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Choosing a sapphire....online?! Help!

swampdonkey

Rough_Rock
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
20
So I am looking at this stone.

http://www.thenaturalsapphirecompany.com/sapphires/c-5-blue-sapphires/p-54204-round-blue-sapphire-b5794/

Personally, I like deeper color in a sapphire...a preference is admittedly based on a few images and very little actual knowledge of what constitutes a decent stone. I started looking at this site thenaturalsapphirecompany, based on a recommendation from this site in a prior post. The problem is, I have no idea how this stone will look in person or in a setting. Please weigh in and let me know if:

1. This is too small for an engagement ring.
2. This stone is too dark. Also, if you have experience with the color accuracy of this site's images or if you have first hand experience buying these stones online...your feedback will be particularly valuable.
3. I can see some asymmetry in the cut...I think? Will this be noticeable in the setting?

Obviously, I want the stone to be immediately recognizable as a sapphire and I want a rich color. I can certainly spend more, so there is room in the budget if there are considerations I should make regarding the stone itself. I know my would-be fiancé loves sapphires and would love a sapphire engagement ring, but I am just starting to learn about the gems. Would it be best for me to look at some in person before considering an online purchase?

Any advice is welcome.
 

swampdonkey

Rough_Rock
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
20
Ok....you know that sticky about colored gemstones, "read this first". Yeah...I didn't do that. I'm learning now. Feedback still welcome...I see some extinction though? Extinctions?
 

pregcurious

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 18, 2009
Messages
6,724
swampdonkey|1411005613|3752888 said:
1. This is too small for an engagement ring.
2. This stone is too dark. Also, if you have experience with the color accuracy of this site's images or if you have first hand experience buying these stones online...your feedback will be particularly valuable.
3. I can see some asymmetry in the cut...I think? Will this be noticeable in the setting?

Any advice is welcome.

See as many sapphires as you can in person.

Here is one of the best sapphires, based on trade ideal color, here on PS. It is owned by silksapphire. It is good to know what trade ideal is because anything that deviates from that should be priced lower.

silk_sapphire.png
 

ephsea

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jan 9, 2014
Messages
181
When viewing stones from the Natural Sapphire Company, be sure to click on the "3-D interactive stone". It's a very handy tool that loads up a precise diagram of the cut, letting you see how completely awful and wonky it is. This stone appears to have been cut by unskilled labor working with primitive equipment, like most of the gems from that vendor.
 

swampdonkey

Rough_Rock
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
20
I appreciate the input. Again, this is based on nothing, but I would prefer to have a stone that is the result of a more natural process, so I was leaning towards and untreated stone. Any ideas what vendors might provide natural stones with better cut quality?
 

chrono

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 22, 2004
Messages
38,227
Budget?
Shape?
Mm size requirement?

Vendors typically carry an assortment of stones (not specialized in unheated), so you'll have to look through their inventory for the right one.
 

treasurehunter

Brilliant_Rock
Trade
Joined
Nov 26, 2013
Messages
611
Buying sapphires online, very difficult.
That sapphire looks pretty good but because its origin is Australia I have big doubts about it being over dark
 
S

SparkliesLuver

Guest
Wild Fish Gems is known for untreated gems; however, ask for more pictures in various lighting conditions. And be willing to pay more.
http://wildfishgems.com/

Otherwise, like Chrono said, you just have to search through each vendor's inventory.
 

Starzin

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Sep 26, 2011
Messages
1,850
swampdonkey|1411006009|3752892 said:
Ok....you know that sticky about colored gemstones, "read this first". Yeah...I didn't do that. I'm learning now. Feedback still welcome...I see some extinction though? Extinctions?
:lol: :lol: Well at least you're now caught up!
And what you're seeing is not extinction but the true (blackish blue) colour of the stone.

As to the NSC sapphire-
1. (If) This is too small for an engagement ring.
The dimensions are 5.68L x 5.59W x 3.38H which means it isn't round, rather it's closer to a roval. A round sapphire should have only two measurements diameter x depth. A 6mm sapphire would be fine for an engagement ring.

2. (If)This stone is too dark. Also, if you have experience with the color accuracy of this site's images or if you have first hand experience buying these stones online...your feedback will be particularly valuable.
I would say yes. I've attached it for reference. Australian sapphires are renowned for being "inky" - see the dark patches? That's probably the colour you will see most of the time over all of the stone which means the small window won't be noticeable. It is strongly lit for photography and I think this will look like a black blob.

3. I can see some asymmetry in the cut...I think? Will this be noticeable in the setting?
Keep looking, there are better ones out there.

Absolutely look at sapphires in person to see how the different colours perform. Facets wink on and off as they reflect light or not but overall the colour should be blue, even and pleasing.

If you answer Chrono's questions there are many sets of eyes here to help you search :))

nsc-sapphire.png
 

Niel

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
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Jul 23, 2012
Messages
19,631
The gem trader has some nice sapphires in your range if Tue pics are accurate. A cushion and a pear. One in the normal section one in the September drop part.

I'd ask him which is closer to trade ideal. If you're interested in those shapes. Either could make amazing three stones.
 

swampdonkey

Rough_Rock
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
20
Starzin|1411046433|3753098 said:
swampdonkey|1411006009|3752892 said:
Ok....you know that sticky about colored gemstones, "read this first". Yeah...I didn't do that. I'm learning now. Feedback still welcome...I see some extinction though? Extinctions?
:lol: :lol: Well at least you're now caught up!
And what you're seeing is not extinction but the true (blackish blue) colour of the stone.

As to the NSC sapphire-
1. (If) This is too small for an engagement ring.
The dimensions are 5.68L x 5.59W x 3.38H which means it isn't round, rather it's closer to a roval. A round sapphire should have only two measurements diameter x depth. A 6mm sapphire would be fine for an engagement ring.

2. (If)This stone is too dark. Also, if you have experience with the color accuracy of this site's images or if you have first hand experience buying these stones online...your feedback will be particularly valuable.
I would say yes. I've attached it for reference. Australian sapphires are renowned for being "inky" - see the dark patches? That's probably the colour you will see most of the time over all of the stone which means the small window won't be noticeable. It is strongly lit for photography and I think this will look like a black blob.

3. I can see some asymmetry in the cut...I think? Will this be noticeable in the setting?
Keep looking, there are better ones out there.

Absolutely look at sapphires in person to see how the different colours perform. Facets wink on and off as they reflect light or not but overall the colour should be blue, even and pleasing.

If you answer Chrono's questions there are many sets of eyes here to help you search :))

Many thanks for this! I will definitely look at some in person and will leverage the community here to help me out. I will check out Wild Fish also and continue searching other vendors. Any other references to reputable sources are welcome.

Thanks to all!
 

chrono

Super_Ideal_Rock
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swampdonkey

Rough_Rock
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
20
http://www.gemfix.com/sapphire_blue.html#thumb


At the above page...F3. Find numbers 1121, 1160, 1155 and 1089. A bit of a range of colors. I'm gravitating towards round cuts obviously.

Thoughts on cut and the vendor? These are only photographed from above so symmetry is very difficult to judge. I could always snag a couple or three of them and return my less favored, I suppose.
 

Starzin

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Sep 26, 2011
Messages
1,850
Find numbers 1121, 1160, 1155 and 1089. A bit of a range of colors. I'm gravitating towards round cuts obviously.
I can't find any glaring warnings with any of these except that 1121 might be a tad dark in hand. I think you've made good choices so ring and talk to Andrew's wife who can talk you through what to do next.

The lighter Sri Lankan stones tend to shift a bit from blue to violet from the experience of others here, so be prepared for that.

People are often referred to Gemfix (particularly by me) because Andrew usually has a good range and provides all the information up front to decide whether to inquire further.

He does not provide extra photos/videos but is quite happy to discuss the differences if you are trying to decide between two stones and is very amenable to the multiple stone approval process.

You will have to pay for all of the stones up front and abide by the return policy - please read it!
 

swampdonkey

Rough_Rock
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
20
My plan right now is try and enter a jewelry store under false pretense and try and wind up talking casually about rings. Hopefully this will advise me as to cut and setting preferences. I will update this thread later once I am on the verge of purchase. Many thanks to all!
 

Starzin

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Sep 26, 2011
Messages
1,850
Just try to avoid all the bad cuts, windows and inky blobs they'll try and sell you ;))

We look forward to hearing how your expedition goes!
 

digdeep

Brilliant_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 14, 2013
Messages
877
Oh and "natural" stones does NOT mean that they aren't diffused, treated or otherwise affected by human interventions...........the truly natural stones are those that are (certified) UNTREATED......
 

LD

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 29, 2008
Messages
10,224
NSC is not one of our go to vendors I'm afraid. Although I'm sure people have bought quite happily from them, over the years there's been more negativity than positivity from consumers. Having said that, the sapphire you're looking at is very affordable but that's because (a) it is dark (b) there are areas of zoning that can be clearly seen when the gem rotates - patches of what looks like colour that has run - which will/may become an annoyance to the wearer and (c) the cut which is a bit wonky.

I would second all of the other suggestions for sapphires and vendors for you to approach.

In terms of size this sapphire is approximately the same size as a 1ct diamond and this is a typical size for an engagement ring (probably mainly due to cost restraints as well). Depending on your intended's finger size, it can either look huge or small! If you look at her hands, does she have long slim fingers or are they small and podgy? The podgier the finger the smaller the gemstone will look. Also, bear in mind the final design you want. If you are going to have accent stones then a 6mm stone is a good choice. If you are going for a solitaire then you may be able to increase the size comfortably.
 

swampdonkey

Rough_Rock
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
20
Well, she is rather small. She has little hands so I don't want something that will look ridiculously large, but that's why I want to go and maybe just see her ogle some rings. I can get a feel for what she likes and what looks good on her. I think I can pull off an excursion that doesn't raise any flags and then I can pick a stone from a reputable vendor and setting that will suit her. Will update as it developes.
 

swampdonkey

Rough_Rock
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
20
ok...I have been looking for a stone since starting this thread...I finally found it. It was perfect, it was cushion rather than round, but I loved the life the high crown gave it. Then I went to click the add to cart button and this guy had already bought it!

https://www.pricescope.com/forum/co...ire-solitaire-engagement-ring-t210122-60.html

I am looking for a stone this color, with this kind of sparkle. I applaud sapphire hunter for pulling the trigger on it, because i's beautiful. I have searched the last two days for a similar stone, but having no luck. I would consider a stone of any origin and heat treatment is now up for trade. If you see one like this please post it here if you get a chance.

Round or cushion with a high crown preferable
1-2cts
flexible on color to a degree, but the slightly lighter than medium blue (I guess denim) of this stone is what I had in mind.

http://mastercutgems.com/images/gems/31015.jpg
 

swampdonkey

Rough_Rock
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
20
ok...I have been looking for a stone since starting this thread...I finally found it. It was perfect, it was cushion rather than round, but I loved the life the high crown gave it. Then I went to click the add to cart button and this guy had already bought it!

https://www.pricescope.com/forum/co...ire-solitaire-engagement-ring-t210122-60.html

I am looking for a stone this color, with this kind of sparkle. I applaud sapphire hunter for pulling the trigger on it, because i's beautiful. I have searched the last two days for a similar stone, but having no luck. I would consider a stone of any origin and heat treatment is now up for trade. If you see one like this please post it here if you get a chance.

Round or cushion with a high crown preferable
1-2cts
flexible on color to a degree, but the slightly lighter than medium blue (I guess denim) of this stone is what I had in mind.

http://mastercutgems.com/images/gems/31015.jpg
 

pregcurious

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 18, 2009
Messages
6,724
What about this one on Gemfix:

Montana Sapphire Cushion "Rhapsody" Cut
Weight: 1.32cts
Measurements: 5.9x5.8mm, depth 4.4mm
Clarity: VVS
Origin: Montana, USA
Enhancements: Heat only
Price: $ 1185.00
Order/Stock No.: sapphire_montana_523
Description: Very sparkly and clean, well cut. Medium-deep blue with no greenish tint in daylight or incandescent.
(Cut by Andrew Gulij)
No Pantone match

sapphire_montana_523.jpg
 

swampdonkey

Rough_Rock
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
20
Ok...I looked at that one, but felt it wasn't a bright enough blue. I bought this one...

sapphire_montana_462_1.jpg

I will see how the size looks when it comes and go from there. There was one other Montana cushion that looked like it might work and one Ceylon that looked pretty nice, but not as flashy. Ultimately, I am just indulging my perfectionist side, but I know well that she will love any of these. Any thoughts on this one?
 

swampdonkey

Rough_Rock
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
20
I purchased the stone you see above. In my prior response, I guess I meant it wasn't a vivid enough blue rather than, "bright enough". I reviewed a Ceylon that was a much more brilliant stone with consistent color and I just found the character of the Montana to be overwhelming. It can appear icey, royal, and violet in different lighting conditions. My only complaint is that when not in strong lighting conditions, it can become completely flat deep blue....it loses its transparency in a sense.

I almost looked at another lighter colored Montana, but ultimately kind of had a bond with this stone because I spent about two hours on the road in the late afternoon/evening just looking at it. Even though the Ceylon was more brilliant, I kept taking this stone in its little transparent case and holding it in different positions in the car and as the light faded from strong Florida sunshine to dusk. As I wound my way back home, the changing light kept presenting new colors in the stone and I was genuinely captivated by it. Finally, any rock that can be captivating for that long must be the one. I barely looked at the Ceylon by comparison.

I have to say, if I ever buy a loose stone again (which I think i will for an anniversary or something), I will make every effort to work with Gemfix. I know this isn't a review and hope this isn't breaking forum rules to say that Andrew is the bomb dot com. He spent a long time with me on the phone and was unbelievably helpful.
 

chrono

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Apr 22, 2004
Messages
38,227
I appreciate your coming back with a review of your experience. I agree that Montana sapphires behave differently from "regular" blue sapphires in that they are shiftier, as you observed. They are great outdoors but just about every one that I've seen become steely or icy indoors, some almost losing all colour. It is a stone that one either loves or hates type of deal. Congrats on finding the right stone for you. :wavey:
 
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