4 ct sapphire to good to be true?

[chrono]

I see flipping as buying a stone from the original owner to resell with the intent to make a profit. To me, it makes no difference whether the current seller has the stone in hand or doesn't. Nothing wrong with this practice at all and although I have strong opinions on this, this is not the avenue for it.

 

[T L]

TL, I don't have the same definition of flipping as you. I'm not sure what you would call what you described, which is not owning the stone at all. I used the word flipping like people flip houses. They buy them, improve them, and sell them quickly.

I understand. In that case, then almost every gemstone vendor is a flipper because they buy the cut stone from a source, and resell. The time frame for how long it takes to sell them shouldn't make a difference, but they often immediately put the gem on the market. Lapidaries are different because they actually cut the stones from rough they purchase from a source, and therefore it becomes a new product by virtue of a cut.

In either case, whatever the definition may be I don't have a problem with flipping, as long as there is a decent return policy and the stone is as advertised.

 

[chrono]

I see flipping as buying a stone from the original owner to resell with the intent to make a profit. To me, it makes no difference whether the current seller has the stone in hand or doesn't. Nothing wrong with this practice at all and although I have strong opinions on this, this is not the avenue for it.

ETA
Original owner = non trade person.

 

[Circe]

From what I can tell, Jim has the stone listed for the same price as the original vendor. I'm not seeing a problem here.

 

[T L]

From what I can tell, Jim has the stone listed for the same price as the original vendor. I'm not seeing a problem here.

It's slightly more expensive via Jim, but not by much. It was $600/ct via MC.com.

I still think its a good deal. Very nice stone.

I know one well known dealer that would buy gems from a certain lapidary and mark them up 500%. Not saying who. He still had a right to do that, dealers can charge whatever they want.

 

[pregcurious]

From what I can tell, Jim has the stone listed for the same price as the original vendor. I'm not seeing a problem here.

It's slightly more expensive via Jim, but not by much. It was $600/ct via MC.com.

I still think its a good deal. Very nice stone.

I know one well known dealer that would buy gems from a certain lapidary and mark them up 500%. Not saying who. He still had a right to do that, dealers can charge whatever they want.

I completely agree. I never said there was a problem, nor a high markup.

Again, I am using the term like it is used in the US for real estate. I do not think that all gem stone selling is flipping. If someone is purchasing from a true wholesaler, and selling it, I would not consider it flipping. If I see a stone move from one public vendor to another (and it disappears from the original vendors site like this one did, implying a purchase), I consider it a flip. I know there are Americans who know what I'm talking about here. It's a very common term.

There is no high markup, as anyone who has followed this thread can see. If I had had issues with the stone or the price, I would have said it.

Anyway, back to my original point. The stone is now available through another vendor. I thought the vendor would appreciate the advertisement, but I guess I did not do it in the right "way" to please everyone. I for one considered buying the stone after it was returned. It's also available on Loupe Troop.

 

[Marlow]

TL, I don't have the same definition of flipping as you. I'm not sure what you would call what you described, which is not owning the stone at all. I used the word flipping like people flip houses. They buy them, improve them, and sell them quickly.

I understand. In that case, then almost every gemstone vendor is a flipper because they buy the cut stone from a source, and resell. The time frame for how long it takes to sell them shouldn't make a difference, but they often immediately put the gem on the market. Lapidaries are different because they actually cut the stones from rough they purchase from a source, and therefore it becomes a new product by virtue of a cut.

In either case, whatever the definition may be I don't have a problem with flipping, as long as there is a decent return policy and the stone is as advertised.

But this is the market - if I see a rare gem I don't need and know somebody who is interested I buy it and sell!! Only close friends pay the same I paid. In Munich most of the buiness is done before the show starts on saturday for the puplic - it took me a long time and work for our club to be able to visit the show on Wednesday and Thursday - vendor from US come only on these days - bring ordered stones and some new and these stones are offered the next days. A show with 90% flipper- a win win situation for the flipper, the vendor and the often for the buyer too.

I bought a lot a some rare gems and sold it 2 minutes later - 20 meter away. Made small money but o.k.! Many vendors have to stay at their booth - I can walk around and if see something I buy it and sell or get a discount...

 

[ilovegemstones]

There's a very similar stone for sale at the Facebook site "Fine Faceted Gems & Cabs Market" to the one originally posted here from Multicolour. It is for sale for $3000.

Is it the same stone?

Honestly?

Jim is very clever!!! I remember a lavender Luc Yen spinel from the Gem Trader - a pear! The buyer discussed it here and send it back - I would have to pay three times more here in Europe!!!! Returned course it was not blue enough!
A big fault!!! A fantastic gem!!! Clean Luc Yen in lavender and blue are extremely expensive here.

The sapphire was a great deal too....

My advice - talk to us - I would honestly say whether to keep a gem or not!

Marlow, I actually returned that stone earlier on and am happy I did, even if it was a good deal. I just didn't fall in love with it in person and it wasn't for me. No regrets.

 

[Marlow]

There's a very similar stone for sale at the Facebook site "Fine Faceted Gems & Cabs Market" to the one originally posted here from Multicolour. It is for sale for $3000.

Is it the same stone?

Honestly?

Jim is very clever!!! I remember a lavender Luc Yen spinel from the Gem Trader - a pear! The buyer discussed it here and send it back - I would have to pay three times more here in Europe!!!! Returned course it was not blue enough!
A big fault!!! A fantastic gem!!! Clean Luc Yen in lavender and blue are extremely expensive here.

The sapphire was a great deal too....

My advice - talk to us - I would honestly say whether to keep a gem or not!

Marlow, I actually returned that stone earlier on and am happy I did, even if it was a good deal. I just didn't fall in love with it in person and it wasn't for me. No regrets.

Absolutely o.k.!!! But please believe me - this was an offer for help!! A vendor has always some gems which are to cheap and some which are to expensive - this one was a very good deal. And you see Jim bought it - top size and very good cutting and a color many love.

I understand it also with the Luc Yen - she needed another stone but to send such a stone back ...

And please forgive me - it was and is an offer for help !

 

[ilovegemstones]

No worries! I really appreciate the honest opinions here. The Luc Yen just wasn't right with me but I have found so many others that are right thanks to pointers from this forum

 

[Marlow]

I am sooo stupid

YOU returned the Luc Yen.....

Nono I understand why but it is impossible to get this quality here - there is no vendor here who offers them except some tiny stones.

Next time!!! Which stone did you buy instead???

And sorrysorrysorrysorry!!!

 

[pregcurious]

Thanks, Elvis.

I actually don't have issues with vendors doing what TL described, but I can see how you would not want to be accused of doing if that is not your practice. Isn't that how many diamonds are sold? A lot of sites advertise the same stones, with different prices. You can even find the same stone, based on the GIA report #. I think this works for diamonds because they are more of a commodity than colored stones. The issue, however, is that not all vendors are created the same, and some will have better customer service than others.

Marlow, what Luc Yen stone? Was it mentioned in this thread? I love Luc Yen spinels, but don't own one myself. I always think of Chrono's.

EDIT: Edited for clarity.

 

[liao]

what's wrong with flipping? I do not think flipping is unethical

Thanks, Elvis.

I actually don't have issues with TL's definition of flipping. Isn't that how many diamonds are sold? A lot of sites advertise the same stones, with different prices. You can even find the same stone, based on the GIA report #. I think this works for diamonds because they are more of a commodity than colored stones. The issue, however, is that not all vendors are created the same, and some will have better customer service than others.

Marlow, what Luc Yen stone? Was it mentioned in this thread? I love Luc Yen spinels, but don't own one myself. I always think of Chrono's.

There are a lot of gemstone being produced in Luc Yen, but I think he is talking about Luc Yen spinel. pregcurious, how about the stone in your display picture? it is red spinel right? is it mahenge or luc yen or some other spinel? A nice stone you got there looks like 'pure' red hue spinel

 

[Marlow]

http://www.thegemtrader.com/Nov12VSpinelPage.htm

Love this color - next to "windex" blue cobalt spinel. http://www.kingdomofredspinels.com/showdetail_pro.asp?product_id=616

Mahenge and Namya pinks and hot pink and Luc Yen lavender and blue - absolutely unique and I promise - these color climb and continue to climb.

Luc Yen produces not very much large stones like Mahenge - esp. clean stones....

In Munich I saw one small bright lavenderblue piece - I will get it together with a small cobalt and the russian alexandrite...

 

[liao]

http://www.thegemtrader.com/Nov12VSpinelPage.htm

Love this color - next to "windex" blue cobalt spinel.

Mahenge and Namya pinks and hot pink and Luc Yen lavender and blue - absolutely unique and I promise - these color climb and continue to climb.

Luc Yen produces not very much large stones like Mahenge - esp. clean stones....

In Munich I saw one small bright lavenderblue piece - I will get it together with a small cobalt and the russian alexandrite...

wow! what kind of russian alexandrite are we talking here? is it the mighty green to red/pinkish-red/purplish-red? I have only seen less than 10 green to red alexandrite for the last 15 years

 

[Marlow]

You have to wait a bit - a small EC - good change - a visible twinned stone...

 

[ilovegemstones]

Marlow, you are funny! I bought a 2.82 unheated sapphire from Tan instead with a lot of help from fellow PSers! I then had it set by Sally and here is a pic. I know it is like comparing apples and oranges, but I do also love that lavender/blue/grey colour and recently bought a lighter coloured 7mm sapphire like that from another PSer which I adore!

 

[Marlow]

Wow!!

I love the oval sapphire!! And the setting!! Well done!!

The round is beautiful too!

 

[distracts]

I'm not an advocate of pegging people, especially people I don't know,

I certainly recommend getting to know people fairly well before pegging them.

 

[Circe]

I'm not an advocate of pegging people, especially people I don't know,

I certainly recommend getting to know people fairly well before pegging them.

You just made me snort Diet Coke out of my nose. I HOPE YOU'RE PROUD, YOUNG LADY.

 

[FrekeChild]

I'm not an advocate of pegging people, especially people I don't know,

I certainly recommend getting to know people fairly well before pegging them.

You just made me snort Diet Coke out of my nose. I HOPE YOU'RE PROUD, YOUNG LADY.

LMAO!!!!

 

[Marlow]

I googled this word -

auah!!!

 

[pregcurious]

how about the stone in your display picture? it is red spinel right? is it mahenge or luc yen or some other spinel? A nice stone you got there looks like 'pure' red hue spinel

Thanks, Liao. It's as pure as I've seen in person, and very saturated. I bought it as Burmese, and based on the color, that is believable. When I got my AGL GemBrief, I opted not to get an origin report. It shifts slightly on both sides of the red spectrum (as all stone do), but it is undeniably red. Here are some additional pics, including one with fluor:

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/pics-of-my-3-favorite-stones.202360/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/pics-of-my-3-favorite-stones.202360/[/URL]

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/finally-some-decent-pics-of-red-spinel.169326/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/finally-some-decent-pics-of-red-spinel.169326/[/URL]

 

[pregcurious]

Absolutely, it's your choice not to do that.

 

[T L]

Thanks, Elvis.

I actually don't have issues with vendors doing what TL described, but I can see how you would not want to be accused of doing if that is not your practice. Isn't that how many diamonds are sold? A lot of sites advertise the same stones, with different prices. You can even find the same stone, based on the GIA report #. I think this works for diamonds because they are more of a commodity than colored stones. The issue, however, is that not all vendors are created the same, and some will have better customer service than others.

Marlow, what Luc Yen stone? Was it mentioned in this thread? I love Luc Yen spinels, but don't own one myself. I always think of Chrono's.

EDIT: Edited for clarity.

I look at it this way Pregcurious. As a vendor, your responsible for what you sell. To sell a stone from some one else's site without seeing it, & possibly not even telling them, to me is the height of unethical business practice. One, you don't even know how the stones performs in real life, hell, it might not even be the same stone. Secondly, I think it is a recipe to disaster, & those who practice doing this are bound to fall, sooner or later. If someone buys a stone for intent of selling, that is fine with me, but to piggyback on someone else's shoulders, is not. Know what I mean?

Well, the flippers I always knew had reputable sources, but yes, I get your point. A good return policy is also key, as I've been saying before. I know some flippers that are quite good at what they do and are successful at it. I rather buy from their sources though.

 

[Marlow]

TL - me too and that is the difference!!!!