Ebay auctions w/ private offer. Pro or Cons?

[Lee Little]

Hi Lady Disdain,
That is really not right that they took back the money, basically it is stealing.
Now you also have time invested in recovering it which they should have to pay for but won't, of course.
My buddy lost $2800 on the sale of a gold ring, or at least Pay Pal lost it since his account was near zero balance when the customer pulled the money back. I think he dropped his PP account but that caused money losses too, probably worse.
I was paid for a large amount through Western Union this month as the customer had a Pay pal problem, boy was that nice. Picked it up in the post office where I had to go anyways, 3 minutes of ID and paperwork and I had no worries the money would suddenly disappear. Best regards, Lee

 

[Lee Little]

Johnfish,
I also experience the same thing as you do with general online purchases, not just eBay. I recall trying to buy a very specific CD about 3 months ago, scoured the net, finally found it, paid for it, only to be told shortly afterwards that the item is no longer available. This occured with several vendors. Those vendors are not the "fly by night" type either. In the end, I had to get the CD from an individual seller, and not a store. I don't think this issue is limited to the vendor having several stores but having such a huge inventory that it is difficult to keep everything up to date sometimes.

Thanks Chrono for the reminder, I had neglected deleting listings in Etsy that sold on eBay for a couple a days. I try to remember to do it as soon as I see a sale in either store as my Etsy and eBay are nearly duplicated. Have only had a problem once but that was when one customer bought it from both stores, hoping to get two of them. I feel a little funny duplicating but I used to have only certain items in one store and then others listed in the other but that was difficult to keep organized and was inefficient. Now my office girl just copies and paste from eBay to Etsy and uses the same pictures. Way less time involved in adding listings to Etsy as it does take a lot of time to take pictures and write decent descriptions from scratch. Since every item is unique there are little short cuts to making listings like many sellers enjoy such as in electronics, books etc. Some folks are very loyal to Etsy and hate eBay, others love eBay and never heard of Etsy. Since I want to give as much selection as possible to each group, the duplication makes sense to me.
I used to have 3 duplicated sites and some folks have half a dozen including their own web site but my brain could not keep up with three. Best regards, Lee

 

[Lee Little]

Lady Disdain wrote "eBay has, if you think about it, a very strange format for an auction, because of the online setting. The viewing and bidding periods are combined. The auction ends at a set time, instead of when there are no more bids, enabling sniping."

Great point! I always loved going to live auctions but online auctions are not the same for me. I do not like the hidden bids on eBay as it is not honest. Here is why: I was bidding on a stone that was being auctioned by a personal friend (technically according to ebay, that is shilling simply because I knew him but I was really trying to buy it, not just run up the price). I put in a bid for $50 and won it for 99 cents. Basically hurt him. Had I not bid he would have got to keep it as I was the only bid. I was ready to pay $50 and in a live auction I would have and likely others would have then jumped in due to 'perceived value' so he would netted a profit instead of a hard loss. I felt like a thief. Of course, part of the risk of having an auction is a bidder 'getting a steal' but I do not like the feeling, especially since I never bid 99 cents and my honest bid was $50.
Continuing with Lady Disdains point, what fun it would be if there was a 3 day viewing period when you could not bid then the actual auction would begin at an announced time and would go until there were no more bids for a period of 15 minutes. Each bid would be the exact price the bidder typed in, no reserve bidding.
One of my techniques in live auctions is to bid a way bigger number than where the bidding is currently at, stopping the other bidders in their tracks. This could also work in this 'live online auction'.
Best regards, Lee

 

[LD]

I understand the disappointment but think of it another way...... Let's say you're a seller, you have several eBay stores and a number of your own outlets (ie shop, own Internet site) etc. Would you limit your sales by only placing one item on one selling forum? Highly doubtful. So, somebody goes into the shop or your own website and buys a stone but due to time lag or other issues, it is entirely possible that you may end up with two buyers. It's unfortunate but is business. What I would be angry about is if I had parted with money OR not had an immediate refund.

I buy from a number of sellers who also sell on ebay but I dont buy on there as it may be more beneficial for me to buy in another way. It works both ways. I'm sure my purchases have on occasion gazzumped others and I have also lost out.

On a world wide selling arena, time lags will happen where updates are not immediate or somebody has just forgotten to update inventory accurately. It's life and happens to most vendors at some point if they have multiple outlets

 

[Lee Little]

I buy from a number of sellers who also sell on ebay but I dont buy on there as it may be more beneficial for me to buy in another way. It works both ways. I'm sure my purchases have on occasion gazzumped others and I have also lost out.

Hi LD,
You are smart as most sellers with any volume have an outlet they sell on that they will sell for less on that they will sell for on eBay. Sellers use eBay because of the high traffic but eBay eats about 10% which can add up. I buy from several vendors thru their emails that also sell on ebay and they always give me a better deal by dealing directly. Of course I am then out from under the almighty safety umbrella of eBay.

 

[johnfish]

The idea of the item being posted in several places is disingenuous. Is this the only way a small volume bisuness can make it in this economic environment? I understand that there is a big plus in having the traffic that ebay can generate but that is the reason you are paying the fees that ebay requires. I just see it as bad business ethics to sell it from two different locations. It is technically ripping ebay off because you are getting free advertising and you are also hurting the customers that try to buy it legitimately through ebay. If you want to sell through ebay then sell through ebay. If you want to sell through another store front, sell through another store front. Dont offer the same item at both places because it is unethical (even if it is physically possible to do this). In the end if sellers want to do this it is up to them. But for me as a buyer I will research who I am purchasing from very carefully and not buy from sellers that are using these business practices.

John

 

[Lee Little]

Hi John,
Listing an item on ebay, Etsy, Amazon etc means that a seller is advertising the item for sale. The listing is quite simply an ad. The ad is a product that is already paid for by the seller. It is not a commitment to sell on a single site. Many companies place ads on TV, radio, newspapers, list online,, make fliers etc and nobody says it is in any way wrong to use multi-media for advertising. Best regards, Lee

 

[LD]

The idea of the item being posted in several places is disingenuous. Is this the only way a small volume bisuness can make it in this economic environment? I understand that there is a big plus in having the traffic that ebay can generate but that is the reason you are paying the fees that ebay requires. I just see it as bad business ethics to sell it from two different locations. It is technically ripping ebay off because you are getting free advertising and you are also hurting the customers that try to buy it legitimately through ebay. If you want to sell through ebay then sell through ebay. If you want to sell through another store front, sell through another store front. Dont offer the same item at both places because it is unethical (even if it is physically possible to do this). In the end if sellers want to do this it is up to them. But for me as a buyer I will research who I am purchasing from very carefully and not buy from sellers that are using these business practices.

John

I fundamentally disagree. You can buy items in large high street stores that also have websites - that's no different. High end jewellers often have one off pieces on their website and the same piece in their shop. Why is having a shop and an Ebay store any different? It's most definitely NOT bad business ethics. It's being commercially savvy.

You are seeing this purely from a buyer's perspective. Whilst your suggested way forward is superb for the buyer it is dreadful for businesses.

Why would anybody pay a listing fee for items if they didn't want to sell on Ebay? If the item sells elsewhere without the fees then that makes commercial sense to the vendor.

 

[Lee Little]

It is technically ripping ebay off because you are getting free advertising and you are also hurting the customers that try to buy it legitimately through ebay.
John

Hi again John,
I just wanted to add that there is normally no such thing as free advertising on eBay as vendors do pay for the ads unless ebay is running a special on a certain day for a certain format but normally they charge for every ad whether it sells or not. Best regards, Lee

 

[johnfish]

LD, I never thought of ebay as a listing site. I always thought of it as an auction house but I guess that is not realistic. I do look at things from a buyers perspective as I have never been on the other side except form selling one or two items years ago. I will try to look at it from both points of view and talk to the sellers directly instead of attempting to bid or use BIN from now on. So as not to rehash things already and not to alienate anyone (I hope I havent already!) I will refain from further comment. Thank you again LD for helping me understnad this better and seeing it from both sides.

John

 

[LD]

LD, I never thought of ebay as a listing site. I always thought of it as an auction house but I guess that is not realistic. I do look at things from a buyers perspective as I have never been on the other side except form selling one or two items years ago. I will try to look at it from both points of view and talk to the sellers directly instead of attempting to bid or use BIN from now on. So as not to rehash things already and not to alienate anyone (I hope I havent already!) I will refain from further comment. Thank you again LD for helping me understnad this better and seeing it from both sides.

John

John if it's any consolation I'm a buyer (not a seller - apart from rare occasions) so I really do empathise. I'm sure you haven't alienated anybody. It's fine to have strong opinions!

 

[Lee Little]

Hi John,
No harm, no foul, your opinions and ideas are very welcome. I am always interested in how people think. My comments are not meant to be personal at all, either. Best regards, Lee

 

[johnfish]

You gotta love this site. A free exchange of ideas and issues!

 

[beau-wy]

I've been selling on Ebay since 1999. Mostly good experiences. I wish eBay would institute an end of auction delay when active bids have been received - for me, sniping programs are a huge disincentive to sell at true auction items of high value. I still do on occasion, but would do a lot more. Some other sites extend the auction end for a set period after the last bid (5 minutes, 15 minutes), making it comparable to a real auction.

I will not end an auction hat has received bids, and while dubiously permissible, I don't think it is a good or ethical business practice. An exception would be a reserve price auction where a bid has been made but the reserve not reached, as no commitment has been made. However, until someone has made a commitment to buy - even for $0.99 on a no-reserve auction - I absolutely believe it is the seller's prerogative to sell any stone of theirs, in any manner they can. I sympathize with the person watching an auction who "thought" they had more time to make a decision on bidding, but I have none for the person who wanted to try to "snipe" the auction in the last few seconds at the opening bid price, and is disappointed the seller ended the auction early.

Ebay is not a true auction, thanks to the selling policies that allow sniping the auction, and both buyers and sellers need to recognize the difference. One way to reduce that potential is to place a bid when you find what you would like to have; that still doesn't address the practice of sellers ending an auction with bids on it.

If ebay would institute an end of auction delay when bids are received, and penalize sellers who end an auction that has received bids, it would be a far-improved venue.

 

[Lee Little]

I like the idea of the extra time added after bids, it would make a better playground. Best regards, Lee

 

[T L]

I like the idea of the extra time added after bids, it would make a better playground. Best regards, Lee

I could see that upsetting bidders though. Many snipe, that's just the name of the game. If the vendor is upset about that, then perhaps they should set a reserve. I have noticed on highly desired gems, people do bid early in the process, and do not snipe. I would never get upset with a seller if I planned on sniping, and he sold the auction listing early. My fault for not bidding early on I guess.

 

[Lee Little]

Hi TL,
Setting a reserve cost money. The idea of a more fair playing field should not entertain extra fees, should it? Best regards, Lee

 

[beau-wy]

I like the idea of the extra time added after bids, it would make a better playground. Best regards, Lee

I could see that upsetting bidders though. Many snipe, that's just the name of the game. If the vendor is upset about that, then perhaps they should set a reserve. I have noticed on highly desired gems, people do bid early in the process, and do not snipe. I would never get upset with a seller if I planned on sniping, and he sold the auction listing early. My fault for not bidding early on I guess.

I agree TL, was just pointing out I would list far more "true" auctions if sniping was out. I don't mind the reserve auction fee, but many bidders seem to find reserves off-putting. I can assure you, though I only rarely end an auction early for a direct sale that has watchers but no bidders - some of those would-be snipers get very upset and feel they have been cheated, judging from some of the messages I've received .

Like I said, overall eBay has been a very good experience for me. And, as I also buy on occasion, I am not above sniping another seller's offering!

 

[T L]

I like the idea of the extra time added after bids, it would make a better playground. Best regards, Lee

I could see that upsetting bidders though. Many snipe, that's just the name of the game. If the vendor is upset about that, then perhaps they should set a reserve. I have noticed on highly desired gems, people do bid early in the process, and do not snipe. I would never get upset with a seller if I planned on sniping, and he sold the auction listing early. My fault for not bidding early on I guess.

I agree TL, was just pointing out I would list far more "true" auctions if sniping was out. I don't mind the reserve auction fee, but many bidders seem to find reserves off-putting. I can assure you, though I only rarely end an auction early for a direct sale that has watchers but no bidders - some of those would-be snipers get very upset and feel they have been cheated, judging from some of the messages I've received .

Like I said, overall eBay has been a very good experience for me. And, as I also buy on occasion, I am not above sniping another seller's offering!

Beau, Lee,
You have valid points. I'm speaking strictly in terms of a buyer, as I've never sold on ebay, but I have bought from ebay in all sort of methods, auctions, BIN, offers, etc. . . for many years. I don't understand your frustrations as sellers, so I'm sorry for that.