before posting in the CS forum - might save you, TL and a few others from having to repeat some information over and over. Someone coming to PS for advice may read one pinned thread such as this but won't research the forum because (often) they don't know what they need to know. Another request for mods to please pin this! |
| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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Starzin, it is already pinned.
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| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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Wow LD, thank you so much for this thread! I know nothing about colored gemstones but love them and am so glad to have this thread (and forum) as a reference.
When my dh and I were on our honeymoon in Italy (way before I discovered PS unfortunately) we foolishly bought a very expensive diamond aquamarine ring which has a huge window that I obviously didn't realize at the time. I was just in lala land during our honeymoon and fell in love with a very defective ring. So glad you started this thread to help other newbies not make the same mistake! |
| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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Fantastic clear, well written post LD.
Could I use this on my website? I'd give you the credits for it of course. |
| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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Yes of course Gene, I'd be honoured! I wrote it at speed yesterday and on reflection I've missed bits and could include a few more things. So please feel free to add/delete as you feel appropriate. Dear All - thank you for your kind comments. I do hope that this assists somebody new to coloured gemstones to get the best from their purchases and make informed decisions. If anybody thinks something has been omitted - please do add to this thread. |
| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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Great write up, LD. This is a good read for everyone new and old to PS so nobody has to rehash the same answers time and again.
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| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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LD, this is great. I thought of a couple of other segments that maybe can be added. I really don't feel comfortable doing it myself, as I know my knowlege is far surpassed by many on this forum. Perhaps we could add:
Brilliancy, what does it mean? How is a stones Refractive Index related to its brilliance? Followed by maybe an example, like how lavender Spinel is much more brilliant than a Rose-de-France Amethyst, even though they can be the same color. "Fire"of the gemstone, and what it actually is and how it can be measured (dispersion) and compared between stones. How some stones have very high natural dispersion (such as Demantoid) wheras some do not, and how color saturation will mask dispersion. Luster of the gemstone. This is one that I personally struggle with, as I am often told that stones with lesser RI's etc still perform very well because of their luster. What is luster? Is it a natural component of the makeup of the type of stone? Or does each stone have a specific "amount" of luster, case by case? Can luster be improved by things like cutting? Is it measurable like RI or dispersion? I think these are some examples of things a beginner would also want to understand, as it would help explain other reasons why it may be a better choice to go with that lavender Spinel over that Rose-de-France. Also, I would love someone who specializes in the jewelry side of gemstones (which I do not have a clue about!) write up some basic info about what color stones work with what metals and so on. For example, I learned on here that it is generally accepted that "warm" colored stones look better in yellow/rose gold, wheras "cold" colored stones look better in white or whiter metals. Why do some metals enhance some stones, and why do some take away? I understand much of this may be subjective, but there are some of you jewelry gurus that have reputations as experts and many would follow what you suggest. Maybe some basic thoughts could be written down as "basic suggestions" and so on. I'll defer to the rest of you to fill in the blanks in this post, to expand and give better definitions and examples, if anyone wants to take the time and effort to do it. I think LD has a great idea here in this post, I'd love to see it expanded upon somehow. Thanks LD et all. |
| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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This is a great idea and would be helpful if added However, from what I've observed on this forum, the following is just too subjective to be included as "facts" like the above. As a result, it does not belong in this thread.
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| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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I don't want to get too technical but will attempt to discuss the definition of brilliance and lustre.
Brilliance refers to the light that is reflected from the interior of a gem, meaning that the light reflected back to the eye is coloured, not white. In a well cut gem, most or all of the light that enters the stone will be reflected by the pavilion facets and returned to the eye through the crown of the stone. Good brilliance = the gemstone will be bursting with color from all angles. Poor brilliance = the gemstone will have areas of reduced colour. Extinction is the opposite of good brilliance. When the pavilion facets are cut with overly steep angles, the light reflected is reduced in intensity and appears dark aka extinction. When the pavilion facets are too shallow, light passes right through the stone and is not reflected back through the crown at all aka windowing (hence again, little brilliance or a dead center). Luster refers to the light reflected from the surface of a gem. All gems have luster (of varying categories) but only transparent stones have brilliance. Luster is broken down into the following: 1. Metallic 2. Submetallic 3. Vitreous or glass-like 4. Adamantine 5. Resinous 6. Silky 7. Pearly 8. Greasy 9. Pitchy 10. Waxy 11. Dull ETA I hope you aren't expecting me to fill in examples for each category, do you? If so, you'll have to wait for another day as I'm tired tonight.
Last edited by Chrono on April 26th, 2012, 12:20 am, edited 3 times in total.
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| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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I made an attempt to explain the relationship between refractive index and brilliance in a gemstone, then gave up. Instead, I managed to find an excellent article that explains it much more clearly than I could ever try. It might get a bit technical and mathematical for some in certain areas but I will cut and paste a few pertinent parts:
http://www.geo.utexas.edu/courses/347k/redesign/PDF_Handouts/Refraction_reflection_critical_angle_handout_updated_09.pdf Refractive index focuses on how light bends when entering a gem. Brilliance in gemstones reflects primarily how light exits the gem. Light leaving a gemstone either; 1) escapes and is refracted away from the normal or; 2) is completely reflected back into the stone. The most brilliant gemstones are those whose pavilion facets (bottom of the stone) act like mirrors, reflecting light back up through the table and crown (top of stone) to the eye. Gemstones whose pavilion facets behave as windows, passing light out the bottom of the stone, look dull and less brilliant. What determines whether light inside a gemstone will be internally reflected or pass through a facet? Two things; the angle at which it strikes the facet and the R.I. of the gemstone. |
| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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Unfortunately this is one area where you can't say "X" with any degree of certainty! I'm going to give you an example ...... I, personally, only like rose gold with pink stones (preferably pink diamonds, morganite, kunzite etc). For me, rose gold can enhance the "pinkness" of the gemstone and so you get a more enhanced overall pink appearance. TL uses rose gold with virtually everything! So who's right? We both are because we put together combinations that appeal to us! Generally speaking if you use white gold with a pale stone it will enhance the coldness and the end result may be a very cool icey looking piece of jewellery. If you team a warm vibrant gemstone with white gold it can provide a stunning contrast and because there is more of a contrast it doesn't detract from the warmness of the stone. Yellow gold typically suits warmer coloured gemstones and can enhance the richness. However, if you use yellow gold with paler stones the yellow can take over/reflect into the stone and may not look good. My advice is to get three pieces of metal (coins are good to use). White. Yellow. Rose. When you buy a gemstone, put it next to all three and take a photo of each one. Walk away and then review all the photos a few days later. One will probably appeal to you more than the others - that's the one to go with. Exceptions to any of the above are gemstones that shift or change in colour. Finding a metal that suits both colourways can be extremely problematic. Don't forget that skintone of the wearer plays a big part in all this. If you're buying for yourself, put the metal with the stone on your hand to take the photos. If your skintone looks realistic in the photo then you will be able to get a really good feel for whether it will suit you or not. There really are NO rules. It's all about personal preference. |
| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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LD, I'm really late to this post, but this is EXACTLY what a newbie needs when they want to venture into the CS world. Thank you for taking the time to write this! Bravo!!!
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| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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Can we include information on how to go about buying gemstones from wholesale sources?
Thanks, Erin |
| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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Thank you for this post, very helpful, and so well-written, I just enjoyed reading it!
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LD: thank you for taking the time to write up all that valuable information! I am (was) clueless about colored stones, even though I've wanted one for years, but now after reading your write-up I feel so much better about making a good choice in the future!!
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| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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This is not possible unless you are in the trade. |
| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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The following came about from the following thread by Roger Dery with regards to what types of stones are best suited for rings.
http://www.pricescope.com/forum/post3220969.html#p3220969 Mohs 9 - Ruby and Sapphire: generally considered the most durable of the colored gems. If untreated in any way, will hold up very well in most all situations. Even those subjected to 'high-heat-only' still do very well. Example: my wife's 2ct oval Sapphire engagement ring was worn daily for 15 years before needing a very minor tune-up. Exception: Ruby that has been filled with substances such as glass have a much lower resistance to damage such as abrasion from wear. Ruby, under high-heat-only with flux present, will also handle wear well. Mohs 8-1/2 - Chrysoberyl including Alexandrite: in my experience Chrysoberyl holds up very well against wear. It does not exhibit severe brittleness seen in other gems - and would be a great stone for regular wear as a ring stone. Mohs 8 - Spinel: is generally considered a gem that wears well. It is resistant to damage and not just damage from abrasion. Mohs 8 - Topaz: can be worn in rings, but some caution should be exhibited. This is especially true with Topaz colored blue because it has been irradiated [and then subsequently heated]. This process has weakened the stone in some way that it does not hold up as well as Precious Topaz - which may, or may not have been treated at all. Mohs 7-1/2-8 - the Beryl family including Aquamarine, Heliodore (golden Beryl), Morganite, Goshenite wear fairly well and unless totally exposed from the metal, can be worn in rings though may not be suitable for 'everyday wear'. The heating of any of the Beryl's is done at a low temperature and it is not a factor regarding their durability. Beryl's do have an element of brittleness though not as severe as some other gems. Mohs 7-1/2-8 - Emerald (of the Beryl family) is not well suited for everyday wear. A totally clean Emerald will hold up as well as an Aquamarine. But, finding an Emerald with that level of clarity is extremely rare. Roughly 99% of all Emeralds have been treated with a filler of some type to (usually) improve their clarity. The filler is likely to not hold up well over time. *Emerald's that have been treated should not be placed into an Ultrasonic cleaner, nor placed under a steam cleaner as this may affect the clarity enhancement substance. **Caveat: Emerald's treated with a specialized process known as "Excell" in the trade are known to have a higher level of durability over those treated with other methods. Mohs 7-1/2 - Andalusite has reasonable wearability though it does have a slight brittleness. Facet junctions are likely to show wear after only a few years regular wear. Distinct cleavage is present in Andalusite though I have yet to see the affects of it. Mohs 7-1/2 - Iolite in my experience holds up fairly well for hardness 7-1/2. It does, however, have distinct cleavage and a sharp blow in one or more specific directions may cause it to separate into more than one piece. Though, when I have tried to do this in the rough, I have not been successful. Mohs 7-7-1/2 - The Garnet group is generally thought of as reasonably durable. Facet junctions will show wear within the first few years of being worn. And, the facet junctions may not chip as much as 'crumble' for lack of a better way to describe this. Of the Garnets, the Andradite/Demantoid type is the least durable, and we have found the Pyrope/Almandine/Spessartite group seem to wear slightly better. Mohs 7-7-1/2 - The Tourmaline group is suitable for rings, though not for everyday wear especially if the top of the stone is exposed. Tourmaline can be brittle, does not hold up well where temperature changes are radical. They are known to 'chippy' as can be seen along facet junctions that are exposed. Mohs 6-1/2 to 7-1/2 - Zircon is often thought of as brittle. Zircons heated to high temperatures (over 1,000*C) to convert them to blue are definitely more brittle and show the effects of wear easily. Blue Zircon worn high on a mounting will need refurbishing regularly. Unheated Zircons and those subjected to much lower temperatures (of various colors) are less prone to show wear - and appear less brittle. There is no known dilemma with faceting or polishing Zircon for the experienced lapidary. There is, however, a known direction to its hardness which could create difficulty for some. Mohs 7 - The Quartz family is well known due to being available and popular. Its wear pattern is predictable. Facet junctions (even when faceting) can be 'chippy'. Chipping along the crown facets is common, and abrasions from wear are as well. *as a general rule, at least from me, I don't suggest wearing hardness less than 7 on a regular basis as the wear will become evident well before you expect it. I do suggest moving this type of gemstone into mountings offering great protection or off the fingers or wrist. Mohs 6-1/2 to 7 - Kunzite is not a durable gemstone. It is brittle, does not resist scratching well, does not repair easily, and has perfect cleavage in two directions. In addition to all that, it has the unfortunate problem of being light sensitive - reducing its depth of color with prolonged exposure to direct sunlight. I have repaired my fair share of Kunzite's and I don't relish the fact that they show up waiting for my handy work. But since they don't wear well over time, they will all eventually need reconditioning. Mohs 6-1/2 to 7 - Peridot does not share the fate of Kunzite, though its wear pattern is predictable. Abrasions are readily seen on exposed gems that are frequently worn - and fortunately, a refurbishing is not usually problematic. Mohs 6-1/2 to 7 - Tanzanite is very popular and goldsmiths have taken to mounting them in lavish and risky ways. Exposed surfaces will show wear in a relatively short time and the perfect cleavage can be a problem. Tanzanite is also heat sensitive - even though it is well known to have been heated to acquire the beautiful blue to purple hues. It is the shock of rapid temperature change that may cause damage. This is not a common situation with consumers as this is more likely to take placec in the creation or repair to a mounting. Mohs lower than 6-1/2 - Apatite, Opal, Orthoclase/Sunstone, Scapolite, Sphene and Sphalerite and other low hardness gems all need special care to be worn in rings. It is generally accepted that these gems are best suited for pendants, pins, brooches or earrings. |
| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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Chrono: I know that I cannot directly buy a stone if I am not a member of the trade. However, how does one buy a stone from a vendor such as pala? What I mean is, where and how does one find the middleperson to buy the stone? Must you be willing to commit to the setting with a jeweler before purchasing the stone? |
| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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Erin,
I understand your question better now that you have provided specific questions. For Pala, you can request that your local jeweller or online vendor of your choice contact Pala for pricing. Pala has a certain minimum markup for their inventory. Your jeweller or vendor will tack on their own markup on top of that, so choose your middle person wisely. You are under no obligation to commit to any setting with the jeweller before purchasing the stone (due to the markup they have already added). |
| Re: New to coloured gemstone buying? Read this first! |
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Hard stones are not necessarily tough stones. There is often the misconception that a high MOH score also means that the stone is able to resist blows as well as abrasion. Toughness is a measure of how much impact energy can be applied to weak points such as sharp edges of facets and corners of a gemstone without breaking. All faceted gemstones are brittle to some degree but other varieties will chip excessively even with proper care and set in a protective style setting.
Cleavage is a weakness due to the crystalline structure of the gem. It can have more than one cleavage plane which means that when enough pressure is applied in the right location, the stone will split into two (or more) pieces. The orientation and location of the cleavage can incrrease the possibility of chipping along some edges of the stone, regardless of its hardness. Corundum: No noticeable cleavage, is very tough and very hard. Chrysoberyl: No noticeable cleavage, is reasonably tough and very hard. Spinel: No noticeable cleavage, is very tough and very hard. The next few are not recomended for everyday wear rings with explanation to follow: Topaz: Has perfect basal cleavage, meaning it is likely to be damaged by a blow or when dropped on a hard surface. Thus it is best suited for an occasional wear ring. Garnet: Tough enough for use in rings but does not resist wear as well as those mentioned above. An exception is to be made for demantoid garnets which is quite low on the MOH scale. Zircon: Rather brittle and the artificially whitened zircons are especially prone to breakage when worn in rings. Beryl: Rather brittle so facet wear will show around the table area more easily. Tourmaline: Rather brittle and thus more likely to chip and show facet wear. Its toughess is rated as fair to poor. Kunzite: Pronounced cleavage so it is best not to set in a ring. Quartz: No pronouced cleavage and is fairly tough. In time, the facet edges will dull from friction with common dust (which is usually powdered quartz). Very little risk of fracture unless (like every other stone and diamond) the impact is severe. Stone with quartz basis like chalcedony, carnelian, agate, jasper and etc are tougher than clear crystallized quartz due to its internal structure. These type of waxy stones are very wearable. Jade: An exceedingly tough material and fairly hard, thus it is extremely wearable in almost every fashion. The reason for this toughness is due to its interlocking fibrous internal structure. This includes both jadeite and nephrite. Peridot: Rather soft for ring use and also prone to facet wear and chipping. Turquoise: Fairly tough material but is porous enough to absorb oil and other liquids which might affect its colour. Moonstone: Pronounced cleavage and lack of hardness means it is not a good candidate for a ring setting but as most are rather inexpensive, it may not matter. Opal: Soft, brittle and cracks easily. Will require repolishing over time if worn in a ring. |